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Crime & Punishment

 
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Naming and Shaming - Saji'us does not honor ransoms
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Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#1 - 2013-07-27 17:46:46 UTC
Pay attention in Lowsec Data/Relic sites, he waits in a dual-scram bomber.


Nice catch,

fool not to honor the ransom.
Marianne Pollard
Doomheim
#2 - 2013-07-27 17:56:02 UTC
Syrias Bizniz wrote:


fool to pay the ransom.



Fixed. Error highlighted.

Mocking the afflicted since 2013.
Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#3 - 2013-07-27 18:02:09 UTC
One might argue, however you either ask for ransom and get paid, then you bugger off, else you get ... posted on the forums and the 'smart' guys will check if you're legit (lol) or not.
Tah'ris Khlador
Space Ghosts.
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#4 - 2013-07-27 19:26:41 UTC
Confirming people have the time to check google and the forums if their neighborhood pirate is "honorable" whilst their ship is sitting in structure.

Member of the Pink Pony Killboard Padding Alliance
Tara Read
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#5 - 2013-07-27 19:32:00 UTC
Syrias Bizniz wrote:
Pay attention in Lowsec Data/Relic sites, he waits in a dual-scram bomber.


Nice catch,

fool not to honor the ransom.




I agree. There needs to be a list of those who do not honor ransoms. They hurt the business for the rest of us.
Tah'ris Khlador
Space Ghosts.
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#6 - 2013-07-27 20:35:36 UTC
Tara Read wrote:
Syrias Bizniz wrote:
Pay attention in Lowsec Data/Relic sites, he waits in a dual-scram bomber.


Nice catch,

fool not to honor the ransom.




I agree. There needs to be a list of those who do not honor ransoms. They hurt the business for the rest of us.


I volunteer as tribute...er...to be named on your list!

Member of the Pink Pony Killboard Padding Alliance
Donbe Scurred
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2013-07-27 22:00:58 UTC
Guess, those warp stabs didn't help. Maybe try two overdrives next time, SBs are pretty slow.

Also, ha ha you paid.
Donbe Scurred
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-07-27 22:01:47 UTC
Tara Read wrote:
Syrias Bizniz wrote:
Pay attention in Lowsec Data/Relic sites, he waits in a dual-scram bomber.


Nice catch,

fool not to honor the ransom.




I agree. There needs to be a list of those who do not honor ransoms. They hurt the business for the rest of us.


Maybe a list of people who do, seems it would be easier to manage.
Isaac Collins
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-07-28 11:03:09 UTC
I'd be it would have more to do with how good a mood a pirate is in to honor a ransom. Consider it like salvaging. There's an X percentage after using Ransom Payout that you won't get killed. Some odds are better then No odds.
Jorden Ishonen
Doomheim
#10 - 2013-07-28 11:32:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Jorden Ishonen
Marianne Pollard wrote:
Syrias Bizniz wrote:


fool to pay the ransom.



Fixed. Error highlighted.



Some pirates honour ransoms, some don't. Good to know which one has a gun pointed at you.

Tah'ris Khlador wrote:
Confirming people have the time to check google and the forums if their neighborhood pirate is "honorable" whilst their ship is sitting in structure.


It takes seconds to do a forum search. If the pirate can't wait that long for his prey to verify that the ransom will be honoured, chances are he wouldn't have honoured the ransom anyways.

Believe it or not, there are some pirates who do like to try to make a living off of, you know, piracy.
Tah'ris Khlador
Space Ghosts.
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#11 - 2013-07-28 13:52:35 UTC
Jorden Ishonen wrote:
It takes seconds to do a forum search. If the pirate can't wait that long for his prey to verify that the ransom will be honored, chances are he wouldn't have honored the ransom anyways.

Believe it or not, there are some pirates who do like to try to make a living off of, you know, piracy.


More likely the pirate will expect the panicking victim to be calling in help and stalling rather than looking up the "ransom reputation" with a search browser. And if they are particularly keen on escaping their pod should things go south, they probably won't tab out or block their view with the IGB.

That's funny, I didn't realize the definition of piracy was "someone who honor's ransoms." I would be intrigued to have a pirate chime in that they pay for their account strictly through ransoms, and how often they honored said ransoms.

Member of the Pink Pony Killboard Padding Alliance
Jorden Ishonen
Doomheim
#12 - 2013-07-28 14:39:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Jorden Ishonen
Tah'ris Khlador wrote:


More likely the pirate will expect the panicking victim to be calling in help and stalling rather than looking up the "ransom reputation" with a search browser. And if they are particularly keen on escaping their pod should things go south, they probably won't tab out or block their view with the IGB.


Since when were more targets a bad thing? Besides, given how long a warp takes you'd have plenty of time to kill the ship and run before they landed on you. And it's entirely the ransomee's choice to check reputation. I'd say the consequences of the IGB fouling up a pod instawarp is less harsh than losing the ship on top of paying a phony ransom. Unless you're flying an expensive pod, but that's getting into specifics.

Tah'ris Khlador wrote:
That's funny, I didn't realize the definition of piracy was "someone who honor's ransoms." .


Piracy means robbery and violence. You don't have to do both to qualify as a pirate, but generally the point of a ransom is to make more isk than you would if you blew up his ship. Now, you'd make even more if you were paid a ransom AND looted his wreck, but the downside to that is that fewer ransoms end up getting paid. It's a complaint that I've heard a lot, and it's likely why a lot of pirates these days have to supplement their income with other, less entertaining activities.

Tah'ris Khlador wrote:
I would be intrigued to have a pirate chime in that they pay for their account strictly through ransoms, and how often they honored said ransoms.


One of the best people to ask would be CCP Falcon:

CCP Falcon wrote:
Finally, stick to your word. You ransom someone and they pay up? It's good business practice to let them go. Word travels quickly in EVE, and if you start screwing people over you'll end up with people telling you where to shove your ransom offer.


That said, I'd imagine that very few can make piracy a profitable business on it's own these days.
Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#13 - 2013-07-28 14:41:27 UTC
Tah'ris Khlador wrote:
Jorden Ishonen wrote:
It takes seconds to do a forum search. If the pirate can't wait that long for his prey to verify that the ransom will be honored, chances are he wouldn't have honored the ransom anyways.

Believe it or not, there are some pirates who do like to try to make a living off of, you know, piracy.


More likely the pirate will expect the panicking victim to be calling in help and stalling rather than looking up the "ransom reputation" with a search browser. And if they are particularly keen on escaping their pod should things go south, they probably won't tab out or block their view with the IGB.

That's funny, I didn't realize the definition of piracy was "someone who honor's ransoms." I would be intrigued to have a pirate chime in that they pay for their account strictly through ransoms, and how often they honored said ransoms.




To be exact, a pirate is someone who agresses other people in order to make money. The most money here can be made by ransoming. And if you manage to build yourself quite some reputation by honoring ransoms, i can see how people are willing to pay you a reasonable ransom.

If you're just agressing other people for the killmails, then you're basically just there for the killmails and some KB efficiency that only roughly indicates if you're a 'good' (in terms of playerskill) player or not. In which case you're not a real pirate.


I've ransomned some guys throughout my EVE history, too, whenever i had the opportunity to do so. In case i get paid i happily drop the scram and warp off, i got what i wanted there.

And i appreciate the hint towards fitting overdrives instead of warpcore stabs, but the basic approach i will be following from now on is another one.
Jorden Ishonen
Doomheim
#14 - 2013-07-28 14:50:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Jorden Ishonen
Syrias Bizniz wrote:
To be exact, a pirate is someone who agresses other people in order to make money. The most money here can be made by ransoming. And if you manage to build yourself quite some reputation by honoring ransoms, i can see how people are willing to pay you a reasonable ransom.

If you're just agressing other people for the killmails, then you're basically just there for the killmails and some KB efficiency that only roughly indicates if you're a 'good' (in terms of playerskill) player or not. In which case you're not a real pirate.


I'd disagree with the idea that one has to offer and honour ransoms to be a "real' pirate. Someone could (theoretically) make money purely by shooting ships and looting the wrecks. Similarly, someone could just scram and web haulers without firing a shot, ransom them, and let them go without ever doing anything violent and still be a pirate. What I was getting at in my post is that both of those extremes are likely to be less profitable than mixing them; take the ransom when you can, take the loot if they refuse.

I'd say you define piracy pretty well yourself in the first line, though I'd add one more part: "...in empire space." (Nullseccers and wormholers can't really be said to be engaging in piracy, because in order to break laws you have to operate where laws exist in the first place)
Etuura Zellis
Scarlet Corsairs
#15 - 2013-07-28 21:52:40 UTC
There seems to be this weird notion on the forums that honoring ransoms is bad practice, and that your a fool to pay them - to the contrary, I'd say your a fool not to, but watch who you're paying. There is a very large number of folks in low-sec who honor ransoms, and you can bet if people don't they'll have a tougher time at recieving payments in the future. Reputation is everything, and as someone who has made significant amounts of ISK off ransoms (to where I could very nearly cut out other ISK activities entirely,) having the reputation that you let people go once they've paid is huge in ensuring swift payment.

Lists have/do exist on this subject, mostly it lists corporations/alliances as opposed to individual pilots. In many cases that's enough, like minded soloists tend to seek each other out and help compound said reputations.
Naburi NasNaburi
Doomheim
#16 - 2013-07-29 09:40:41 UTC
Catching someone a second time within just a few days and him saying: argh not you again - how much do I have to pay this time ? ... I dont know - call me weird, this gives me a damn good feeling inside.

Blowing someone up after ransoming them - gives me nothing but a bad reputation.
My word is all I have and if that word isnt worth anything anymore - i might aswell become a miner or missionrunner.
MIkhail Illiad
Fevered Imaginings
#17 - 2013-07-29 10:37:48 UTC
Any publicity is good publicity.

There once was an interesting signature here... It has long since disapeared. 
Jorden Ishonen
Doomheim
#18 - 2013-07-29 14:28:57 UTC
Etuura Zellis wrote:
There seems to be this weird notion on the forums that honoring ransoms is bad practice, and that your a fool to pay them - to the contrary, I'd say your a fool not to, but watch who you're paying. There is a very large number of folks in low-sec who honor ransoms, and you can bet if people don't they'll have a tougher time at recieving payments in the future. Reputation is everything, and as someone who has made significant amounts of ISK off ransoms (to where I could very nearly cut out other ISK activities entirely,) having the reputation that you let people go once they've paid is huge in ensuring swift payment.

Lists have/do exist on this subject, mostly it lists corporations/alliances as opposed to individual pilots. In many cases that's enough, like minded soloists tend to seek each other out and help compound said reputations.



Where are these lists? Honestly, there should be a stickied (or well bumped) list at the top of this forum so it's easy to find. List in the OP of corps that honour vs. don't honour and finding what you need to know is a simple ctrl-f away. Would help diminish the impact of those who don't honour ransoms putting your future prey off the idea.
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
Goonswarm Federation
#19 - 2013-07-29 16:56:19 UTC
Naburi NasNaburi wrote:
Catching someone a second time within just a few days and him saying: argh not you again - how much do I have to pay this time ? ... I dont know - call me weird, this gives me a damn good feeling inside.

Blowing someone up after ransoming them - gives me nothing but a bad reputation.
My word is all I have and if that word isnt worth anything anymore - i might aswell become a miner or missionrunner.


I like your new style;

And to the wider public:
Come to Aunenen - TDG always honors ransom - even if you try to insult us in Russian (and all other 64 Languages that are supported by a well known online Translator).

TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs [:o] "   CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a diȼk joke." Robin Williams - RIP
Phaade
LowKey Ops
Shadow Cartel
#20 - 2013-07-29 19:40:37 UTC
Naburi NasNaburi wrote:
Catching someone a second time within just a few days and him saying: argh not you again - how much do I have to pay this time ? ... I dont know - call me weird, this gives me a damn good feeling inside.

Blowing someone up after ransoming them - gives me nothing but a bad reputation.
My word is all I have and if that word isnt worth anything anymore - i might aswell become a miner or missionrunner.


This.

Ransoming is great fun anyway, and I'd rather have 100m than hope all his expensive stuff survives the wreck and take it to the market etc etc.
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