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A statement regarding the fall of Sahtogas

Author
Zelarrs Elkoth
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#1 - 2013-08-27 00:46:47 UTC
We at Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris [PIE] are saddened by the fall of the longest held system in the so called Empyrean Faction Wars, and hold sympathy for those who must live under tribal rule until they once again be reclaimed. We would like to thank all who stood by us and the other residents to defend the system against the surprise offensive by an uncharacteristically coordinated Minmatar Militia. Heroism was displayed in abundance.

It is a wake up call to those of us that defend the greatest civilization the New Eden Cluster has ever known. The barbarians at the gates grow more sophisticated and we can not fail to meet this challenge, lest we plunge into a new dark age fueled by tribal obsessions of perceived past wrongs and the Federations hedonistic impulses lacking restraint and ethos.

To the conquering Minmatar: Although we continue to defend against this continuation of the Shakorite aggression that ushered in the Empyrean age, we do congratulate the accomplishment. "Good Fight", as they say.

We hope the sophistication you displayed is a sign of a new maturity within your culture and we can one day achieve a pax with your people, as your Ray of Matar once envisioned.

Until then... we work for your enlightenment, through scorch lenses if necessary.

Semper Pax & Amarr Resurget

Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris Captain, Head of Diplomacy, Recruiting Officer Contact on channel: "PIE Public" "I walk the razor's edge of embracing the future while protecting what we value of the past."

Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2013-08-27 01:26:13 UTC
Pretending to be the victim despite being the aggressor in nearly every case...seems familiar...oh yeah! The Republic do that all the time!

Seems that you two have more in common than you think.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!

Karmilla Strife
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#3 - 2013-08-27 08:25:56 UTC
When you tire of manufactured wars. A world of opportunities awaits you.
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#4 - 2013-08-27 09:53:49 UTC
Look, I have no particular stake in this war (I've made it clear many times that I consider the whole thing to be inconsequential) but come on. This kind of chest-beating forum swagger doesn't make you look like heroes, it makes you look like a pack of losers who are on the back foot and lashing out verbally so as to comfort their ego after the blow of a setback in space. I know I tend to snipe at the Amarr, and I regret doing so now because it opens me to the accusation of taking another cheap shot - you must accept my assurance that I'd be saying the same thing no matter who was posting a "well, you beat us, but WE'LL BE BACK" thread.

Suffer the setbacks and relish your victories both in dignified silence. This forum has enough unconstructive jingoistic vitriol flying around without you rattling the sabre over a kick in the balls.

Incidentally, the full list of conquests by the Minmatar militia within the last 48 hours runs to six systems: Sahtogas, Raa, Iesa, Oyeman, Tzvi and Sifilar. I find it interesting that you only deigned to mention a single one of those successful campaigns, let alone grace it with the description "uncharacteristically coordinated".

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Karmilla Strife
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#5 - 2013-08-27 09:56:18 UTC
Tzvi has a lovely Gallente run bakery. Nobody brags about conquering it, but everyone loves proper breakfast.
Eran Mintor
Metropolis Commercial Consortium
#6 - 2013-08-27 10:20:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Eran Mintor
I think he mentioned Sahtogas simply because it's the one Amarrian system in the 'warzone' that's remained an Amarr stronghold for almost the whole duration of the war, till now. It is signifigant for that fact alone it shows both a change in focus, and power of the Amarr militia.

With that said, Iesa is the headquarters of the Imperial Crusade forces and it would seem to me that is a greater loss than any one system besides tactically adventagous chokepoints...though I somewhat doubt it will have much effect on their forces.

The loss of Sahtogas has more meaning than you care to admit, Captain. Not sure why you want to downplay such an event; surely if you don't care, you can skip such a thread over and not burden it with your drivel.

-Eran
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#7 - 2013-08-27 10:39:06 UTC
well, obviously I do care about something here, otherwise I wouldn't have commented.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Eran Mintor
Metropolis Commercial Consortium
#8 - 2013-08-27 10:48:05 UTC
So then, enlighten us, what is it you care about in the context of this thread? Please don't say it's that you don't care...such logic might damage my implants.

-Eran
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-08-27 11:30:53 UTC
Oh, it's a shallow old motive barely worthy of explaining: Smack talk just annoys the crap out of me.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Eran Mintor
Metropolis Commercial Consortium
#10 - 2013-08-27 11:38:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Eran Mintor
Smack talk is annoying...perhaps that's why it's so effective!

-Eran
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#11 - 2013-08-27 11:46:42 UTC
Really? Effective? For or against whom?

If I were a Minmatar militia pilot right now my response would be "look at that puffed-up idiot preening about how they'll be back to get us and our little dog too just after we kicked their ass."

As a Caldari on the sidelines, I feel much the same way, substituting "we" for "they".

I doubt that contempt and ridicule are the intended effect. Though if they are then you're right, this smack talk is effective indeed.

The alternative is that it's the balm for a bruised ego, and to be perfectly frank if THIS is enough to restore morale, then PIE have crippling insecurity issues.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Eran Mintor
Metropolis Commercial Consortium
#12 - 2013-08-27 12:08:40 UTC
Egos are the enemy of smacktalk. I've never met a pilot without one (an ego), and while some smacktalk does a worse job than others, the end goal, I feel, is the same.

I'm sure I don't need to elaborate, you seem to be well-versed in the matter.

-Eran
Zelarrs Elkoth
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#13 - 2013-08-27 13:30:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Zelarrs Elkoth
Eran seems to understand well enough.

Mr. Stitcher, I am not sure why this is such a mystery to you. Or why it offends you so. Odd coming from one who I would count as a potential ally, with your standing in the respected Caldari State.

I posted largely to thank those who came out to defend (including some CalMil) and to spread a wake up call that we are facing a new threat. (Or at least new behavior and effectiveness from an old threat.)

Yes, several systems have fallen to this new offensive since Sahtogas. It would seem odd to come here and comment on each system lost or won as that happens frequently. Eran is correct as to the significance of this one.

It was not really intended as much to be "smacktalk". There is a grudging offer of a modicum of respect for what and how this happened, with a commitment to continue fighting. Pale smacktalk compared to what I have seen in the past.

Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris Captain, Head of Diplomacy, Recruiting Officer Contact on channel: "PIE Public" "I walk the razor's edge of embracing the future while protecting what we value of the past."

Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#14 - 2013-08-27 14:06:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Stitcher
Zelarrs Elkoth wrote:
Mr. Stitcher, I am not sure why this is such a mystery to you. Or why it offends you so. Odd coming from one who I would count as a potential ally, with your standing in the respected Caldari State.


Only somebody who didn't know the first thing about me would call me a "potential ally" of the Empire, pilot. I'll do you the courtesy of assuming that you're smart enough to do your own research into my politics. I've already expressed them all over this forum and don't feel the need to crap up yet another thread with the same debate.

I appreciate that the State is nominally allied with the Empire in the factional proxy war, but the State is a complex and often divided place where collectivist expedient business pragmatism often overrides individual personal feeling. I'm fortunate enough to suffer no such disparity.

No offense was taken, incidentally. The irritation I experience from this kind of behaviour is purely that which is felt by any onlooker who witnesses something stupid and buries their face in their hand. But it's ultimately none of my business how you go about crafting your public image, and if you wish to receive any further input on the subject from me then my consultancy services are available at the reasonable price of fifty million ISK per hour.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Zelarrs Elkoth
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#15 - 2013-08-27 14:26:33 UTC
Stitcher wrote:
Zelarrs Elkoth wrote:
Mr. Stitcher, I am not sure why this is such a mystery to you. Or why it offends you so. Odd coming from one who I would count as a potential ally, with your standing in the respected Caldari State.


Only somebody who didn't know the first thing about me would call me a "potential ally" of the Empire, pilot. I'll do you the courtesy of assuming that you're smart enough to do your own research into my politics. I've already expressed them all over this forum and don't feel the need to crap up yet another thread with the same debate.

I appreciate that the State is nominally allied with the Empire in the factional proxy war, but the State is a complex and often divided place where collectivist expedient business pragmatism often overrides individual personal feeling. I'm fortunate enough to suffer no such disparity.

No offense was taken, incidentally. The irritation I experience from this kind of behaviour is purely that which is felt by any onlooker who witnesses something stupid and buries their face in their hand. But it's ultimately none of my business how you go about crafting your public image, and if you wish to receive any further input on the subject from me then my consultancy services are available at the reasonable price of fifty million ISK per hour.


Ah I see. I am aware that the State is not universal in it's support of the alliance with the Empire. If you are opposed, then that explains much.

Thank you for clarifying, and I shall not concern myself with it further then.

Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris Captain, Head of Diplomacy, Recruiting Officer Contact on channel: "PIE Public" "I walk the razor's edge of embracing the future while protecting what we value of the past."

Anabella Rella
Gradient
Electus Matari
#16 - 2013-08-27 14:35:25 UTC
Stitcher wrote:
Really? Effective? For or against whom?

If I were a Minmatar militia pilot right now my response would be "look at that puffed-up idiot preening about how they'll be back to get us and our little dog too just after we kicked their ass."

As a Caldari on the sidelines, I feel much the same way, substituting "we" for "they".

I doubt that contempt and ridicule are the intended effect. Though if they are then you're right, this smack talk is effective indeed.

The alternative is that it's the balm for a bruised ego, and to be perfectly frank if THIS is enough to restore morale, then PIE have crippling insecurity issues.



This is quite correct Pilot Hakatain. These imperial "damning with faint praise while simultaneously insulting and playing the victim then, blaming us for not accepting peace on their terms"posts would be humorous if they weren't made in total sincerity.

If this is the kind of intellectualism that epitomizes "the greatest civilization the New Eden Cluster has ever known" then I'm extremely happy to continue fighting against becoming part of it.

When the world is running down, you make the best of what's still around.

Zelarrs Elkoth
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#17 - 2013-08-27 15:00:03 UTC
Anabella Rella wrote:
These imperial "damning with faint praise while simultaneously insulting and playing the victim then, blaming us for not accepting peace on their terms"posts would be humorous if they weren't made in total sincerity.

If this is the kind of intellectualism that epitomizes "the greatest civilization the New Eden Cluster has ever known" then I'm extremely happy to continue fighting against becoming part of it.


If it helps, I am not sure I was entirely sincere with the faint praise.

Then again, I do try to look for the best in people to a fault, and the coordination shown did give me a certain sense of hope.

Now if you could just coordinate a peace effort as well as was done with this offensive and abandon the war started by your current leadership, we might have a place to start.

Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris Captain, Head of Diplomacy, Recruiting Officer Contact on channel: "PIE Public" "I walk the razor's edge of embracing the future while protecting what we value of the past."

Valerie Valate
Church of The Crimson Saviour
#18 - 2013-08-27 16:42:07 UTC
Sahtogas never belonged to the Empire in the first place!

Doctor V. Valate, Professor of Archaeology at Kaztropolis Imperial University.

Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#19 - 2013-08-27 19:01:45 UTC
Zelarrs Elkoth wrote:
Ah I see. I am aware that the State is not universal in it's support of the alliance with the Empire. If you are opposed, then that explains much.

Thank you for clarifying, and I shall not concern myself with it further then.


Don't worry about making friends - all you have to do is satisfy your treaty obligations. Believe me, acting openly and in good faith will win hearts and minds more effectively than gestures of 'friendship'.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.

Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#20 - 2013-08-27 22:42:31 UTC
Aye. As firm a believer as I am in the power of a good argument, the entire point of the words is that they will hopefully inspire the deeds.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

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