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Crime & Punishment

 
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Incursion griefing getting kicked into high gear

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Karah Serrigan
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#261 - 2011-11-10 16:27:43 UTC
Khanh'rhh wrote:
None of you know the difference between "criminal flagging" and passed on aggression, then?

A while back, CCP made it IMPOSSIBLE to rep someone who was criminally flagged, due to the CONCORDOKKEN greifing in Incursion sites. This ****** up FW and lowsec, since you couldn't rep someone who had a GCC timer (the criminal flag....)

It is now possible to do so again, only now with a warning.

i.e. CCP have fixed the half assed nerf.

What the Skunkworks were doing will still throw up no warning.

EDIT: unless CCP don't know their own terminology, of course. Lazy patch notes.

What you mean is GLOBAL criminal flag. l2criminalaggressionsystem.
Khanh'rhh
Sparkle Motion.
#262 - 2011-11-10 16:32:43 UTC
This is why I don't :highsec:

Or maybe I just wanted to think it wasn't true?

: /

"Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual,

Rengas
AQUILA INC
Verge of Collapse
#263 - 2011-11-10 16:42:14 UTC
Sincere congratulations for being so successful that CCP had no choice but to nerf you!
Ammzi
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#264 - 2011-11-10 16:49:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Ammzi
Wait, hang on. WAAAIT

Directly from TQ

Quote:
CONCORDs automatic safety algorithm embedded in your Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction has decided to shut down to avoid involvement with the criminal shenanigans of Marhaba. Manual override is required to resume operations.


I haven't tried with normal aggression yet.

edit:

Ok, so I had a reaper pick up a can while I was repping him. The repper continued without stop/warning and without transferring aggression.
However when I started a second repper I got promped by a warning:

Quote:
17:04:50 Question Proceeding with this action will aid your target who has enemies present, the activation will be considered an aggression towards your targets enemies. You will be flagged as a criminal towards his enemies for up to 15 minutes from your last aiding activation. Are you sure you want to activate this module on Marhaba?


But before I had chosen "yes or no" I had already received the aggro.
This is not a nerf, this is a buff to incursion griefers xD


__________________

edit2:

Trying this with another scenario. My alt canflipped a can and got aggro towards some random pilot.
I activated my reps on my alt and I got promped by a warning about aggression, enemies, etc. etc.
Meaning pilots who will initiate reps on an aggroed pilot WILL receive a warning!

I think what I experienced in the first edit is a bug .... exploitable one in my opinion.


________________

edit3:

Ok, tried the same thing again.
Reps on shuttle, shuttle can flips and my repper is still running.
If I engage any of the other reps I get a warning and NO aggro is transferred!

Strange thing that happened ... along the line my logistic got aggro against the pilot it was repping, because the pilot the shuttle had gained aggro against shot the shuttle..... not working as intended?

I am very confused how this make sense, but yes. CCP has nerfed incursion griefers.


PS: When the pilot shot the shuttle I was repping, reps turned off and I got this warning.

Quote:
17:38:54 Info
CONCORDs automatic safety algorithm embedded in your Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction has decided to shut down to avoid involvement with the criminal shenanigans of Mishna Khardula.
Manual override is required to resume operations.


_______________

edit4:

I am starting to get gray hair.
A cap transfer was running to the shuttle pilot while he was can flipping.
After can flipping it kept running and no aggro was transferred.
While trying to engage second cap xfer it gave off warning.
After disengaging the cap xfer and then turning on armor repper there was NO warning and aggro was received immediately.

Sad
Lakshata Chawla
State War Academy
Caldari State
#265 - 2011-11-10 17:20:06 UTC
So people like me that press F1-F4 all at the same time will still get killed XD
Odemis
Death By Design
#266 - 2011-11-10 17:51:57 UTC
CCP has trolled you all good this time.. honestly I give it 8/10. Yes.. I did say "you" as in you incursionbears.
Zowie Powers
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#267 - 2011-11-10 17:57:58 UTC
Rengas wrote:
Sincere congratulations for being so successful that CCP had no choice but to nerf you!



+1
I like Lofty.

ATX: The best of the rest.
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#268 - 2011-11-10 18:41:11 UTC
PlayerName wrote:
Not sure if trolling or just stupid. My guess is just stupid.

I have some advice you should heed: It's better to remain silent and appear stupid than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

Please try to remember this next time you decide to waste our time (and yours) with such a terrible, incoherent post.

Nope, trolling stupid like you who thinks everything needs risk or its unfair. The Did you read this mornings patch? It just got harder to gank logistics by flipping a can and using an alt of yours that needs to be repped so you can warp in and gank it, it gives to the logistic a warning. CONCORD ganking removing insurance as well. At best, all you guys saying there is no risk for highsec incursions will keep on getting pissed off and go shoot the statue in Jita while CCP is seeing what the hell are guys with billions in isk from incurions going to do? Obviously buy PLEX with isk, as the price keeps going up because the supply is so low (where you can set the price you want, instead of keep dropping the price with high competition from market traders as the supply of PLEX gets bigger and demand less so). More plex at higher price, more people buying PLEX from CCP with cash to trade for isk. More cash for CCP, you can see where CCP is going in this direction. Coddle the player base, make them feel secure, more willing to spend cash in CCP's form of micro transaction.
proxwar
Doomheim
#269 - 2011-11-10 18:55:30 UTC
Ammzi wrote:
Wait, hang on. WAAAIT

Directly from TQ

Quote:
CONCORDs automatic safety algorithm embedded in your Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction has decided to shut down to avoid involvement with the criminal shenanigans of Marhaba. Manual override is required to resume operations.


I haven't tried with normal aggression yet.

edit:

Ok, so I had a reaper pick up a can while I was repping him. The repper continued without stop/warning and without transferring aggression.
However when I started a second repper I got promped by a warning:

Quote:
17:04:50 Question Proceeding with this action will aid your target who has enemies present, the activation will be considered an aggression towards your targets enemies. You will be flagged as a criminal towards his enemies for up to 15 minutes from your last aiding activation. Are you sure you want to activate this module on Marhaba?


But before I had chosen "yes or no" I had already received the aggro.
This is not a nerf, this is a buff to incursion griefers xD


__________________

edit2:

Trying this with another scenario. My alt canflipped a can and got aggro towards some random pilot.
I activated my reps on my alt and I got promped by a warning about aggression, enemies, etc. etc.
Meaning pilots who will initiate reps on an aggroed pilot WILL receive a warning!

I think what I experienced in the first edit is a bug .... exploitable one in my opinion.


________________

edit3:

Ok, tried the same thing again.
Reps on shuttle, shuttle can flips and my repper is still running.
If I engage any of the other reps I get a warning and NO aggro is transferred!

Strange thing that happened ... along the line my logistic got aggro against the pilot it was repping, because the pilot the shuttle had gained aggro against shot the shuttle..... not working as intended?

I am very confused how this make sense, but yes. CCP has nerfed incursion griefers.


PS: When the pilot shot the shuttle I was repping, reps turned off and I got this warning.

Quote:
17:38:54 Info
CONCORDs automatic safety algorithm embedded in your Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction has decided to shut down to avoid involvement with the criminal shenanigans of Mishna Khardula.
Manual override is required to resume operations.


_______________

edit4:

I am starting to get gray hair.
A cap transfer was running to the shuttle pilot while he was can flipping.
After can flipping it kept running and no aggro was transferred.
While trying to engage second cap xfer it gave off warning.
After disengaging the cap xfer and then turning on armor repper there was NO warning and aggro was received immediately.

Sad


So, breaking it down....

If your reps/transfers cycle is already activated on griefer, and the griefer gets aggression mid cycle it does NOT auto transfer to the logi due to it being already activated. But any mod activated after that time will get the pop up warning?


Did i get that right?
Ammzi
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#270 - 2011-11-10 19:08:03 UTC
proxwar wrote:

So, breaking it down....

If your reps/transfers cycle is already activated on griefer, and the griefer gets aggression mid cycle it does NOT auto transfer to the logi due to it being already activated. But any mod activated after that time will get the pop up warning?


Did i get that right?


Yep, pretty much.
proxwar
Doomheim
#271 - 2011-11-10 19:12:00 UTC
Awesome.


So CCP really does love incursioners then. <3

LOL at Skunkworks, but credit where its due. Not everyday a company changes its game mechanics for 40K+ players due to the actions of so few. Got to be some kind of medal made for such an accoumplishment Shocked


New motto for you skunkguys -

"Never was so much owed by so many to so few" - Churchill
Khors
Doomheim
#272 - 2011-11-10 20:00:12 UTC
Best you can do now is finnish the highsec incursions as fast as possible. I hear people are very upset when they don't get to farm the vanguards.
Ammzi
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#273 - 2011-11-10 20:01:24 UTC
Khors wrote:
Best you can do now is finnish the highsec incursions as fast as possible. I hear people are very upset when they don't get to farm the vanguards.


*punches Khors*
Don't give 'em good ideas. lol ....
Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#274 - 2011-11-10 21:12:18 UTC
Don't worry. We'd already given it some thought. We don't have the manpower to close the incursions the normal way, but we've been looking into what actually has to be done to close the site. We're trying to determine if it's actually killing the site or if we can start a despawn timer or do something specific like that.

If we can't do that there's still a plan to do with the mom sites and I'm pretty stoked about.

Belligerent Undesirables Selling Griefer Immunity
Jack Tronic
borkedLabs
#275 - 2011-11-10 21:16:08 UTC
Alternatively you can suicide jam the logistics using insured scorp blob because they don't fit ECCM on them for incursions Shouldn't take too long for everything to go pop.
Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#276 - 2011-11-10 21:19:52 UTC
Oh yeah, there's lots on the table for us to use. We were going to wait until the incursion bears started getting smart enough to avoid our previous thing before we used them, but there's a couple options that need to be fully fleshed out, to be sure.

Belligerent Undesirables Selling Griefer Immunity
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#277 - 2011-11-10 21:42:59 UTC
Unfortunately the patch is going to force me to skip what was the NEXT step, but Monk's right: we have a lot of plans on the table. This was the low-hanging fruit, that's all.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Moustached Slimy Worm
Go Petition Blizzard
Safety.
#278 - 2011-11-10 21:51:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Moustached Slimy Worm
Jack Tronic wrote:
Alternatively you can suicide jam the logistics using insured scorp blob because they don't fit ECCM on them for incursions Shouldn't take too long for everything to go pop.


Blizzard is removing insurance from ships destroyed by CONCORD and we'd only get at most 10 seconds of jamming per Scorpion per logistics (or maybe per 2 logistics, we haven't done the maths yet). We'd need at least a minute of jammed logis to kill anything. When I started incursion griefing I'd tackle the logis at the acceleration gate while the fleet warped in logiless and I'd usually only kill one or two ships.

But we've already shown just how easy it is for a handful of people to get Blizzard to change the game, so we might just try to manipulate them into making such a carebearish change that there's massive desubs and Eve dies. Maybe once we start killing incursionbears again we can get Blizzard to reimburse ship losses in highsec.
Neeb Neeb Nanu
Doomheim
#279 - 2011-11-10 22:17:57 UTC
Keep up the good work gents.

While there is a will there will always be a way.

Incursions fatten too many wallets.
foxnod
Perkone
Caldari State
#280 - 2011-11-11 02:25:21 UTC
Moustached Slimy Worm wrote:
Jack Tronic wrote:
Alternatively you can suicide jam the logistics using insured scorp blob because they don't fit ECCM on them for incursions Shouldn't take too long for everything to go pop.


Blizzard is removing insurance from ships destroyed by CONCORD and we'd only get at most 10 seconds of jamming per Scorpion per logistics (or maybe per 2 logistics, we haven't done the maths yet). We'd need at least a minute of jammed logis to kill anything. When I started incursion griefing I'd tackle the logis at the acceleration gate while the fleet warped in logiless and I'd usually only kill one or two ships.

But we've already shown just how easy it is for a handful of people to get Blizzard to change the game, so we might just try to manipulate them into making such a carebearish change that there's massive desubs and Eve dies. Maybe once we start killing incursionbears again we can get Blizzard to remove ship losses involving NPC's even if they're PvP-related losses.



You guys are truly saints. Eve needs more people like you.