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Words.... What are these words?

Author
Inokuma Yawara
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-07-29 09:02:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Inokuma Yawara
"TIDI" (or TlDl ("L" instead of 'i')). What is that?

"Whelping." What is that?

I did not find these words in the glossary. I've seen them used a lot but I couldn't get the inference.

Watch this space.  New exciting signature in development.

Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#2 - 2013-07-29 09:11:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Steve Ronuken
TiDi:

Time Dilation. Where the physics simulation is deliberately slowed down, to give the server a chance to keep up, to have several thousand people all acting in the same system, in a fair manner. at 10% TiDi, a module that used to cycle in 3 seconds takes 30 seconds. It's not perfect, but it's a lot better than it used to be.


Whelping: Take a fleet. Lose a fleet. You may achieve your goal, but survival wasn't important.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter

Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-07-29 09:12:09 UTC
TiDi = Time Dilation. It's a feature that allows a node that's under heavy load to slow time in the system(s), to a minimum of 10% to try to avoid lag. Under time dilation, anything occurring in the affected systems runs slower than real time, if a module cycles normally in 30 seconds, under 10% TiDi it would take 300 seconds (5 minutes) to cycle.

Idea is to allow the server more time to process operations and to try and avoid crippling lag that has inconsistent effects.
Inokuma Yawara
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-07-29 11:11:15 UTC
Thanks a lot. I appreciate your replies. I didn't know what answers I was gonna get, but even so, I was surprised by the answers. I thought EVE could handle a crap ton of players at once..... Ah, yes. It can with TiDi. It makes sense.

But whelp took me by surprise. Seriously? Sacrifice a whole fleet for a win? That is what they call a pyrrhic victory. That's no victory at all.

Watch this space.  New exciting signature in development.

Zanzbar
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-07-29 11:19:13 UTC
Inokuma Yawara wrote:


But whelp took me by surprise. Seriously? Sacrifice a whole fleet for a win? That is what they call a pyrrhic victory. That's no victory at all.


when your soldiers are not imortal and using insured equipment sure, but thats not the case here.
Disastro
Wrecking Shots
#6 - 2013-07-29 11:31:05 UTC
Inokuma Yawara wrote:
"TIDI" (or TlDl ("L" instead of 'i')). What is that?

"Whelping." What is that?

I did not find these words in the glossary. I've seen them used a lot but I couldn't get the inference.


Eve Online players used to experience extreme lag when entering systems where many players were present, by encountering many other players on grid or on your overview, or whenever players from goonswarm made an ahh chain. CCP has fixed this condition by renaming it time dilation.

Marc Callan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2013-07-29 11:42:49 UTC
Actually, it's a bit more sophisticated, I think; the old problem with lag was that the server ran time normally, but input lag was so bad that people ended up getting slaughtered in between the time they sent a command and the time the command was received and acted upon. TiDi basically stretches out combat so that input lag doesn't make it impossible to react to a situation.

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." - Kurt Vonnegurt

Nox Solitudo
That Random Worker Ant Colony
#8 - 2013-07-29 11:45:21 UTC
Inokuma Yawara wrote:
Thanks a lot. I appreciate your replies. I didn't know what answers I was gonna get, but even so, I was surprised by the answers. I thought EVE could handle a crap ton of players at once..... Ah, yes. It can with TiDi. It makes sense.

But whelp took me by surprise. Seriously? Sacrifice a whole fleet for a win? That is what they call a pyrrhic victory. That's no victory at all.


My first welpfleet was a group of T1 frigates with cheap fits going on a trip through nullsec. We have destroyed battlecruisers and even some T2 cruisers; the total amount of ISK we've destroyed far exceeded the price of our ships.

A ship is a tool, it's not your character, it's not your soul. You are supposed to use it, and if that means you are going to lose it while achieving your goal, then why not? You can buy a new one very easily.

It's the same as suicide ganking. Grab a catalyst, fit it with as cheap stuff as possible and few rounds of faction ammo, go to a belt, attack and destroy a mining barge, watch CONCORD comes and destroys your ship, enjoy poor miner's tears - you have just destroyed a ship worth of several times of your loss.

The only way how to not lose a ship at all is to never undock...
Zanzbar
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2013-07-29 12:17:36 UTC
Marc Callan wrote:
Actually, it's a bit more sophisticated, I think; the old problem with lag was that the server ran time normally, but input lag was so bad that people ended up getting slaughtered in between the time they sent a command and the time the command was received and acted upon. TiDi basically stretches out combat so that input lag doesn't make it impossible to react to a situation.



this

tidi slows time down so that the server has time to process everones requests rather then responding to them late or even not at all.
Inokuma Yawara
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2013-07-29 12:19:51 UTC
Zanzbar wrote:
Inokuma Yawara wrote:


But whelp took me by surprise. Seriously? Sacrifice a whole fleet for a win? That is what they call a pyrrhic victory. That's no victory at all.


when your soldiers are not imortal and using insured equipment sure, but thats not the case here.


Nox Solitudo wrote:
Inokuma Yawara wrote:
Thanks a lot. I appreciate your replies. I didn't know what answers I was gonna get, but even so, I was surprised by the answers. I thought EVE could handle a crap ton of players at once..... Ah, yes. It can with TiDi. It makes sense.

But whelp took me by surprise. Seriously? Sacrifice a whole fleet for a win? That is what they call a pyrrhic victory. That's no victory at all.


My first welpfleet was a group of T1 frigates with cheap fits going on a trip through nullsec. We have destroyed battlecruisers and even some T2 cruisers; the total amount of ISK we've destroyed far exceeded the price of our ships.

A ship is a tool, it's not your character, it's not your soul. You are supposed to use it, and if that means you are going to lose it while achieving your goal, then why not? You can buy a new one very easily.

It's the same as suicide ganking. Grab a catalyst, fit it with as cheap stuff as possible and few rounds of faction ammo, go to a belt, attack and destroy a mining barge, watch CONCORD comes and destroys your ship, enjoy poor miner's tears - you have just destroyed a ship worth of several times of your loss.

The only way how to not lose a ship at all is to never undock...


Oh, yeah. I forgot that this is a game..... It's O.K. to have pyrrhic victories around here.

Watch this space.  New exciting signature in development.

Gaellia Bonaventure
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2013-07-29 17:11:43 UTC
Inokuma Yawara wrote:

But whelp took me by surprise. Seriously? Sacrifice a whole fleet for a win? That is what they call a pyrrhic victory. That's no victory at all.


That is EVE in a nutshell. The whole game is one big "whelp" when the doctrine is "fly only what you can afford to lose."


Bring your possibles.

Nerath Naaris
Pink Winged Unicorns for Peace Love and Anarchy
#12 - 2013-07-29 17:55:10 UTC
TIDI: Basically lag being turned into a feature! Sad

Though in all fairness, it´s one of the better ideas CCP has come up with.
People will nowadays complain about half an hour of warping and what-not but there were once reports of whole fleets jumping into a system, blackscreening for 30 minutes and finally loading into their clone station.... (the lagging of old aways favored the defender of a starsystem and of course that got abused as well, Eve being Eve and actually a lot less civilized than today).

Je suis Paris // Köln // Brüssel // Orlando // Nice // Würzburg, München, Ansbach // Saint-Étienne-du-Rouvray

Je suis Berlin // Fort Lauderdale // London // St. Petersburg // Stockholm

Je suis [?]

Inokuma Yawara
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2013-07-29 18:00:07 UTC
Nerath Naaris wrote:
TIDI: Basically lag being turned into a feature! Sad

... Eve being Eve and actually a lot less civilized than today).


EVE was less civilized? Shocked

Watch this space.  New exciting signature in development.

Kalanaja
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2013-07-29 18:47:22 UTC
Yes. It used to be literally dog eat dog. It's actually gotten less barbaric.
Eliana Eros
Sentinel Event
Hatakani Trade Winds Combine
#15 - 2013-07-29 19:04:27 UTC
Nox Solitudo wrote:
Inokuma Yawara wrote:
Thanks a lot. I appreciate your replies. I didn't know what answers I was gonna get, but even so, I was surprised by the answers. I thought EVE could handle a crap ton of players at once..... Ah, yes. It can with TiDi. It makes sense.

But whelp took me by surprise. Seriously? Sacrifice a whole fleet for a win? That is what they call a pyrrhic victory. That's no victory at all.


My first welpfleet was a group of T1 frigates with cheap fits going on a trip through nullsec. We have destroyed battlecruisers and even some T2 cruisers; the total amount of ISK we've destroyed far exceeded the price of our ships.

A ship is a tool, it's not your character, it's not your soul. You are supposed to use it, and if that means you are going to lose it while achieving your goal, then why not? You can buy a new one very easily.

It's the same as suicide ganking. Grab a catalyst, fit it with as cheap stuff as possible and few rounds of faction ammo, go to a belt, attack and destroy a mining barge, watch CONCORD comes and destroys your ship, enjoy poor miner's tears - you have just destroyed a ship worth of several times of your loss.

The only way how to not lose a ship at all is to never undock...


Actually, if your drunk you could mistakenly reprocess your ship, thus destroying it.

♥'s and Glomps for everyone...well almost everyone.

Ze Goggles

Praxis Ginimic
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2013-07-29 19:22:28 UTC
Is that why your portrait looks so sad?
Inokuma Yawara
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2013-07-30 00:01:39 UTC
O.K. What about this phrase.

"... their "meta game"... What is "meta game"?

Watch this space.  New exciting signature in development.

Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#18 - 2013-07-30 09:02:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Steve Ronuken
Inokuma Yawara wrote:
O.K. What about this phrase.

"... their "meta game"... What is "meta game"?



Meta game: Anything that happens that's not directly blowing up spaceships. Basically. Covers politics and skulduggery (A word I don't get to use enough)



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metagaming

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter

Max Godsnottlingson
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2013-07-30 09:33:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Max Godsnottlingson
Inokuma Yawara wrote:
Thanks a lot. I appreciate your replies. I didn't know what answers I was gonna get, but even so, I was surprised by the answers. I thought EVE could handle a crap ton of players at once..... Ah, yes. It can with TiDi. It makes sense.

But whelp took me by surprise. Seriously? Sacrifice a whole fleet for a win? That is what they call a pyrrhic victory. That's no victory at all.


When you manage to kill a Titan and a Mother Ship, loosing a fleet is still good strategic win. That fleet can be back up and running again in less then 30 mins, the titan will need the best part of a month to rebuild
Max Godsnottlingson
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#20 - 2013-07-30 09:40:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Max Godsnottlingson
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Inokuma Yawara wrote:
O.K. What about this phrase.

"... their "meta game"... What is "meta game"?



Meta game: Anything that happens that's not directly blowing up spaceships. Basically. Covers politics and skulduggery (A word I don't get to use enough)



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metagaming


I don't think I agree with that. I have always defined Meta gaming as being when you use out of game resources to give you an advantage.

An example of Meta gaming being the 'Log In trap'. Even AFK play, no matter what it is can be viewed as a form of Metagaming as the player is effecting the game in some way without actually being there

The Log In trap being when you catch a loe on his own, you warp in to engage him, suddenly to se all his mates appear in system and insta warp in. They had all previously logged off and were waiting for the 'bait' ship to give the 'call' on Team Speak or the like

Wikipedia Quote

"Metagaming is a broad term usually used to define any strategy, action or method used in a game which transcends a prescribed ruleset, uses external factors to affect the game, or goes beyond the supposed limits or environment set by the game. Another definition refers to the game universe outside of the game itself.
In simple terms, it is the use of out-of-game information or resources to affect one's in-game decisions."

You could also describe actions such as 'Bumping' to stop a ship from warping and even Jetcan mining as Meta gaming as they use game machanics in a way not originally intended.
There is a very fine line between this form of Metagaming and Exploitation and as fast as you get one person arguing one way, you will have another arguing the other way

Oh, one last thing. Guys, I have only picked the examples as I have as they were the first thing off the top of my head, let's not get into a 'debate' as to the rights and wrongs of using them, there are more then enough posts covering them.
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