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Crime & Punishment

 
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Stubborn Alliances / Corporations

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Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2013-08-07 11:34:34 UTC
Jack Morrison wrote:
There must be something wrong in your wording. Some guys i decced paid before war went active, I ransomed battleships and even freighters. All in those few months i have been running wardecs. I would say about 10-20% pay their way out, but even then most are actually surprised you held your word and even thank you Shocked

Do you ask them before you start killing them?

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
#22 - 2013-08-07 11:35:31 UTC
I agree with the last posts here, that's more how I see it, might be beneficial for some to escape unharmed but it will provide more incentive for others to continue doing it. Plus I think some might still enjoy the fact to deny someone that ransom/kill, sorta like a small win rather than the loss of paying.

Basically you can see similar behavior in the market area too, especially loans and donations. If someone asks for a donation and get it, later they are pretty sure to ask again, except then double the sum. I know that one from experience.

/c

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Jack Morrison
Team Liquid crp.
#23 - 2013-08-07 11:37:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Jack Morrison
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Jack Morrison wrote:
There must be something wrong in your wording. Some guys i decced paid before war went active, I ransomed battleships and even freighters. All in those few months i have been running wardecs. I would say about 10-20% pay their way out, but even then most are actually surprised you held your word and even thank you Shocked

Do you ask them before you start killing them?


If the ship is worth ransoming, yes. All i dec get an offer to pay their way out. (mail sent after they get decced).
And once i find them in space I make sure they can't escape and we have a chat. Then it is either pay/explode.

Looking for a group to pew with ? Have a chat with me.
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#24 - 2013-08-07 13:09:52 UTC
As soon as you pay a ransom you become known as a ISK pinata, and everyone comes for you looking for ransom. No one wants to be known as an ISK pinata.

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The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2013-08-07 13:12:28 UTC
Docking rights is really not something you can hope to be meaningful enough to get. The plea of that random carrier would not reach that far and if would, it would be responded to by a possible kick for being tackled and wasting the time of leadership, or by internal naming and shaming.

If you manage to amuse someone enough through the member harassment you might get docking rights for that. Or as a teaching method for the new nullbears.

Isk ransom is no myth, but it's also handed mostly by veterans for encouragement and self entertainment. Flying a Ritfter increases your chances for getting ransom by a lot for the added nostalgia.
MacKael
Perkone
Caldari State
#26 - 2013-08-07 15:03:14 UTC
Never once heard of you in all the years that I've been playing. So your war decks must be weak. And as far as docking rights. NPC null will give them to you. If you can't figure that out out send me 5b and ill teach you.
Jorden Ishonen
Doomheim
#27 - 2013-08-07 15:13:47 UTC
Feledain wrote:
Because:
Why trust the guy who caused the problem in the first place?


Because if they caused the problem for money, giving them money fulfills their objective and they go away.

If they DON'T go away, name and shame them. Not for moral reason, but to ruin their business: if they have a reputation for not honoring ransoms, no one pays them anymore.

Not paying them doesn't mean you win. As the OP pointed out, she dissolves corps and they actually quit, when they could have just paid and been done with it. www.minerbumping.com is pretty much nothing but a series of these types of stories: sorry sod refuses to pay a pittance, gets blown up, loses far far more than what he would have paid.
tiberiusric
Comply Or Die
Pandemic Horde
#28 - 2013-08-07 15:16:16 UTC
Because people have learned not to trust anything anyone says. There's only a few people left that honour randsoms. Most just want to take your isk and kill. A lot prefer to self destruct knowing they get some insurance and secondly to stick the middle finger up to people like you who obviously is getting more frustrated by it. Now isn't that more satisfying?

All my views are my own - never be afraid to post with your main, unless you're going to post some dumb shit
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#29 - 2013-08-07 15:27:10 UTC
MacKael wrote:
Never once heard of you in all the years that I've been playing.

Yes you have. Send me 5 billion and I'll help you figure it out.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting
#30 - 2013-08-07 15:38:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Inxentas Ultramar
We operate in lowsec, but the tip of the iceberg may be active in hisec. The ISK requested to end wars is usually to high to worry about a few losses in hisec. Almost no war targets follow us into lowsec. Why pay for the safety of the 1% that doesn't keep track of wars and starts mining / hauling in hisec? That would be rewarding the stupidity of our own members. Ransoms are almost never honoured, statistically you are better off jettisoning everything you have and shooting the can. You can't lose more then everything you have on you anyway, but you can simply deny the pirate any loot. A KM is all you get. Deal with it. Cool
embrel
BamBam Inc.
#31 - 2013-08-07 15:44:42 UTC
Inxentas Ultramar wrote:
jettisoning everything you have and shooting the can. You can't lose more then everything you have on you anyway, but you can simply deny the pirate any loot. A KM is all you get. Deal with it. Cool


this seems bad form to me. Imagine NPC's copying that...
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#32 - 2013-08-07 16:18:16 UTC
Mostly, it's an expectation thing. Eve has reached the point where the e-assholes outnumber the e-villians. The e-villians can't get paid, because everyone thinks they are also e-assholes.

So really, ransom your nearest e-******* until he quits the game. It will improve life for all of us in New Eden. Think of the children.

Also, we don't pay ransoms, as far as I know. I'd probably help you kill the stupid ****** that got himself tackled under a wardec (just to balance out the kill board).

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
Spurty
#33 - 2013-08-07 16:30:58 UTC

Reality is that the average Player Stopped paying ransoms and they (ransomers) dried up a lot

Used to be every mission station had black mailers waiting on undock. Now there isn't

New way to get ISK is to just gank bling mission ships. All the talking is costing you isk in waiting around

Saying his however is like mentioning warp core stabs now have big negatives built in, but people still fit ships with 5 stabs anyway and die hilariously

Happily surprised you got any replies let alone success stories lol

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And wood ships,

And ships that sail the sea

But the best ships are Spaceships

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Jason13 Anzomi
#34 - 2013-08-07 16:55:39 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
I have been war deccing corporations and alliances for quite a few years now. My terms are usually pretty reasonable, fealty, isk and recently docking rights in a null station.

I have done a lot of damage to peoples playtime, apart from blowing up their ships, preventing them from undocking, missioning, ratting, caused quite a lot to disband from corporation and had a few quit the game in frustration.

But it seems no matter what I do its virtually impossible to convince even the most frightened and frustrated player to part with isk or negotiate a fair resolution to the conflict.

I think this stubborn mentality can be seen in similiar ransom situations (example carrier gets tackled and prefers to self destruct rather than pay a ransom even though the ransom might be worth 10% of ship and fittings).

Why do think EvE players are so stubborn they would rather lose totally than negotiate and lose a little bit?



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danegeld



Danegeld is the subject of a poem by Rudyard Kipling. It ends in the following words:[

It is wrong to put temptation in the path of any nation,
   For fear they should succumb and go astray;
So when you are requested to pay up or be molested,
   You will find it better policy to say: --

"We never pay any-one Dane-geld,
   No matter how trifling the cost;
For the end of that game is oppression and shame,
   And the nation that plays it is lost!"


Regardless of this being "just a game" or the fact that the game allows you to do it. The fact is that you're a thief and blackmailer. And I for one would never reward you for being a thief.

Blow up my ship? Fine.
Blow up my implants? Fine.
Take my honor by coercing me into paying you to stick a gun in my face? NEVER!
Sheldor Amouh
#35 - 2013-08-07 17:22:42 UTC
Because you may destroy my body (ship) but you cant touch my soul (ransom). I would, by far, rather take a beating than let anyone anywhere think they can intimidate me into anything.

Buzzards gotta eat, same as worms.
CCP Eterne
C C P
C C P Alliance
#36 - 2013-08-07 17:31:22 UTC
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Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#37 - 2013-08-07 17:45:39 UTC
As for war decced corps disbanding: For many corps that is their strategy: "If we get decced we all leave corp and make a new one". You are not so much forcing a disbanding as triggering plans already set in place.

As for people leaving: These are most likely people who were on the verge of quitting anyway. Most people who take up this game, or any game for that matter, quit after a short time.

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Mr Pragmatic
#38 - 2013-08-07 19:53:05 UTC
I lol when some space turd floating around demands isk.

Super cali hella yolo swaga dopeness.  -Yoloswaggins, in the fellowship of the bling.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#39 - 2013-08-07 20:01:08 UTC
Sheldor Amouh wrote:
Because you may destroy my body (ship) but you cant touch my soul (ransom). I would, by far, rather take a beating than let anyone anywhere think they can intimidate me into anything.

That's weird. I'm the opposite. If I had a valuable ship and it was tackled I'd gladly take the gamble that the person might let me keep it for half its price. Its logical.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Jason13 Anzomi
#40 - 2013-08-07 20:05:31 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Sheldor Amouh wrote:
Because you may destroy my body (ship) but you cant touch my soul (ransom). I would, by far, rather take a beating than let anyone anywhere think they can intimidate me into anything.

That's weird. I'm the opposite. If I had a valuable ship and it was tackled I'd gladly take the gamble that the person might let me keep it for half its price. Its logical.


And equally logical is that tomorrow he'll ransom you again since he knows that you'll pay up. And then again the next day.

And of course when he tells his buddies about how you'll pay up and they start jumping you to get their share.

To emphasise the point, people often quote two or more lines from "Dane Geld" by Rudyard Kipling as did Tony Parsons in The Daily Mirror, when criticising the Rome daily La Repubblica for writing "Ransom was paid and that is nothing to be ashamed of," in response to the announcement that the Italian government paid $1 million for the release of two hostages in Iraq in October 2004.


That if once you have paid him the Danegeld,
   You never get rid of the Dane.
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