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Best PvE Boat for L4 Gurista Missions

Author
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#21 - 2013-08-17 05:26:28 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
mach = poor choice, but maelstrom ain't a bad boat, interesting opinion.

mach is pretty good in caldari space, high speed, high agility, and a butt load of deepz. pretty good short/long range with autos/arty. I would expect near top times for blitzing guristas extra. as for The Assault, I've never tried but it looks like it would work. probably just throw on a kinetic hardener and a sensor booster, of course take the blitz. it probably does vengeance alright, I usually use a kronos or vindy with not so much tank. and works fine in worlds collide, although that is mostly dealing with serpentis. that is about all for kinetic missions.

if you don't want to go pimp, then raven/domi/geddon/phoon are probably the best choices.


Not a good idea to spend 3 bil+ on something not much faster than something that costs 500 mil. In Minmatar Space it would be WAY faster against angels than other ship.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it

Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#22 - 2013-08-17 08:01:58 UTC
Cipher Jones wrote:
Not a good idea to spend 3 bil+ on something not much faster than something that costs 500 mil. In Minmatar Space it would be WAY faster against angels than other ship.

I wouldn't spend more than about half that. plus as said, there are a lot of missions that aren't guristas in caldari space. is it the best single ship? hell if I know, but it wouldn't surprise me. CNR got a nice velocity boost, plus 1k pure dps, so maybe that. I don't see many other ships competing all that well, projection or damage type issues mainly.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#23 - 2013-08-17 12:48:14 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Cipher Jones wrote:
Not a good idea to spend 3 bil+ on something not much faster than something that costs 500 mil. In Minmatar Space it would be WAY faster against angels than other ship.

I wouldn't spend more than about half that. plus as said, there are a lot of missions that aren't guristas in caldari space. is it the best single ship? hell if I know, but it wouldn't surprise me. CNR got a nice velocity boost, plus 1k pure dps, so maybe that. I don't see many other ships competing all that well, projection or damage type issues mainly.


I run Mach as my main and RS and TFI as my backups, both RS and TFI are faster than the Mach at non Angel Missions, which is why RS was my first choice. If you don't put RF gyros and expensive shields on the Mach then its even slower. CNR wouldn't be bad either, but again both RS and Domi would beat it. The Nice thing about the CNR and SNI is extra slots for ECCM.

That's why RS is first choice IMHO, both drones and ECCM.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it

Vartan Sarkisian
Tannhauser C-Beam
Lux Collective
#24 - 2013-08-17 16:48:06 UTC
thanks for all the suggestions guys, excellent stuff.
Mavis O'Day
Total.
#25 - 2013-08-17 17:06:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Mavis O'Day
Let me add my two cents.

Best two ships vs Guristas are Raven Navy Issue and Scorpion Navy Issue. Because they have strong sensors (bye-bye both Typhoons). I've tried both and w/ Gravimetric Compensation skill @4 I'm getting jammed for one cycle per 2-3 jamming missions. It's rather acceptable, and also U can fit an auto-targeting system to SNI and grab some FoF missiles to go through. RNI doesn't have a spare high-slot, but as I've told, it doesn't happens really often.

Let me list the pluses and minuses of both ships:

RNI's advantages:

+ The heaviest volley damage - U one-shot anything except battleships and elite frigs (don't forget to target paint plain frigs
and some fast cruisers though);

+ Best pre-Golem damage application bcs of explosion radius bonus (and U don't want a Golem for Guristas due to it has
twice
weakers sensor and will find itself permajammed);

+ It is fast and agile (for a BS class ships ofc), smaller signature radius;

+ Extra 25 m3 in drone bay - grab 3 sentries and a pack of lights or all 3 types of lights for selectable dmg and a pack of
salvaging drones;

+ Best missile range, w/ Signal Amplifier, Sensor Booster and/or Electronic Superiority rig for distance, U can snipe for up to
204 km (I'm going for 130 km w/ one SigAmp, pretty enough for any mission to just sit and shoot);

+ Best missile travel time (11+ km/s missile speed);

RNI's disadvantages:

- A bit squishy on tank - hard to build an omnitanked fit, no prob w/ mission-specific resists though;

- No spare high slot - no ATS, no tractor, no drone link - prepare to equip an AB;

- Eats ammo a lot - the drawback for having best volley damage;

- Very tight on fitting bcs of 8 launchers- to build a decent fit w/o fitting implants U will need at least Ur Launcher Rigging
and Weapon Upgrades @4/5, I'm going for 5/5 even;

_______________________________________________________________________________________________

SNI's advantages:

+ Tough tank - hull resists do its job. Easy and cheap omnitank is real;

+ Spare high slot - fit an ATS/Tractor beam/Drone link/Salvager/NOS or whatever U want;

+ Extra mid slot - 'nuff said;

+ Like 80-100M cheaper than RNI;

+ Even higher sensor strength (+2 points comparing to RNI, so almost no jamming if U've bothered training GSC skill @4);

+ A bit better targeting capabilities (+2 extra targets lockable, slightly farther lock range w/o SeBo/SigAmp/ES rig);

+ Heaps of CPU and PG - U can almost fully T2-fit it;

SNI's disadvantages:

- Notably worse dmg application - two target painters are mandatory, the third won't hurt as well, Signature Focusing skill
becomes very helpfull;

- It's slow and clumsy comparing to Raven-class hulls;

- Notably slower locking;

- Less voley damage (=more volleys);

- Far less speedy missiles (along w/ prev point it means more volley counting);

- Lower missile range (no "true" sniping fits);

- Weaker capacitor comparing to RNI;

- Bigger signature radius means more incoming dmg;


My opinion: if U're good on supports and focused trained for missile boats (good missile supports, target painting skill subgroup, launcher rigging) - go for RNI, it will do the job faster. New players and cross-trainers will choose the SNI - it is basically Drake 2.0, the ship which would reliably allow U to grind Lvl 4s even if U're as low as 1.5-2M SP (Sounds crazy, but some of my newbie friends are doing it good and no wipes so far).
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#26 - 2013-08-17 18:54:34 UTC
Yeah, you still get jammed even if strength is over 200 though.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it

Silver Getsuga
Liber Primus
#27 - 2013-08-17 20:56:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Silver Getsuga
Big alpha (volley) is bad for killing NPCs who're not repping like crazy.

Take 2 ships. Ship 1 oneshots target but overshoots 25% of damage. Ship 2 doing same dps but can deliver 4 volleys in time Ship 1 delivers one. Ship 2 will kill target in 3 volleys and will start on next target 25% earlier (Ship 1 weapon's still cooling down).

Statistically you waste half of your volley damage on each ship.

So stop counting big alpha as plus for PVE.
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2013-08-17 21:16:55 UTC
Silver Getsuga wrote:
Big alpha (volley) is bad for killing NPCs who're not repping like crazy.

Take 2 ships. Ship 1 oneshots target but overshoots 25% of damage. Ship 2 doing same dps but can deliver 4 volleys in time Ship 1 delivers one. Ship 2 will kill target in 3 volleys and will start on next target 25% earlier (Ship 1 weapon's still cooling down).

Statistically you waste half of your volley damage on each ship.

So stop counting big alpha as plus for PVE.


High alpha weapon systems are best operated in multiple groups. Not that anyone bothers with more than 2 (except for killmail hunting).
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2013-08-17 21:23:14 UTC  |  Edited by: The Spod
The fleet phoon in my experience is faster than CNR because of the plain damage advantage and sentries killing jammers. My fit:
3 dda
4 cn bcu
3 rigor (ii/i)

fn omnitrack
drone link
1 sebo < scanres against ecm spawns, kill one and drones on other before jam

2 tank (pithum c invul, gist c booster)

+5 missile implants
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#30 - 2013-08-19 05:01:59 UTC
The Spod wrote:
The fleet phoon in my experience is faster than CNR because of the plain damage advantage and sentries killing jammers. My fit:
3 dda
4 cn bcu
3 rigor (ii/i)

fn omnitrack
drone link
1 sebo < scanres against ecm spawns, kill one and drones on other before jam

2 tank (pithum c invul, gist c booster)

+5 missile implants


I've been meaning to try the fleet phoon, my missile character recently finished minny bs 5 Bear

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Woodywilson
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#31 - 2013-08-20 16:57:10 UTC
Vartan Sarkisian wrote:
I will soon be doing level 4 Gurista Missions and I wonder what the best ship was to do them in?

I was killing Sansha so my Apoc was fine for that as the damage types matched and so I could breeze through the missions. But I understand that whilst against Gurista thermal damage (which lasers do) is an option the main damage to do against Gurista is Kinetic.

I used to do Level 4 in a Drake and they took forever so I am looking for a ship/weapon type that will do very good Kinetic damage so I can speed through the L4 missions, would it be better for a missile boat (Raven/Typhoon) or something with Hybrids like a Rokh, I imagine a Naga would be too "thin" on tank?

Any advice?



If you mean you're doing Gurista missions, I assume you're in Venal running them. A cheap boat for this type of nullsec missioning is a rail talos. 8 425s in the highs, a sensor booster with tracking range script, a MWD, and 2 large shield extenders in the mids. Low are 2 damage mods, 2 tracking mods, and a damage control. Learn which missions are blitzable and enjoy 80-100 mil isk/hr if you do it right, assuming you cash out LP at 2K a pop.
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