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EVE New Citizens Q&A

 
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Question - Level 4 Missions
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Harold Tanager
Doomheim
#1 - 2013-05-09 17:22:09 UTC
How long does it usually take after account creation to be able to run level 4 missions?

Every time I make a cool setup in evemon it ends up requiring about 5 months to train the skills and competencies.

There must be an easier way... right?
Zanzbar
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2013-05-09 17:56:10 UTC
keep in mind that the certificates are a guidline for skil training and if you find that you dont really need that last skill or 2 for the competency then dont bother. how long it takes to run level 4s depend on both your standings with the coporation thats issuing them in your area and your personal ability to handel yourself in combat (keep in mind that pvp is a different story).

to run level 4s you will need a very well fit battlecruiser or a decent battleship or t3 cruiser fit. you will also need good drone skills , understanding of resistance types and willingness to fit to counter, and a decent understanding of gun tracking mechanics if you plan to use a gunboat
Mynutor
Myn Industries
#3 - 2013-05-09 18:23:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Mynutor
I guess the 5 months is a good number.

-

I have been told it's 2-3 months. But I highly doubt that.

Most guides out there are outdated, so I can't really link you anything.

Objective sighted. Target locked. Lasers activated. Pew-pew-pew. Die roid..., DIE!

Kitty Bear
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2013-05-09 18:25:35 UTC
Train Social & Connections to speed up your standings gain.

You can train to sit in a Tech 1 fitted BS in a relatively short amount of time
Some L4 missions are harder than others, and a minimum skilled/fit BS may not always be up to the task

EveHQ has a fitting tool that also lists the skills your character does not have, you can work out a 'shortest time possible' skillplan this way
Evemon will let you do a similar plan, but it has to done by individual modules
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#5 - 2013-05-09 18:45:55 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
As said above.

Take the certificates with a small grain of salt. They are good guidelines on what to skill.

The most important things you need for level 4 missions:

* Standings (how obviously, as without them you can't run L4).
* A ship (Very good fitted BC, Good BS or T3 cruiser).
* Proper support skills (so a BS with the support skills that are still at frigate level is NOT good)
* Understanding how missions work (rat damage types, how to tank them, type of damage you should deal, trigger/aggro/spawns).

Depending on what ships you are looking at and what weapons etc...

3 - 5 months sound about right. And that time is there for a meaning. In that time you WILL learn a lot about how EVE game mechanics work.

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San Badgeros
Badgeros Holdings
#6 - 2013-05-09 19:04:19 UTC
If you're desperate to get into 4s before you're time, team up with some one who can already run them, but bear the following things in mind:

1. Only fly what you can afford to lose - if you lose a poorly fit BS, don't start crying
2. Be prepared to GTFO if the incoming heat finds you
3. Your patron's altruism may only extend to letting you tag along, not digging you out of the fire

Doing it this way will let you earn standings, sec status, cash and experience. Experience is the most important, find a good corp or mission runner who can show you the ropes, and you may be able to accelerate your progress to solo lvl 4s

SB
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2013-05-09 19:14:35 UTC
Harold Tanager wrote:
How long does it usually take after account creation to be able to run level 4 missions?

Every time I make a cool setup in evemon it ends up requiring about 5 months to train the skills and competencies.

There must be an easier way... right?


One time, just to try it out, I started a new account, and was running L4s in a BC in 2 weeks. In a BS in about 3 weeks, if I recall.

No giving myself isk for super implants, giving myself standing.. anything like that.

Now, I wasn't turning out 50 million ISK an hour, like my main does, in 3-4 weeks, but 10-20 million ISK an hour was no problem.
Dmitry Klokov
Rubtech Equity Research Group
#8 - 2013-05-09 19:55:07 UTC
LHA Tarawa wrote:
Harold Tanager wrote:
How long does it usually take after account creation to be able to run level 4 missions?

Every time I make a cool setup in evemon it ends up requiring about 5 months to train the skills and competencies.

There must be an easier way... right?


One time, just to try it out, I started a new account, and was running L4s in a BC in 2 weeks. In a BS in about 3 weeks, if I recall.

No giving myself isk for super implants, giving myself standing.. anything like that.

Now, I wasn't turning out 50 million ISK an hour, like my main does, in 3-4 weeks, but 10-20 million ISK an hour was no problem.


How?
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2013-05-09 20:21:47 UTC
Dmitry Klokov wrote:

How?


I do not have the specific skill plan here at work, but can probably post it tonight when I get home.


Basically:

Started as Minmatar.
Trained to destroyer so I could blow through tutorials. They are good money in short time, with minimal skills, and give faction standing. 250 arty and a thrasher, for the win. Some hints to make the tutorials go faster... when it says to build 1000s of ammo, just buy it off the market. The last guy in the advanced military.. use long range weapons and stay out of his range.

SoE epic arc also gives you good ISK and faction standings increase. Then buy and turn in tags to datacenters for more faction standings increases. All these faction standings increases let you skip L1 and L2 missions and jump right into L3, as soon as you can fly a BC.

Do not use meta 0, basic modules. M3 and M4 are super cheap, and work better.

Trained lots of basic support skills to level 3ish. You can get, on average, 4 or 5 skills to L3 in the time it takes to get one to level 4. 20-25 skillls to l3 in the time it takes to get one to Level 5. Gunnery (long range), shield tanking, afterburner, drones, frigs, cruiser battle cruiser.

Once you are in the BC, fit up with good meta 3 and meta 4 modules, you should be able to blow through Level 3 missions, which you can run because of all of the faction standing from running the tutorials over and over, SoE epic arc, and tags. Figure out which missions let you stay at long range, hitting the rats before they can even get in range of you to shoot you.

Once you are running L3 in a BC, 2 weeks or so, train large weapons and battleship. Another week or so. Then it is into L4s.
Keno Skir
#10 - 2013-05-09 20:35:15 UTC
LHA runs LvL4's in a battlecruiser after 4 weeks because he has years of experience to keep him alive. This is not a realistic approach for new players who don't yet understand the game mechanics.

Game experience and knowledge of mechanics are more powerful than SP in many cases. Some people run lvl4's in frigates for fun (slowly) because they know how.

5 Months to fly LvL4's in reasonable safety is a realistic number, but also remember you'll need those 5 months experience to keep you from losing even the best fit battleship.

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J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#11 - 2013-05-09 20:46:21 UTC
Keno Skir wrote:
LHA runs LvL4's in a battlecruiser after 4 weeks because he has years of experience to keep him alive. This is not a realistic approach for new players who don't yet understand the game mechanics.

Game experience and knowledge of mechanics are more powerful than SP in many cases. Some people run lvl4's in frigates for fun (slowly) because they know how.

5 Months to fly LvL4's in reasonable safety is a realistic number, but also remember you'll need those 5 months experience to keep you from losing even the best fit battleship.


This.

New alt characters =/= New players


With my 2 years of experience in how EVE works, of course my characters can punch things a bit faster. Because I know how mechanics work. I know what to do in most situations...

A genuine new player has NO clue about it.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Nerath Naaris
Pink Winged Unicorns for Peace Love and Anarchy
#12 - 2013-05-09 21:09:52 UTC
To be able to fit a T2 tank is recommended to run L4s confortably.

Anything below is possible, of course, but you should be aware that in this case you are running the missions without safety net: you should be very picky about which missions to accept as well as knowing the mission survival guide by heart.


And since it has not been mentioned so far, another good rule-of-thumb is the 500/500 rule: 500 DPS and 500 tank to run L4 missions safely.

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Je suis [?]
Celeste Taylor
Ruby Dynasty
#13 - 2013-05-09 21:32:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Celeste Taylor
LHA Tarawa wrote:

One time, just to try it out, I started a new account, and was running L4s in a BC in 2 weeks. In a BS in about 3 weeks, if I recall.

No giving myself isk for super implants, giving myself standing.. anything like that.

Now, I wasn't turning out 50 million ISK an hour, like my main does, in 3-4 weeks, but 10-20 million ISK an hour was no problem.


I started Eve as a trader and running distribution missions to gain faction. I believe it was a bit shy of 2 months when I was first offered a shipyard theft L4 storyline mission. I had a some extra ISK since trading had proven lucrative, so I bought a Navy Megathron and equipped it with a bunch of high end gear since fitting was limited with skills mainly between III/IV and tech II was not available for the same reason. The mission took a couple of hours of hit and running as I slowly grinded down the Angel Cartel, but in the end I was fortunate to be rewarded with a Mining Foreman Mindlink which I sold for 1b ISK which covered a good portion of the ship I had just bought.

So you probably will need to spend more money for a ship to do level 4s to compensate for lack of grid and CPU available and it will take you much longer, but it definitely is doable, even with your first account and little combat experience if you have the money and patience.

I actually did Shipyard Theft again last night and it was much easier with almost all at drone skills at V. This is one of the more profitable missions that I never turn down even if I get one of the less expensive mindlinks as a reward.
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2013-05-09 21:35:04 UTC
Keno Skir wrote:
LHA runs LvL4's in a battlecruiser after 4 weeks because he has years of experience to keep him alive. This is not a realistic approach for new players who don't yet understand the game mechanics.

Game experience and knowledge of mechanics are more powerful than SP in many cases. Some people run lvl4's in frigates for fun (slowly) because they know how.

5 Months to fly LvL4's in reasonable safety is a realistic number, but also remember you'll need those 5 months experience to keep you from losing even the best fit battleship.



To clarify, L3 in a BC in 2 weeks and L4 in a BS in 3 weeks... if I recall.

The point that I was able to do that because of game experience is valid. However, I think the best way to get said experience is by doing it.


Insure that first BS to platinum level. Read the EVE Survival to find out which missions let you stay at range. Be at speed and be aligned out. Warp out if needed.

5 months before you start running L4s? I think that is nuts.

Even on my very first account, I was running L4s in less than 3 months, and that was back when the first few weeks were spent on nothing but learning the "learning" skills.
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#15 - 2013-05-09 21:38:39 UTC
Celeste Taylor wrote:

So you probably will need to spend more money for a ship to do level 4s to compensate for lack of grid and CPU available and it will take you much longer, but it definitely is doable, even with your first account and little combat experience if you have the money and patience.



Oh, I would say the exact opposite. Buy a T1 BS, insure it, fit it with cheap meta 3 and 4 modules, and if you lose it... meh. Insurance covers a big chunk, and you can always go back to that BC and L3s for a couple hours to get the ISK to replace the lost BS.

This is the meaning of that "don't fly what you can't afford to lose" number one rule of EVE.
LHA Tarawa
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2013-05-10 19:13:25 UTC
Here is a text dump of the skills I learned:
Social I
Social II
Rapid Firing I
Sharpshooter I
Tactical Shield Manipulation I
Energy Management I
Shield Management I
Afterburner I
Targeting I
Motion Prediction I
Evasive Maneuvering I
Social III
Connections I
Connections II
Long Range Targeting I
Targeting II
Acceleration Control I
Minmatar Frigate III
Afterburner II
Shield Management II
Long Range Targeting II
Energy Management II
Gunnery III
Medium Projectile Turret I
Medium Projectile Turret II
Minmatar Frigate IV
Minmatar Cruiser I
Minmatar Cruiser II
Minmatar Cruiser III
Spaceship Command IV
Battlecruisers I
Mechanics III
Survey I
Survey II
Survey III
Salvaging I
Salvaging II
Battlecruisers II
ORE Industrial I
ORE Industrial II
ORE Industrial III
Cybernetics I
***Remapping (active) : i17 p21 c17 w17 m27***
Drones I
Drones II
Drones III
Combat Drone Operation I
Scout Drone Operation I
Scout Drone Operation II
Combat Drone Operation II
Drones IV
Drone Navigation I
Drone Durability I
Drone Durability II
Drone Navigation II
Drones V
Drone Interfacing I
Drone Sharpshooting I
Drone Interfacing II
Drone Interfacing III
Drone Sharpshooting II
Drone Sharpshooting III
Scout Drone Operation III
Combat Drone Operation III
Drone Durability III
Drone Navigation III
***Remapping (active) : i21 p27 c17 w17 m17***
Motion Prediction II
Rapid Firing II
Sharpshooter II
Gunnery IV
Surgical Strike I
Surgical Strike II
Acceleration Control II
Evasive Maneuvering II
Afterburner III
Targeting III
Long Range Targeting III
Shield Operation III
Shield Operation IV
EM Shield Compensation I
EM Shield Compensation II
EM Shield Compensation III
Energy Grid Upgrades I
Energy Grid Upgrades II
Energy Grid Upgrades III
Energy Management III
Explosive Shield Compensation I
Explosive Shield Compensation II
Explosive Shield Compensation III
Kinetic Shield Compensation I
Kinetic Shield Compensation II
Kinetic Shield Compensation III
Shield Compensation I
Shield Compensation II
Shield Compensation III
Shield Management III
Shield Upgrades I
Shield Upgrades II
Tactical Shield Manipulation II
Thermic Shield Compensation I
Thermic Shield Compensation II
Thermic Shield Compensation III
Gunnery V
Medium Projectile Turret III
Large Projectile Turret I
Large Projectile Turret II
Large Projectile Turret III
Motion Prediction III
Rapid Firing III
Sharpshooter III
Surgical Strike III
Minmatar Cruiser IV
Minmatar Battleship I
Minmatar Battleship II
Minmatar Battleship III
Acceleration Control III
Afterburner IV
Evasive Maneuvering III



EVEMon shows this as 32 days. As I made enough ISK to buy some implants, I did plug them in. +3s implants reduce the time by 4 days, so if I plugged them in half way in, that get the full month.
Obvi Muse
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#17 - 2013-07-29 04:19:35 UTC
I have played 29 days, and i just started doing level 5 missions today. however it is a little slow, but still viable. I first trained up my mining until i could buy a cruiser, then trained connections. then simply rolled missions in 0.5 and now i am doing level 5 missions in an amarr battleship. at 29 days in.
Marc Callan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2013-07-29 09:32:03 UTC
Effective and efficient solo L4 setups will take a lot of time and money to be able to fly properly. Concentrate on your defenses first, so you don't lose a hundred-fifty-million-ISK hull because of a goof; like mentioned above, you'll want a Tech-II caliber tank for additional protection. Turret battleships take a while to train up their weapons, because you've got to go all the way up the ladder through frigate and cruiser guns first, but you can get by with meta weapons as you're learning the ropes.

Honestly, though, the most helpful bit of preparation I did was to fly a battlecruiser on a battleship's wing, learning the rats' behavior and providing top cover, so I didn't go in completely cold when I started soloing L4's.

Oh - and absolutely take the extra day to train your battleship skills up to at least level 3. A battleship with only level 1 or 2 skills is a much more mediocre performer.

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." - Kurt Vonnegurt