Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Any chance of putting these ships up to 16 slots like HICs and T3 ships?

Generally I have been a big fan of tiercide so far, particularly the T1 cruiser changes (and even the battleships) but I find it hard to adequately express my disappointment in these proposed changes. It could prove to be such a missed opportunity.

Firstly it has been stated many times that tiercide is about giving ships roles and that T2 should be specialised rather than a strict upgrade from T1. There is no clear vision of what the role of this ship class is meant to be. Also I don't understand why you didn't go with attack and combat HACs making attack HACs fast, dps machines with moderate tank that can be gank support in small gangs or rapid deployment high dps in fleets, and combat HACs could be slower and tankier with more cap (or EWAR) resiliance for protracted engagements. You could even give them different role bonuses (MWD bloom for attack and maybe AB speed/EWAR defense for combat).

Both should have a sig that makes them able to mitigate a meaningful proportion of large gun weapon damage and attack HACs would need to be fast enough to catch ABCs, they would then become their natural predator bringing some welcome balance to the meta. There is a good post (on another site) as to why the MWD bloom bonus with the current sigs is of no use.

Basically these ships need to be as fast as the tech 1 counterparts and the MWD bonus needs to be meaningful when it comes to engaging ABCs or battleships allowing for up scaling in the ship sizes they can engage. Currently no-one uses them because have no role that can't be done better (and usually cheaper) by something else. After these change they will still have no role.

This TBH. What about a 20% reduction per level in sig radius penalty when using a mwd? At level 5 the sig penalty will be inexistent making the HACS really ideal for their true role of fast attack ships. Of course the Deimos will have to gain other bonus to substitute mwd one.

In order to partly counter this tremendous role advantage make the medium mwd's actually spend more energy when working in order people dont abuse the advantage.

But like this we will have a true reason to fly HACS instead of navy cruisers, or tec3 ships. They will not have the tec3 fexibility or the ratio of price/performance of the navy cruisers but they will have a specific advantage over all the other ships.

Of course CCP will have to review very fast the missile mechanics beucause they will be hurted by this proposed change but CCP already stated that they are going to do it.

Overslot the HAC's and let the People Decide how they want to fly them.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3365961#post3365961

NONE of these changes are good enough tbh.

HACs don't just need their slots moved around and stats tweaked, they need slots added and their stats buffed.
Even after these changes, the tier 3 BCs will still be better at long range stuff and kiting and people will continue to not use HACs over far cheaper T1 ships that do their job just as well for much less.

HACs need more slot across the board.
they need better fittings
they need 3 rig slots. (or at least the slots to make up for a lack of rig room.)

if these are the only changes made, HACs will continue to be an obsolete ship class.

PS: yes, the med gun changes will make them better, but they also make the T1 ships better by the same amount.

It's idiotic but I like it. Artillery :-)

Tengu fleets were eliminated with the HML nerf, the Goon Tengu fleet we saw recently in Fountain was dropped when it became too expensive in SP and ISK (which is what balances out the T3s)

Loki fleets, while they exist, are rarely used.

T3s are used in armor fleets like Hellcats for ewar support, but that is because of the (relatively) pathetic tank on Recons.

And yet how often are those fleets used? Rarely.
Look at Fountain. What concepts are used? Space Potatoes, bombers, Megas, and Caracals.
Look at CFC VS Dotbros in Tribute. AHAC superiority, Rokhs, Maels, some Hellcats.

T3 fleets exist, but are rare.
And PL is the only alliance to use AHAC Legions to any effect, and you guys use Foxcats now anyway, so your argument of "Huuurrrrr look at all the T3 fleets" is invalid. T3 fleets exist, but are rare outside of Wormholes.

I'm playing EVE, what game you're playing I don't have a clue. Stick to something you know about, like blobbing ratting carriers with a dozen Aeons.

Extra slot sound nice actually, because being double the price of a faction cruiser for generally:
-less EHP (but better resistances I admit)
-much less speed (except vaga/SFI)
-no improvement on dps (but some damage application buff I admit)
-no improvement on slots
-one less rig slot

Really feels bad. Why use them except for big fleets with lots of logis?

While additional slots and the much needed 3rd rig would allow to fit them in many different ways, shield and armor, nano or not.

Amarr: +1 mid to zealot, +1 low to sacrilege
Caldari: +1 low to both (allow to properly nano, or switch to armor tank!)
Minnie: +2 med -1 hi to munnin, vaga will be hard to tweak though, +1 med probably a bit OP
Gallente: +1 med or low to deimos, +1 med or low to ishtar

That would be a welcome change in my opinion... (HAC 5 but never bothered using any other than Vaga and Zealot, but would fly most of them given such a change)

I disagree with a lot of this.

I DO like the idea of adding the MWD bonus to the hulls by level, let it cap out at like -80% or some such THEN jack up the weapon bonuses, add a rig slot, loosen the fitting restrictions.

With T3s and ABCs in the game there will be no niche unless the HACs do a LOT more damage than they currently do, sig tanking is cool and all but it only takes a nub in a bellicose and you aren't sig tanking a damn thing.