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Why nerf high sec?

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Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#121 - 2013-07-18 13:44:04 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Benny Ohu wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Prove me wrong?

there's no need - you've provided nothing to indicate you are right.

you can start with nullsec ratting being ten times more profitable than missions or incursions, please

Missions pay at max 70 million per hour, thats in high sec and only specific missions. In null you can make 500 million, up to billions of isk if you get lucky on spawns. 10 times is imo being rather ungenerous.

As for incursions as I stated, no idea, theyre not soloable.

What I was asking was proof they were being "forced" to dock. That was the claim.



Lying should be a bannable offense lol.

Like others have said, please explain how you can constantly make 500 mil per hour doing PVE in null.

The reason people crap on high sec in GD is because too many high sec posters aren't just illogical and risk-averse, they are dishonest as well. If you have any experience with null sec pve you know good and well that average isk/hr is no where near 500 mil an hour. Dual Boxing a mach and domi I make 140 to 180 mil, hell i've quad-boxed Carriers and made 250 to 300 mil but that was pushing hard. And that's all when left perfectly alone, but sometimes you have to deal with neutrals and competeing with alliance mates for the best anoms.

How can high sec people on the one hand know that "null is empty" while on the other hand thing "500 mil per hour is standard in null" lol. Null sec would be stuffed full of PVE folks i you could make that much.

Why don't you actually try some null PVE Infinity, see for yourself that it's not all 10/10s and officer spawns (i've seen 2 officer spawns since 2008).
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#122 - 2013-07-18 15:49:25 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
I'd pose the opposite question to you.

Why not nerf highsec? It's become, thanks to some pretty loud QQ from various groups, rather more safe than it was ever intended to be. It stands out like the Blue Man Group in an A.A. meeting, especially compared to the other portions of the game, which are a complete 180 from highsec.

One could easily argue that it's disingenuous of the game as a whole, and leads new players to an unreasonable expectation of safety in the game, with disappointing results.

So, yeah, why not nerf highsec?

Because many players enjoy it the way it is.

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Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#123 - 2013-07-18 16:02:48 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
I'd pose the opposite question to you.

Why not nerf highsec? It's become, thanks to some pretty loud QQ from various groups, rather more safe than it was ever intended to be. It stands out like the Blue Man Group in an A.A. meeting, especially compared to the other portions of the game, which are a complete 180 from highsec.

One could easily argue that it's disingenuous of the game as a whole, and leads new players to an unreasonable expectation of safety in the game, with disappointing results.

So, yeah, why not nerf highsec?

Because many players enjoy it the way it is.


And that's a reason to not right a wrong because? Selfishness is not something a game developer should consider when it comes to game balance.

Many players enjoyed the HELL out of nano ships 4 years ago. Other players enjoyed the hell out of thoraxes with 10 drones or space mines at gates. I enjoyed the loads and loads and LOADS of Isk I made from Faction Warfare and Incursions before their respective nerfs. I enjoyed Data Core Farming meaning I didn't have to rat much to plex 4 accounts etc etc.

Am I crying about any of it? No, because I knew those things were imbalanced when I was enjoying them and I know it can and will happen again...it can't be long before my beloved Winmatar are made less win by CCP...just like they did when i started the game and Gallente were kings of pvp lol.
Sharise Dragonstar
Big Strong
Hisec Miners
#124 - 2013-07-18 16:07:40 UTC
It makes more sense to earn more isk in high sec than it does any other sec. You don't see the big banks and other businesses having there bases in 3rd world countries strife with civil wars and other issues. They base themselves in affluent cities where it is safer. High sec should reflect that. There is more ISK in low/null sec than high its just a bit harder to get which makes sense as you are running in systems either not policed or policed by players that will shoot you on sight. Exploration sites drop better gear and belt rats are worth more bounty than those in high. Mining is probably more profitable in high sec as is missioning (which is not really available in low-null). The only real difference between high and null is in high you mission and null you pvp.Mining is only unsafe if you mine in a place you not welcome in null sec but making freinds helps. I rotate about weekly with null and high...don't go low and I earn almost double the isk in null than I do in high and I am super paranoid about null that i even dock up when nuetrals enter the system.
Jenn aSide
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#125 - 2013-07-18 16:19:16 UTC
Sharise Dragonstar wrote:
It makes more sense to earn more isk in high sec than it does any other sec. You don't see the big banks and other businesses having there bases in 3rd world countries strife with civil wars and other issues. They base themselves in affluent cities where it is safer. High sec should reflect that.


A video game set 40,000 years in the future about immortal spacemen flying space-submarines should work the same way 21st century business does?

That makes total sense.
CompleteFailure
DAWGS Corp.
Negative Feedback
#126 - 2013-07-18 16:40:11 UTC
Bill Overbeck wrote:

High sec is safe - hence the name HIGH SECURITY.


^^THIS is where you are going wrong. High sec is not safe, nor is it (or was it ever) supposed to be. High sec provides greater consequences for aggressive actions, that's it. Your whole argument is based on a false assumption.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#127 - 2013-07-18 16:53:18 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
I'd pose the opposite question to you.

Why not nerf highsec? It's become, thanks to some pretty loud QQ from various groups, rather more safe than it was ever intended to be. It stands out like the Blue Man Group in an A.A. meeting, especially compared to the other portions of the game, which are a complete 180 from highsec.

One could easily argue that it's disingenuous of the game as a whole, and leads new players to an unreasonable expectation of safety in the game, with disappointing results.

So, yeah, why not nerf highsec?

Because many players enjoy it the way it is.


Heh, so complacency? That's the best answer I can get?

It does explain why people get so upset over lost pixels though.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Victoria Sin
Doomheim
#128 - 2013-07-18 16:56:19 UTC
High Sec is crap. Good for industry if that's your thing, but otherwise pretty much everything sucks compared to its null sec equivalent.

Don't see any need to "nerf" it.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#129 - 2013-07-18 17:05:17 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:



No one cares because they accept that high sec has an element of risk.


Nobody cares because a pilgrim is harmless to them.

I flew a nightmare in high sec for years and at no point was I worried about getting shot at by players.
Isaac Collins
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#130 - 2013-07-18 17:19:19 UTC
How did they nerf High sec? I haven't read anything in patch notes.
E'ara Koshun
The Order of the golden Sun
#131 - 2013-07-18 17:30:29 UTC
Bill Overbeck wrote:
Most of the anti high sec arguments seem to sum up to "This is a sandbox, but this is MY sandbox! Your input, nor presence, is not wanted!"


simply that
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#132 - 2013-07-18 17:35:29 UTC
E'ara Koshun wrote:
Bill Overbeck wrote:
Most of the anti high sec arguments seem to sum up to "This is a sandbox, but this is MY sandbox! Your input, nor presence, is not wanted!"


simply that


How so? I more frequently see "arguments", if they can be called that, on the other side of the coin. "Ganking is an exploit!" "nerf market scams", "need moar tank on barges", and other such.

Basically attempting to screw someone else's playstyle. The vast majority of the people clamoring for some part or other of the game to be nerfed, are highsec players asking for everyone else to get nerfed, and for highsec to get safer and safer.

For a lot of people, that's why nerf highsec. Because it has not stopped getting safer and safer as the game gets older. Highsec has been getting power creep for too long. Time to rein that in.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#133 - 2013-07-18 17:52:12 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
E'ara Koshun wrote:
Bill Overbeck wrote:
Most of the anti high sec arguments seem to sum up to "This is a sandbox, but this is MY sandbox! Your input, nor presence, is not wanted!"


simply that


How so? I more frequently see "arguments", if they can be called that, on the other side of the coin. "Ganking is an exploit!" "nerf market scams", "need moar tank on barges", and other such.

Basically attempting to screw someone else's playstyle. The vast majority of the people clamoring for some part or other of the game to be nerfed, are highsec players asking for everyone else to get nerfed, and for highsec to get safer and safer.

For a lot of people, that's why nerf highsec. Because it has not stopped getting safer and safer as the game gets older. Highsec has been getting power creep for too long. Time to rein that in.


I see your argument just fine but what if it was intended by the devs for it to be exactly how it is right now? Did any dev ever say high sec was too safe? The fact that it was less safe before does nto mean it was in a better place from the devs point of view and as we can all understand, they have the final word over the discussion.

They just re-did the security system with retribution. Do you belive they did all that while thinking the penalty for ganking should be lesser so as to generate more potential risk in high sec?
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#134 - 2013-07-18 18:05:22 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Sov null PVE - basically risk free isk printing 500 mill per hour


lol any other lies?

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#135 - 2013-07-18 18:09:37 UTC
Sharise Dragonstar wrote:
It makes more sense to earn more isk in high sec than it does any other sec. You don't see the big banks and other businesses having there bases in 3rd world countries strife with civil wars and other issues. They base themselves in affluent cities where it is safer. High sec should reflect that. There is more ISK in low/null sec than high its just a bit harder to get which makes sense as you are running in systems either not policed or policed by players that will shoot you on sight. Exploration sites drop better gear and belt rats are worth more bounty than those in high. Mining is probably more profitable in high sec as is missioning (which is not really available in low-null). The only real difference between high and null is in high you mission and null you pvp.Mining is only unsafe if you mine in a place you not welcome in null sec but making freinds helps. I rotate about weekly with null and high...don't go low and I earn almost double the isk in null than I do in high and I am super paranoid about null that i even dock up when nuetrals enter the system.


"Guys listen to my bullshit real world comparisons, this is why a game which is not supposed to be realistic should be completely unbalanced"

Also I don't think the police respond in 30 seconds in even the safest cities

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Butzewutze
Doomheim
#136 - 2013-07-18 18:13:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Butzewutze
Kyperion wrote:
most high sec people don't really have the income levels to maintain that sort of thing.... They want to kill a few rocks/rats and enjoy their time.... preferrably away from epeen null/lowsec antisocial scumbags.


There is a testserver where you can mine all day long without even seeing another ship in local. Also there are singleplayergames like X. You might prefer that if you dont like to play with others.

Its funny that you call others antisocial.
CanI haveyourstuff
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#137 - 2013-07-18 18:25:38 UTC  |  Edited by: CanI haveyourstuff
there's no god damn risk in null if you do it right.. so gtfo with your risk and reward crap. Thats coming from player who has been here since 2005.

if CCP nerfs hisec then you wont believe your eyes how much all your pvp pew pew crap will cost in about month. How much less people you see around, much less everything.

huge amount of people keep their accounts up with plex too.... you cant go into null and expect to make plex in the end of month - you might be nicely ****** and say bye bye to eve.


EVE has problem that oldies gank newbs and think this is fun and real PVP.. well it's not, it's utter crap


CCP should delete warp scramblers (acutally make them have diminishing returns or smth) and cloaks from game, then you would see really good solo pvp, small gang pvp... more interesting setups and ships in pvp - not only cookie cutters and fotms.


I do not find anything interesting being in null and trying to do pvp for god damn 5 hours and get maybe 1 legit fight out of it.. it just ****

oh and that blobware lagfest, tower bashing boredom no thanx... it's more stupid than killing 9000 pigs in WOW and collecting their tails or whatever... srsly
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#138 - 2013-07-18 18:29:32 UTC
"Guys EVE hi-sec should totally be more realistic like suburban America!"

"OK the government is going to take 45% of everything you make and it takes a week to buy a new weapon. We good?"

"...."

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#139 - 2013-07-18 18:34:28 UTC
CanI haveyourstuff wrote:
there's no god damn risk in null if you do it right.. so gtfo with your risk and reward crap. Thats coming from player who has been here since 2005.


again, any other lies?

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#140 - 2013-07-18 18:39:24 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
"Guys EVE hi-sec should totally be more realistic like suburban America!"

"OK the government is going to take 45% of everything you make and it takes a week to buy a new weapon. We good?"

"...."


Taxes on all shipment crossing the border. Any corp/alliance labeled as rogue if they posses WMD (any cap/supercap msot likely) thus suffering more retardation when trying to enter empire territory.

Yeah, everything would be broken. Not just high sec.