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Pirate rebalance?
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Allandri
Liandri Industrial
#1 - 2013-07-19 02:52:24 UTC
Seeing as how we are now starting the Tech 2, any word on when the pirate line is going to get looked at?

I would like to see buffs to pirate frigates and tweaks to pirate cruisers while expecting nerfs to pirate battleships
Fronkfurter McSheebleton
Horse Feathers
CAStabouts
#2 - 2013-07-19 05:29:21 UTC
Allandri wrote:
I would like to see buffs to pirate frigates and tweaks to pirate cruisers while expecting nerfs to pirate battleships


Bit of a sweeping statement there, I think.

Among the frigates, the dramiel and daredevil are near to where they need to be, while the other three are vastly underpowered, so 2 tweaks, 3 buffs. Cruisers, the cynabal is a bit OP with its destroyer-like mobility, vigilant and gila are nice but tight on fitting, phantasm and ashimmu are downright awful...so 1 nerf, 2 tweaks, 2 buffs. Pirate level is anyone's guess, but I think we'll at least see the mach's speed/sig/scanres nerfed, and the rattler's bonuses tweaked so that either its missiles are a functional part of the ship, or they're dropped and its drones have another bonus.

thhief ghabmoef
Von Reichenbach
Maraque Enterprises
Just let it happen
#3 - 2013-07-19 06:04:50 UTC
Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:
[quote=Allandri]
Among the frigates, the dramiel and daredevil are near to where they need to be, while the other three are vastly underpowered, so 2 tweaks, 3 buffs. Cruisers, the cynabal is a bit OP with its destroyer-like mobility, vigilant and gila are nice but tight on fitting, phantasm and ashimmu are downright awful...so 1 nerf, 2 tweaks, 2 buffs. Pirate level is anyone's guess, but I think we'll at least see the mach's speed/sig/scanres nerfed, and the rattler's bonuses tweaked so that either its missiles are a functional part of the ship, or they're dropped and its drones have another bonus.


You forgot the two worst... Succubus and Worm... Those two ships are paperweights compared to the phantasm. I would love to fly the frig version of Gila or a Rattler... but right now it is a lesser son, to greater sires.
Aliventi
Rattini Tribe
Minmatar Fleet Alliance
#4 - 2013-07-19 06:12:55 UTC
It will happen is due time. I don't expect it to be done for Odyssey 1.1. The only other classes of ships that might be done in time for 1.1 is Marauders and BlOps BS in addition to the industrials and HACs. I would expect Pirate ships to be done in time for the Winter expansion which I expect to be heavily focused on nullsec.
Systems Online
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-07-19 06:22:25 UTC
Von Reichenbach wrote:
Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:
[quote=Allandri]
Among the frigates, the dramiel and daredevil are near to where they need to be, while the other three are vastly underpowered, so 2 tweaks, 3 buffs. Cruisers, the cynabal is a bit OP with its destroyer-like mobility, vigilant and gila are nice but tight on fitting, phantasm and ashimmu are downright awful...so 1 nerf, 2 tweaks, 2 buffs. Pirate level is anyone's guess, but I think we'll at least see the mach's speed/sig/scanres nerfed, and the rattler's bonuses tweaked so that either its missiles are a functional part of the ship, or they're dropped and its drones have another bonus.


You forgot the two worst... Succubus and Worm... Those two ships are paperweights compared to the phantasm. I would love to fly the frig version of Gila or a Rattler... but right now it is a lesser son, to greater sires.



The worm is.... okay. It's not anywhere near decent, but it's not the end of the world.

But from a popularity standpoint: "what is a succubus?"

Phantasm/Suc needs a major buff.
Fronkfurter McSheebleton
Horse Feathers
CAStabouts
#6 - 2013-07-19 07:57:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Fronkfurter McSheebleton
Von Reichenbach wrote:


You forgot the two worst... Succubus and Worm... .


Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:
while the other three are vastly underpowered



That would imply the Succubus, Worm, and Cruor...?

I'd say the cruor and succubus are a lot worse off than the worm, tbh.

thhief ghabmoef
Allandri
Liandri Industrial
#7 - 2013-07-19 08:30:32 UTC
Frigates:


  • Daredevil is a pretty good spot right now, might need to have some tweaks in relation to the recent buffs of Navy and T1 frigates
  • Dramiel, just like the Daredevil, is in a pretty good spot. Changing it to be slightly superior (stat wise) to the Firetail might be in order
  • Worm is pretty hamstrung but usable, would be interesting to see it be a drone version of the Hookbill
  • Succubus could become a shield tanking version of the IN Slicer
  • Cruor needs some tender love. Turn it into something similar to a Sentinel but tweaking the stats for Bloodraider obviously


Cruisers:


  • GIla should be better than the Navy Vexor and an option for a heavy drone boat outside of using an Ishtar
  • Ashimmu, when was the last time you saw one used?
  • Vigilant I think the bonuses could take having a look at with the recent buff to medium rails
  • Phantasm, same as the Ashimmu but with the recent buff to medium rails I think the bonuses could take having a look at
  • Cynabal, might need to be brought down to be slightly better but faster than an SFI
Anthar Thebess
#8 - 2013-07-19 10:29:50 UTC
Debora Tsung
Perkone
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-07-19 10:38:16 UTC
Anthar Thebess wrote:
Check this topic ;)
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=260318&find=unread


TehCloud wrote:
No.
Next.


Lol

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Allandri
Liandri Industrial
#10 - 2013-07-20 03:25:34 UTC
Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:
Allandri wrote:
I would like to see buffs to pirate frigates and tweaks to pirate cruisers while expecting nerfs to pirate battleships


Bit of a sweeping statement there, I think.

Among the frigates, the dramiel and daredevil are near to where they need to be, while the other three are vastly underpowered, so 2 tweaks, 3 buffs. Cruisers, the cynabal is a bit OP with its destroyer-like mobility, vigilant and gila are nice but tight on fitting, phantasm and ashimmu are downright awful...so 1 nerf, 2 tweaks, 2 buffs. Pirate level is anyone's guess, but I think we'll at least see the mach's speed/sig/scanres nerfed, and the rattler's bonuses tweaked so that either its missiles are a functional part of the ship, or they're dropped and its drones have another bonus.


But what about the Nightmare, Vindicator, and Bhaalgorn?
Aliventi
Rattini Tribe
Minmatar Fleet Alliance
#11 - 2013-07-20 03:57:48 UTC
You have to remember with buffing and tweaking things that Pirate is supposed to be the best in the game. You also have to remember that each pirate race has its own flavor. People say the Cynabal is OP because it is fast and does a lot of damage. In reality it is fast, does great DPS, but doesn't have that great of tank which balances it out and corresponds to the Angel Cartel's way of building ships. It is more likely that the rest of the ships will be brought up to the Cynabals level than for the Cynabal to be brought down to their level of you follow the tiericide chart.

Also, the cynabal, bhaalgorn, Vindicator, Mach are all shining or near-shining examples of what a pirate ship should be. I hope CCP balances up to their level.
Allandri
Liandri Industrial
#12 - 2013-07-20 04:27:10 UTC
If they plan on keeping them at those levels then material requirements need to go up
Allandri
Liandri Industrial
#13 - 2013-07-21 01:39:05 UTC
Aliventi wrote:
You have to remember with buffing and tweaking things that Pirate is supposed to be the best in the game. You also have to remember that each pirate race has its own flavor. People say the Cynabal is OP because it is fast and does a lot of damage. In reality it is fast, does great DPS, but doesn't have that great of tank which balances it out and corresponds to the Angel Cartel's way of building ships. It is more likely that the rest of the ships will be brought up to the Cynabals level than for the Cynabal to be brought down to their level of you follow the tiericide chart.

Also, the cynabal, bhaalgorn, Vindicator, Mach are all shining or near-shining examples of what a pirate ship should be. I hope CCP balances up to their level.


CCP also follows the philosophy of an exponential increase in price for a linear increase in power / utility
Aliventi
Rattini Tribe
Minmatar Fleet Alliance
#14 - 2013-07-21 02:56:09 UTC
Allandri wrote:

CCP also follows the philosophy of an exponential increase in price for a linear increase in power / utility

Very true. Pirate ships already outpace the cost of Navy by a margin. Those that don't are the ones that are in the need of the most rebalance. There may also be price manipulation/drop rate issues that effect the price in ways that are challenging to balance. Also, pirate ship prices have slipped from their highs due to other T1/Navy/T2 ships being rebalanced.
Whitehound
#15 - 2013-07-21 07:43:19 UTC
The Mach needs a nerf to its drones.

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