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Logi for FW
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Lee Hyo-Ri
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-07-27 14:48:37 UTC
Thinking about going towards logi training. How badly do fw corps need fleet logi?
Machiavelli's Nemesis
Angry Mustellid
#2 - 2013-07-27 16:24:56 UTC
A good logi pilot is worth his weight in bacon.

You can never have too many augorors on field
Lee Hyo-Ri
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-07-28 04:39:31 UTC
hmmm well i do like bacon..
Pannax Ni
Pinch n' Plex
#4 - 2013-07-28 11:08:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Pannax Ni
Machiavelli's Nemesis wrote:
A good logi pilot is worth his weight in bacon.


I'm stealing that, holy moly batman! That's an awesome metaphor / analogy (Not a native english speaker)

As for Logi in FW.

Been doing FW for 6 months now, and can tell you that good logi pilots are THE most important factor after FC, be it a 5-10-50 man fight. Logibros best bros better than the rest bros.

Both frigate and cruiser logi are more than welcome, nay, rather WANTED to join any fleet.

Say you have 10v10 frigates, the ones with Logi WILL win 9/10 times.
Roxxo I'doCocaine
Doomheim
#5 - 2013-07-28 12:13:28 UTC
Just to be clear, we are talking about T1 logistics, not T2 Logistics ships?
Morgan Torry
Arma Purgatorium
#6 - 2013-07-28 12:44:31 UTC
Both are needed direly by all sides. T1 logis obviously are the most common (both frig and cruiser), though T2 are needed from time to time...especially if a side wants to field T2 cruisers/BS's.

Arma Purgatorium - What is Podded May Never Die
kraiklyn Asatru
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2013-07-28 22:39:57 UTC
Pannax Ni wrote:
Machiavelli's Nemesis wrote:
A good logi pilot is worth his weight in bacon.


I'm stealing that, holy moly batman! That's an awesome metaphor / analogy (Not a native english speaker)

As for Logi in FW.

Been doing FW for 6 months now, and can tell you that good logi pilots are THE most important factor after FC, be it a 5-10-50 man fight. Logibros best bros better than the rest bros.

Both frigate and cruiser logi are more than welcome, nay, rather WANTED to join any fleet.

Say you have 10v10 frigates, the ones with Logi WILL win 9/10 times.



Truth, and I am saying that as a member of a corp that doesn't do logi :)

<3 fweddit I miss you bastards
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome
#8 - 2013-07-29 01:13:23 UTC
Depends on the faction and their commonly used fleet comps.

What I have noticed is In smaller cruiser gangs where everyone is running armour tanks, logi is great.
You will be very valuable to these fleets.
The logi has time to get reps on before too much of your main tank is eaten into.

The Gallente have this working very well.
They can broadcast reps when they see their shield being hit and this buys them a small time advantage before their main tank is eaten into. That extra few seconds seem to really make a lot of difference to the outcome of an engagement.

A few times I have been in fleets when Caldari have tried shield logi set ups and it really hasn't worked out.
By the time you broadcast for reps and they are applied a lot of the time you are already as good as dead.

If I look at many battles we have won and lost it seems ECM and Damps are more valuable in shield fleets to counter the logi than using logi to counter logi.

In a cruiser fight - I would rather have more Black Birds on field jamming enemy reps than Ospreys repping me but then again - I'm crap at logi so maybe it's just that ECM suits what we do better.


https://soundcloud.com/ibanezlaney
Pannax Ni
Pinch n' Plex
#9 - 2013-07-29 11:03:29 UTC
IbanezLaney wrote:

They can broadcast reps when they see their shield being hit


Broadcasting for reps should be done as soon as you see the entire enemy gang yellowbox you.

It should also be mappped to a keyboard shortcut.
JAF Anders
Adenosine Inhibition
#10 - 2013-07-29 18:42:24 UTC
IbanezLaney wrote:
Depends on the faction and their commonly used fleet comps.

What I have noticed is In smaller cruiser gangs where everyone is running armour tanks, logi is great.
You will be very valuable to these fleets.
The logi has time to get reps on before too much of your main tank is eaten into.

The Gallente have this working very well.
They can broadcast reps when they see their shield being hit and this buys them a small time advantage before their main tank is eaten into. That extra few seconds seem to really make a lot of difference to the outcome of an engagement.

A few times I have been in fleets when Caldari have tried shield logi set ups and it really hasn't worked out.
By the time you broadcast for reps and they are applied a lot of the time you are already as good as dead.




Remember that Armor reps land at the end of the cycle whereas Shield reps land at the beginning, and that once the shields go down once and you remain targeted, the early-warning system is gone.

Food for thought.

The pursuit of excellence and stabbed plexing alts.
Lee Hyo-Ri
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2013-07-29 20:28:49 UTC
I've done logi in guardians in incursions in a prior lifetime. would fleet combat be very similar or more intensive because of the more unpredictable human component of target calling and immediate response?
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome
#12 - 2013-07-30 03:27:40 UTC
JAF Anders wrote:
IbanezLaney wrote:
Depends on the faction and their commonly used fleet comps.

What I have noticed is In smaller cruiser gangs where everyone is running armour tanks, logi is great.
You will be very valuable to these fleets.
The logi has time to get reps on before too much of your main tank is eaten into.

The Gallente have this working very well.
They can broadcast reps when they see their shield being hit and this buys them a small time advantage before their main tank is eaten into. That extra few seconds seem to really make a lot of difference to the outcome of an engagement.

A few times I have been in fleets when Caldari have tried shield logi set ups and it really hasn't worked out.
By the time you broadcast for reps and they are applied a lot of the time you are already as good as dead.




Remember that Armor reps land at the end of the cycle whereas Shield reps land at the beginning, and that once the shields go down once and you remain targeted, the early-warning system is gone.

Food for thought.


Good point.

Someone above mentioned adding broadcast as a keyboard shortcut - that is a great idea and might really help buy a second or two for most people in the cluster fck of windows eve is.

We really need to get more experience using logi.
The Gallente have more experienced logi pilots too which really makes their effectiveness stand out.

Hopefully in time we can get it to flow - will be a few dead ospreys while we get it going but might be worth derping some isk to get decent at it.


Till then I'll keep saying - JAM THEIR LOGI BRO. Big smile

https://soundcloud.com/ibanezlaney
Morgan Torry
Arma Purgatorium
#13 - 2013-07-30 12:20:12 UTC
Lee Hyo-Ri wrote:
I've done logi in guardians in incursions in a prior lifetime. would fleet combat be very similar or more intensive because of the more unpredictable human component of target calling and immediate response?


Will using a ship for PvP differ from using it in a PvE environment? Of course. Logi'ing in a PvP scenario is true logistics. Not everyone broadcasts as well as in most incursion sites and half the time you find yourself EWAR/primaried. You also learn to use and value the watchlist for your logibros and known FCs/leaders in your fleet. You also learn how to react to damps, ECM, etc.. when cap chaining. So much more intensive and individually demanding in a PvP scenario....like any other vessel.

Arma Purgatorium - What is Podded May Never Die
Cal Stantson
17eme Chasseurs a Cheval
#14 - 2013-07-30 13:13:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Cal Stantson
IbanezLaney wrote:
Depends on the faction and their commonly used fleet comps.

What I have noticed is In smaller cruiser gangs where everyone is running armour tanks, logi is great.
You will be very valuable to these fleets.
The logi has time to get reps on before too much of your main tank is eaten into.

The Gallente have this working very well.
They can broadcast reps when they see their shield being hit and this buys them a small time advantage before their main tank is eaten into. That extra few seconds seem to really make a lot of difference to the outcome of an engagement.

A few times I have been in fleets when Caldari have tried shield logi set ups and it really hasn't worked out.
By the time you broadcast for reps and they are applied a lot of the time you are already as good as dead.

If I look at many battles we have won and lost it seems ECM and Damps are more valuable in shield fleets to counter the logi than using logi to counter logi.

In a cruiser fight - I would rather have more Black Birds on field jamming enemy reps than Ospreys repping me but then again - I'm crap at logi so maybe it's just that ECM suits what we do better.


The flaw in your reasoning is that you attribute your failure to the "shield logi" part rather than the "Caldari" part. Plenty of people run shield cruisers just fine.
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome
#15 - 2013-07-30 23:17:58 UTC
Cal Stantson wrote:
IbanezLaney wrote:
Depends on the faction and their commonly used fleet comps.

What I have noticed is In smaller cruiser gangs where everyone is running armour tanks, logi is great.
You will be very valuable to these fleets.
The logi has time to get reps on before too much of your main tank is eaten into.

The Gallente have this working very well.
They can broadcast reps when they see their shield being hit and this buys them a small time advantage before their main tank is eaten into. That extra few seconds seem to really make a lot of difference to the outcome of an engagement.

A few times I have been in fleets when Caldari have tried shield logi set ups and it really hasn't worked out.
By the time you broadcast for reps and they are applied a lot of the time you are already as good as dead.

If I look at many battles we have won and lost it seems ECM and Damps are more valuable in shield fleets to counter the logi than using logi to counter logi.

In a cruiser fight - I would rather have more Black Birds on field jamming enemy reps than Ospreys repping me but then again - I'm crap at logi so maybe it's just that ECM suits what we do better.


The flaw in your reasoning is that you attribute your failure to the "shield logi" part rather than the "Caldari" part. Plenty of people run shield cruisers just fine.



Crashing a FW plex and setting the Logi up when the enemy are already set up in the FW plex is not that easy.

https://soundcloud.com/ibanezlaney
Pannax Ni
Pinch n' Plex
#16 - 2013-08-01 22:15:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Pannax Ni
IbanezLaney wrote:
Crashing a FW plex and setting the Logi up when the enemy are already set up in the FW plex is not that easy.

If they got in first, they took the advantage, and taking said advantage away shouldn't be easy.
That statement adds nothing to the discussion.
Taoist Dragon
Okata Syndicate
#17 - 2013-08-01 23:06:50 UTC
Pannax Ni wrote:
IbanezLaney wrote:
Crashing a FW plex and setting the Logi up when the enemy are already set up in the FW plex is not that easy.

If they got in first, they took the advantage, and taking said advantage away shouldn't be easy.
That statement adds nothing to the discussion.


What it does point out is that logi is easier for defending fleets than offensive fleets thats all. The op can then make an informed decision on weather they want to sepc for logi or not (initially anyways) based on how their fleets are generally operating.

That is the Way, the Tao.

Balance is everything.
Bad Messenger
Rehabilitation Clinic
#18 - 2013-08-01 23:07:50 UTC
logi is always way to make sure enemy bring enough numbers to win your reps, so good way to get blobbed every time.
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome
#19 - 2013-08-02 01:32:53 UTC
Pannax Ni wrote:
IbanezLaney wrote:
Crashing a FW plex and setting the Logi up when the enemy are already set up in the FW plex is not that easy.

If they got in first, they took the advantage, and taking said advantage away shouldn't be easy.
That statement adds nothing to the discussion.



And your post was some sort of brilliant and insightful piece of information that no one knew ???

Big smileBig smileBig smile

Gee - thanks for adding sooo much to the discussion.

https://soundcloud.com/ibanezlaney
Zen Guerrilla
CTRL-Q
#20 - 2013-08-02 14:05:59 UTC
T1 logi is awesome. It's much easier to get into them, they're affordable, people actually fly them, even the logi frigates have one drone to properly whore on killmails, the only thing one could complain about is that they might actually be too good considering the huge impact they have.

Also, T1 logi brought alot of new tactics and viable gang compositions into FW and it's been lots of fun. We had some really, really awesome fights since T1 logi got introduced.

pew pew
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