Assembly Hall

Per the related discourse on cloaking over in F&I I propose that a delay be added to local in the realms of 30 second to 2 minutes to allow those who hunt miners/wt/mission runners an actual chance of catching these people before they can log off/warp to pos/dock/leave system. The current local channel reporting on those entering a system has long been a complaint of pvpers due to it heavily favouring the unfit or those with heavy static defences. A delay of a couple of minutes would balance the power between aggressor and defender greatly through facilitating the use of combat probes without alerting the victim instantly of hostile presence.

I could only agree with your proposal if hidden belts were indeed hidden again, requiring all ore prospecting belts to be scanned down.

I cant agree to this. It would provide the hunter an unfair advantage over the prey.

Remember, they are not looking to fight, even if you and I are...

So, in essence, you want to be able to warp into a system that your scout has found someone mining in, cloaked, and sitting on top of them, so then you can fleet warp to the scout and have the miner scrammed and DPS proceeding before he even knows someone else is in system?

Look man, I agree with you its annoying. I hunt these guys too. But that is not at all fair to them. Im also not assuming anything your not (like that they are in their home system, with an intel channel set up, and scouts on gate to be able to provide intel).

And if this were implemented, what would a simple miner have as a counter? DSCAN wont really work because it only works out to a certain range. He would be able to see your combat probes only in the event you needed to find him somewhere not listed in the probe scanner...

How, exactly, would this NOT be tipping the scales in your favor?

You could always go hunting in WH space....

Not at all.

If I were doing it, I would fly my scout in, check the belts one at a time, and warp the scout back out before the local timer expired. It would take a few times to get the belts, without more people scouting, but still mr. PVE is unawares anyone is there.

Im not defending the PvE guy... Im certainly not advocating he not fit for defense... Im also certainly advocating they shouldnt be restricted to flying a venture to be safe lmao...

Null has plenty of risks. Getting in, for one. I usually fly in lowsec, but last weekend made the mistake of jumping my exploration ship into null... and into a overlapping grid of interdiction spheres... you can imagine the rest

I will never say that the game should be a no-risk. But I dont think a change to local would do anything other than give guys like us an undue advantage.

The trick is to find a balance between the hunters and hunted....

30+ seconds is way to much time advantage for the hunters. I think 10 s is a reasonable amount, or alternatively, you don't appear in local until you break gate cloak (1 min max).

Both of these would help balance the field, but a ratter can always rat aligned, always warp in at a distance, and even use intel channels. This means the ratter sill has a major advantage to avoiding hunters.

Really though, ratters should be more accepting of losing their ships, with the rewards for ratting in nullsec increased enough that even with regular ship losses it is more profitable than running missions in highsec! Then you can make hunting ratters a bit more balanced without eliminating the herd.

Not just delay, local should be totally redesigned, shifting to the way it is implemented in w-space.
1) You are able to see only those who willingly manifested their presence.
2) You can see any member of your corp or ally.
3) Others aren't present in local, but there is an UNKNOWN VESSEL SIGNATURE counter, which displays approximate number of other ships (like, neutrals or minuses to you) in the system
3) If your fellow corpsmate/allied pilot encounters someone neutral/hostile to your corp/ally, this one added to the local chat with "expiration timer" of sort (displays how much time has passed from last encounter and deletes it from local after, say, 10 minutes). Under "encounters" I mean he was able to observe it for some time, like one second or two (that will mitigate current game mechanic's drawback, that forces covert ops vessels to recloack after entering the system)

The way local works in high,low and null has been since EVE came out. Funny how it took a decade of the game for the constant whiners to start requesting how "local should be removed".

Did you even read your own whine where I quoted you? You specifically mentioned how the PREDATOR has no chance to catch the PREY, IF the prey is situationally aware.

Besides, the fact that null-sec mining is safer than high-sec is player defined and influenced problem. CCP has said it many times they'll stay out of player based actions. Why would they intervene in your favour? Because you took the time and whined like a little b1tch on the forums?

Please, cry more.

Looking at the killboards of blown up ratters and miners in nullsec, it seems to require quite a lot. Every day.

So, since your environment you are in is so flawlessly empty and devoid of hostiles, you either presume or assume its the same in all other nullsec regions.

No opinion on the statistics? How about facts? If you fail to observe that, you're talking out of your ass.

And yeah, certain people can't simply have an eye out on local/intel channels and warp to a safespot when a (potential) hostile enters their system/pocket. Greed and ignorance are by far the two tools that have served the agressors with a fully sized meal so many times.

Actually, pilots are killed in their home systems all the time. Welcome to a game, that isn't bug free. When you're 25km away from any asteroid and your ship fails to enter warp, because it's seemingly stuck on space dust, you lose those precious 12 seconds that it takes for a cloaky hotdropper to get to you and light a cyno. We all know how the procedure goes from there. Then there's lack of focus, RL factors (neighbour wants to borrow 2 cups of sugar, telephones, tv, etc) and some annoying game mechanics that prevent you from warping until you click that stupid "OK" button (example during Alliance Tournament).
I would agree it's mostly to pilot error, but you have that in PvP as well. You can play "If" game all you want.

All the cloaked pilot ever does is take advantage of stupidity, ignorance or lack of focus. Why should it be any different? The game itself punishes you for the mistakes you do, why would 90% of EVE's players have another advantage over us industrialists? Isn't it enough that our ships are lacking agility, sublight speeds, manuverability, thickness of defenses and lack of offensive/utility modules?
Let's make this an insta-gib game. Industrialists have 1hp, everything else has 5-10hp. I'm sure everyone would agree on that, since it's totally fair.

Go look at the forums. Go look at killboards. The industrialists are the single most singled out target for all the "PvP pr0 players" of EVE. Who, by the way, don't go flying around looking for skilled and experienced pilots in ship fits that match their skillpoint effective margins. No, the preying on the weak, defensless and non-offensive targets is the main focus.

How many people out of 100 new players - BRAND new, we're not talking about people drawn into the game by their friends to bolster their fleets or alts of people; How many of those 100 players are not taking the "I'm gonna kill anything that can't shoot back" way to trying to be a recognizable pilot and fame assorted with that? 99% of PvP pilots already thinks Industry branches are boring and how PvP is the only adrenaline-filled enjoyable part of the game.
That and seemingly popular way to grief other players to the maximum. Because the game allows it.

In the end, a lot of people will agree, that changing the way local works would be a good idea. But not without game breaking changes to some other mechanics that local currently is a part of.

In other words, making a delay to local without much consideration is like making sure the zebra is blind, deaf and can't run more than 5 feet without a heart-attack so the lioness has an easier job.

And that's what this silly proposal stems from. Whiny little b1tch3z who need additional tools and powers to get that kill.