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Why nerf high sec?

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Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#181 - 2013-07-20 07:12:10 UTC
Kyperion wrote:
*reposted* ...Now, if they made it so mining barges had respectable tanks, could carry multiple flights of drones, and support ECM modules, and if they brought PVP/PVE fits together, then yeah, game on... but currently the only reason to PVP in highsec is if your some kind of epeen killmail seeker or just like to grief people. Its easy targets, without meaningful consequences.


Mining barges can do most, if not all the things you want them to now, and have been able to do so for quite some while. (Retribution, or even earlier, IIRC?)

Star Wars: the Old Republic may not be EVE. But I'll take the sound of dual blaster-pistols over "NURVV CLAOKING NAOW!!!11oneone!!" any day of the week.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#182 - 2013-07-20 07:12:46 UTC
CanI haveyourstuff wrote:
I dont even imagine all those tears if all hisec bears invade null if hisec gets nerfed too much.

you think you'll get some sort of fun pvp? the reality is that this hisec loot pinjata target will be your corp or alliance member in no time with ship thats not worth ganking anymore and he be stealing your null pve soon enough and then what?


what will you ask to be nerfed next then?
nerfbat planted against your head maybe makes you think further indeed... or not.



The butthurt potential is huge. If noobs and mission runners started making incursions into nullsec, with cheap ships especially, think of the cost.

How much does a nullseccer make in running anoms and sanctums?

How much does SOV cost?

Now imagine that you are Mr Nullsec, and you live safely beyond the Great Wall of Carebear where renters and gate campers ensure that you have empty systems most of the time, as well as the NBSI policy that is quite common now. You went out there to make the big ISK of course. The people running the corp/alliance that holds SOV do so for some strange reason involving anything from Ritalin to ePeen.

Now imagine that highsec incursions into nullsec come to the constellation.

- blobbing a bunch of destroyers and cheap cruisers is risky, because you have to draw forces off from somewhere else, and leave a hole for another incursion
- Mr Nullsec is now no longer running anoms and sanctums. He's hunting people, and not earning that big ISK.
- Meanwhile, because most of nullsec is really empty (I've been there, deep, and not seen other players for months at a time) people who sneak out there, NOT being a slave corp/alliance member, is making huge ISK just off tresspassing alone.
- Therefore Mr Nullsec is going to wonder why he bothered to be in the huge organization, putting up with nerd rage, paying taxes, etc. He should join the wolfpacks and also base out of highsec too.

Things don't look good for nullsec at this point.

But, because noobs are told all these lies I described previously, a mental wall exists. Building mental walls through propaganda and the "art of argument" is something people do in the real world for real money and make a living off it. Therefore there can be no doubt that the large alliances have these people using the same tactics.

Harry and his crew out there in VFK are making an impact. People can argue this is a gnat on an elephant, but is an irritated elephant something to disregard?

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#183 - 2013-07-20 07:29:48 UTC
Alicia Aishai wrote:
[...]

The positive way to make low more attractive would be to make low a bit more secure, for example by preventing use of combat probes which would allow mission runners to at least do mission safe from gank while in the mission. Miners could hire temporary NPC protection which would avoid them being defenseless sheep. I'm sure there are other good ideas. It's a win/win for all as pirates will see more traffic at gates and PVE players can do missions without dscanning every 5 sec.

[...]



No.

No.

NO.

Absolutely not, never, not just out of the question but....Jesus, what the Hell are you on???!!!

(And could you please share, as it's quite clearly the really good stuff.)

Oh and by the way: Learning to probe and d-scan will also teach you all kinds of great ways to avoid those Big Bad Griefers(TM), and might just make you piles of money if the RNG God smiles upon you....just a thought.

Star Wars: the Old Republic may not be EVE. But I'll take the sound of dual blaster-pistols over "NURVV CLAOKING NAOW!!!11oneone!!" any day of the week.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#184 - 2013-07-20 07:40:22 UTC
Quote:

lol so much wrong with this. null has far greater reward for PvE, WH greater than null discounting moons. the average bear in null does no pvp. i know since this is where a couple of my carebear spies / isk generators reside. with pi alts and anoms and almost never seeing a nuetral its vastly superior to highsec where Infinity now resides.


So why do most of us run missions in empire?

The averge guy in null will make about the same running missions in high sec as they do running anoms in null over the long term. They will make more running incursions.
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#185 - 2013-07-20 07:46:44 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Someone mentioned that the players who are skewed too far toward being risk averse, will always stay in highsec, even if you offered them triple the reward at only double the risk, etc.

That's why you FORCE them to accept it. They truly do not know what is in their own best interest. If they don't want to accept risk, there are plenty of people who will happily bring the risk to them (and people like me, who will pay to make sure it happens), which is why highsec ganking is a thing.

Being so absurdly risk averse like a lot of the highsec crowd are is playing the game wrong. That's it. There will be no Felucca and Trammel in New Eden, whether they like it or not. This isn't a single player game, and you'll never be immune to other people. If they don't like it, then they can go fit some guns and come kill me for it.

Either way, we win.

i disagree, there's no playing the game wrong

talk like this provokes the crazies who think talks of nerfs are part of some vendetta against people who like living in highsec, or who think there's some giant nullsec conspiracy to manipulate their play

although playing the game safe under NPC corps, NPC station services and CONCORD isn't wrong in any way, and shouldn't be unprofitable, it shouldn't be the best way to play the game

and there are parts of the game where 'do it in highsec on an alt' are flat better than doing it any other way, which means everyone sane does it that way, which sadly removes a lot of opportunity for real gameplay and player interaction, in my view
Drunken Bum
#186 - 2013-07-20 07:48:43 UTC
why is there 10 pages to this thread?


After the patch we're giving the market some gentle supply restriction, like tying one wrist to the bedpost loosely with soft silk rope. Just enough to make things a bit more exciting for the market, not enough to make a safeword necessary.  -Fozzie
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#187 - 2013-07-20 07:49:04 UTC
Butzewutze wrote:
[...]
Its funny that you call others antisocial.


Projection:

It's the new black!

Star Wars: the Old Republic may not be EVE. But I'll take the sound of dual blaster-pistols over "NURVV CLAOKING NAOW!!!11oneone!!" any day of the week.
Uma D
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#188 - 2013-07-20 07:49:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Uma D
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
CanI haveyourstuff wrote:
I dont even imagine all those tears if all hisec bears invade null if hisec gets nerfed too much.

you think you'll get some sort of fun pvp? the reality is that this hisec loot pinjata target will be your corp or alliance member in no time with ship thats not worth ganking anymore and he be stealing your null pve soon enough and then what?


what will you ask to be nerfed next then?
nerfbat planted against your head maybe makes you think further indeed... or not.



The butthurt potential is huge. If noobs and mission runners started making incursions into nullsec, with cheap ships especially, think of the cost.

How much does a nullseccer make in running anoms and sanctums?

How much does SOV cost?

Now imagine that you are Mr Nullsec, and you live safely beyond the Great Wall of Carebear where renters and gate campers ensure that you have empty systems most of the time, as well as the NBSI policy that is quite common now. You went out there to make the big ISK of course. The people running the corp/alliance that holds SOV do so for some strange reason involving anything from Ritalin to ePeen.

Now imagine that highsec incursions into nullsec come to the constellation.

- blobbing a bunch of destroyers and cheap cruisers is risky, because you have to draw forces off from somewhere else, and leave a hole for another incursion
- Mr Nullsec is now no longer running anoms and sanctums. He's hunting people, and not earning that big ISK.
- Meanwhile, because most of nullsec is really empty (I've been there, deep, and not seen other players for months at a time) people who sneak out there, NOT being a slave corp/alliance member, is making huge ISK just off tresspassing alone.
- Therefore Mr Nullsec is going to wonder why he bothered to be in the huge organization, putting up with nerd rage, paying taxes, etc. He should join the wolfpacks and also base out of highsec too.

Things don't look good for nullsec at this point.

But, because noobs are told all these lies I described previously, a mental wall exists. Building mental walls through propaganda and the "art of argument" is something people do in the real world for real money and make a living off it. Therefore there can be no doubt that the large alliances have these people using the same tactics.

Harry and his crew out there in VFK are making an impact. People can argue this is a gnat on an elephant, but is an irritated elephant something to disregard?



How could one start a day better than having a big cup of delusion?

I just say:

Gather your Wolfpack and bring it on! Less talking more invading. We will be waiting for you. Oh you mighty high seccers, come and make us tremble in fear.

Little hint: The moment you become a threat to a 0.0 entity is the moment you turn into an entity using exactly the same methods you are trying to rally against here. Your little Wolfpack might keep a few people from shooting npcs in a few systems, but you will NEVER get ppl like yourself to be organised enough to have a real impact.

Feel free to prove me wrong! Destroy all the evil 0.0 alliances... gogogogo!!!
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#189 - 2013-07-20 07:53:20 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Highsec hate is a strawman.

The real isk to be ground is in nullsec, but people who are just as bearish as they claim people in highsec are.


Nullsec sells the same things to their people that people in highsec are sold on.


Meanwhile, people are told they cannot leave highsec unless they join into the power structure of nullsec. "You'll get blobbed! You will die in a gate camp!". The propaganda campaign is ongoing and deliberate.


People are also told they need a lot of ISK and SP "before they go". This too is deliberate. Those who spread that lie are the ones who then recruit new players, acting like they are nice to new players and helping them, when all they want is numbers and cannon fodder.


Lies. The "way nullsec works" is built on lies. You don't need to be a slave. You don't need to wait.

Highsec has the power to destroy nullsec and make Eve the PVP game it was intended to be.
Straight
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#190 - 2013-07-20 08:00:40 UTC
Uma D wrote:



How could one start a day better than having a big cup of delusion?

I just say:

Gather your Wolfpack and bring it on! Less talking more invading. We will be waiting for you. Oh you mighty high seccers, come and make us tremble in fear.

Little hint: The moment you become a threat to a 0.0 entity is the moment you turn into an entity using exactly the same methods you are trying to rally against here. Your little Wolfpack might keep a few people from shooting npcs in a few systems, but you will NEVER get ppl like yourself to be organised enough to have a real impact.

Feel free to proof me wrong! Destroy all the evil 0.0 alliances... gogogogo!!!




They are coming.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
CanI haveyourstuff
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#191 - 2013-07-20 08:13:24 UTC  |  Edited by: CanI haveyourstuff
Uma D wrote:
How could one start a day better than having a big cup of delusion?

I just say:

Gather your Wolfpack and bring it on! Less talking more invading. We will be waiting for you. Oh you mighty high seccers, come and make us tremble in fear.

Little hint: The moment you become a threat to a 0.0 entity is the moment you turn into an entity using exactly the same methods you are trying to rally against here. Your little Wolfpack might keep a few people from shooting npcs in a few systems, but you will NEVER get ppl like yourself to be organised enough to have a real impact.

Feel free to prove me wrong! Destroy all the evil 0.0 alliances... gogogogo!!!


Only one delusional here is you...

you cant comprehend that if hisec nerf happens then noone has to destroy your ass nor your alliance... that Bear will be blue to you in matter of days.

I've been in eve since eve started and I know how stuff works in null - do you? obviously not.

also 80% of times that random hisec Bear you see already has pvp char in null - bombshell news for you?
Uma D
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#192 - 2013-07-20 08:13:33 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Uma D wrote:



How could one start a day better than having a big cup of delusion?

I just say:

Gather your Wolfpack and bring it on! Less talking more invading. We will be waiting for you. Oh you mighty high seccers, come and make us tremble in fear.

Little hint: The moment you become a threat to a 0.0 entity is the moment you turn into an entity using exactly the same methods you are trying to rally against here. Your little Wolfpack might keep a few people from shooting npcs in a few systems, but you will NEVER get ppl like yourself to be organised enough to have a real impact.

Feel free to proof me wrong! Destroy all the evil 0.0 alliances... gogogogo!!!




They are coming.


OMG! Shooting stuff in one system. Now that makes a HUGE impact on 0.0.... Do your really think anyone really gives a flying **** about those ppl shooting some ppl ******** enough to get caught like that in VFK? Not even the Goons themslves take you serious enough to even care that you **** around in your home system let alone other alliances.

If you try to use that as proof i can do nothing but laugh at you.
Uma D
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#193 - 2013-07-20 08:17:28 UTC
CanI haveyourstuff wrote:
Uma D wrote:
How could one start a day better than having a big cup of delusion?

I just say:

Gather your Wolfpack and bring it on! Less talking more invading. We will be waiting for you. Oh you mighty high seccers, come and make us tremble in fear.

Little hint: The moment you become a threat to a 0.0 entity is the moment you turn into an entity using exactly the same methods you are trying to rally against here. Your little Wolfpack might keep a few people from shooting npcs in a few systems, but you will NEVER get ppl like yourself to be organised enough to have a real impact.

Feel free to prove me wrong! Destroy all the evil 0.0 alliances... gogogogo!!!


Only one delusional here is you...

you cant comprehend that if hisec nerf happens then noone has to destroy your ass nor your alliance... that Bear will be blue to you in matter of days.

I've been in eve since eve started and I know how stuff works in null - do you? obviously not.


Good luck trying to get blue standings to my alliance without paying billions of ISK to us.

Also.... I started playing eve dec 27th, 2003. I have seen enough alliances come and go and none of the ones that died, died because of a few missionrunners and miners who think they matter in the political landscape of eve.
Harry Forever
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#194 - 2013-07-20 08:22:43 UTC
null-sec needs a nerf, honestly, those are the true carebears, they think they are the risk takers but all they do is hide in their big alliances and hold hands with others there, scared of loosing their sov.

sov taking must be much more easier on the outside as compared to the center maybe, it should not be possible to have those huge alliances either, game mechanics have to be implemented that people there start fighting against eachother more often.

most people now, they join the game, do some stuff and then join one of the big alliances, then they feel like they did take huge risk and post about it on the forums, yea great you are all so hardcore...

Harry Forever vs. Goonswarm
CanI haveyourstuff
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#195 - 2013-07-20 08:23:27 UTC  |  Edited by: CanI haveyourstuff
Uma D wrote:
Good luck trying to get blue standings to my alliance without paying billions of ISK to us.

Also.... I started playing eve dec 27th, 2003. I have seen enough alliances come and go and none of the ones that died, died because of a few missionrunners and miners who think they matter in the political landscape of eve.


oh 2003, aw god damn man how can you let that **** through your fingers into these forums?

that Bear doesnt have to be blue especially to you.. you and your alliance are not the center of eve you know?!


in the end you still wont get anything out of it - are you really so stupid to think that nefing hisec will make more ppl move to null thus making more targets for you? They do move there but shooting them aint what you are going to do...


Instead moaning here about hisec and whatnot, better go and tell CCP how to fix solo / small gang pvp in generally.
Use yer brain there, might be more beneficial in a long shot.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#196 - 2013-07-20 08:29:28 UTC
Uma D wrote:
Good luck trying to get blue standings to my alliance without paying billions of ISK to us.



You know soontohaveyourstuff is in an NPC corp, right?

You seem a little angry. Why does the idea of PVP out in your little nullsec pocket scare you so much?

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Uma D
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#197 - 2013-07-20 08:32:20 UTC
CanI haveyourstuff wrote:
Uma D wrote:
Good luck trying to get blue standings to my alliance without paying billions of ISK to us.

Also.... I started playing eve dec 27th, 2003. I have seen enough alliances come and go and none of the ones that died, died because of a few missionrunners and miners who think they matter in the political landscape of eve.


oh 2003, aw god damn man how can you let that **** through your fingers into these forums?

that Bear doesnt have to be blue especially to you.. you and your alliance are not the center of eve you know?!


in the end you still wont get anything out of it - are you really so stupid to think that nefing hisec will make more ppl move to null thus making more targets for you? They do move there but shooting them aint what you are going to do...


Instead moaning here about hisec and whatnot, better go and tell CCP how to fix solo / small gang pvp in generally.
Use yer brain there, might be more beneficial in a long shot.


Whats wrong with solo / small gang pvp? Works fine for people who know how to do it right.
Uma D
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#198 - 2013-07-20 08:34:11 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
Uma D wrote:
Good luck trying to get blue standings to my alliance without paying billions of ISK to us.



You know soontohaveyourstuff is in an NPC corp, right?

You seem a little angry. Why does the idea of PVP out in your little nullsec pocket scare you so much?


Sry, to disappoint you, but I only ever undock in 0.0 to shoot ppl.... come to 0.0 go ahead....
CanI haveyourstuff
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#199 - 2013-07-20 08:35:17 UTC
Uma D wrote:
Whats wrong with solo / small gang pvp? Works fine for people who know how to do it right.


Well then, go do it right and quit moaning about hisec.
Uma D
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#200 - 2013-07-20 08:38:51 UTC
CanI haveyourstuff wrote:
Uma D wrote:
Whats wrong with solo / small gang pvp? Works fine for people who know how to do it right.


Well then, go do it right and quit moaning about hisec.


What does solo and small gang pvp have to do with the imbalance of ways to make money in different sec areas? care to explain?