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Why nerf high sec?

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Uma D
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#61 - 2013-07-18 07:28:03 UTC
Kyperion wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Kyperion wrote:
Also, there is a MUCH higher probability of a solo Missioner losing a ship to an NPC than a pirate losing a ship to a miner/missioner.
Not really, no, and even if it were, it doesn't particularly matter.

Oh, and if you feel that ganking is so much easier, why don't you engage in it yourself?

Quote:
if they wanted PVP 'RISK AND REWARD' they'd be in low/null
Why would they, when the targets and the money are in high?

Quote:
Again, it boils down to the scumbags wanting cheap no risk kills
How so? And so what? Oh, and why are they scumbags when what they do isn't much different from what, say, mission-runners do?


1.) I don't gank because I actually like a challenge, so I take oddball fits into missions... which actually takes some management and skill, unlike pirating in high sec.

2.) trying to have your cake and eat it are we? Lambast high sec for no risk, then want to freely engage ridiculously easy targets in high sec claiming its somehow risky?

3.) Mission runners kill NPC pirates, who shoot back, and can actually hurt the player.... pirates engage or trick people who are in suboptimal fits and are minding their own business trying to enjoy a game that they are actually PAYING for as opposed to your typical plexed pirate multibox player.



1) Ganking can take a lot more effort than running Level 4 missions in high sec. If you know what you are doing in fact its stupidly easy and has no risk at all, other than maybe suicide ganker (allthough none of my missionrunning chars ever got suicided while playing eve for more than 10 years!) But i guess i must be doing it wrong then.

2) You chose to be easy and especially profitable targets. Its your own fault.

3) Who stops you from shooting back... only your own cowardice. Be the social being you pretend to be and team up with others and you will not be that easy target anymore.
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#62 - 2013-07-18 07:28:17 UTC
Uma D wrote:
Xen Solarus wrote:


Why hunt for targets in areas of space where they could potentially shoot back, when there is an entire region full of defenceless players that can't / won't / don't want to fight back?



Could you please give me a link explaining the game mechanic which prevents people in high sec to defend themselves? The only reason people in high sec are easy to kill is the fact that they refuse to work in a team.

Who is stopping you from using a command ship in a mining fleet in high sec that will boost your tank, to make it a lot harder for suicide gankers to kill you? Who is stopping you from escorting freighters with logistics ships and scouting trade routes before you fly your freighter through there?

Who is forcing you to fly around in PvE fitted ships solo when you are at war?

If you are an easy target in high sec, the only reason for that is that you choose to be one.


There is no way for a solo player to prevent themselves from being alpha'd.

Not even in a Titan.


internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#63 - 2013-07-18 07:30:16 UTC
Cipher Jones wrote:
There is no way for a solo player to prevent themselves from being alpha'd.
Yes there is: make sure you're not worth it.
Uma D
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#64 - 2013-07-18 07:30:55 UTC
Cipher Jones wrote:
Uma D wrote:
Xen Solarus wrote:


Why hunt for targets in areas of space where they could potentially shoot back, when there is an entire region full of defenceless players that can't / won't / don't want to fight back?



Could you please give me a link explaining the game mechanic which prevents people in high sec to defend themselves? The only reason people in high sec are easy to kill is the fact that they refuse to work in a team.

Who is stopping you from using a command ship in a mining fleet in high sec that will boost your tank, to make it a lot harder for suicide gankers to kill you? Who is stopping you from escorting freighters with logistics ships and scouting trade routes before you fly your freighter through there?

Who is forcing you to fly around in PvE fitted ships solo when you are at war?

If you are an easy target in high sec, the only reason for that is that you choose to be one.


There is no way for a solo player to prevent themselves from being alpha'd.

Not even in a Titan.




There is no way to alpha a decent tanked ship solo for profit.
Adunh Slavy
#65 - 2013-07-18 07:31:47 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Adunh Slavy wrote:
You can make more in Manhattan than Mogadishu, go figure.
Too bad that this is a game that needs balance, not real life.



Yes Eve is game, but its flaw is, it is played by humans. Good luck changing human nature. I'm sure CCP will try, and like every other social architect wanna be, they will fail. Since Eve is a game, they can set all the rules in opposition to human nature in an attempt to change behavior, but sooner or later the real world will win.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Kyperion
#66 - 2013-07-18 07:31:51 UTC
Uma D wrote:
Xen Solarus wrote:


Why hunt for targets in areas of space where they could potentially shoot back, when there is an entire region full of defenceless players that can't / won't / don't want to fight back?



Could you please give me a link explaining the game mechanic which prevents people in high sec to defend themselves? The only reason people in high sec are easy to kill is the fact that they refuse to work in a team.

Who is stopping you from using a command ship in a mining fleet in high sec that will boost your tank, to make it a lot harder for suicide gankers to kill you? Who is stopping you from escorting freighters with logistics ships and scouting trade routes before you fly your freighter through there?

Who is forcing you to fly around in PvE fitted ships solo when you are at war?

If you are an easy target in high sec, the only reason for that is that you choose to be one.

Another ridiculous epeen post.

Mission fits and missions themselves make PVE centered players easy targets for pirates....

Command ships take forever to train, cost WAY more to fit than a gank ship, and most high sec people don't really have the income levels to maintain that sort of thing.... They want to kill a few rocks/rats and enjoy their time.... preferrably away from epeen null/lowsec antisocial scumbags.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#67 - 2013-07-18 07:37:37 UTC
Adunh Slavy wrote:
[Yes Eve is game, but its flaw is, it is played by humans. Good luck changing human nature.
As luck would have it, the location of industry is not part of human nature and can therefore be skewed towards low and nullsec just fine.

Kyperion wrote:
Mission fits and missions themselves make PVE centered players easy targets for pirates.
…if you choose to. You can also choose not to. Your choice.

Quote:
Command ships take forever to train, cost WAY more to fit than a gank ship, and most high sec people don't really have the income levels to maintain that sort of thing.
There is no maintenance cost, and the cost of the Command ship is pretty small on the scale of things. The point is that the tools are there. It's your choice whether to use them or not.
Kyperion
#68 - 2013-07-18 07:38:03 UTC
Uma D wrote:
Cipher Jones wrote:
Uma D wrote:
Xen Solarus wrote:


Why hunt for targets in areas of space where they could potentially shoot back, when there is an entire region full of defenceless players that can't / won't / don't want to fight back?



Could you please give me a link explaining the game mechanic which prevents people in high sec to defend themselves? The only reason people in high sec are easy to kill is the fact that they refuse to work in a team.

Who is stopping you from using a command ship in a mining fleet in high sec that will boost your tank, to make it a lot harder for suicide gankers to kill you? Who is stopping you from escorting freighters with logistics ships and scouting trade routes before you fly your freighter through there?

Who is forcing you to fly around in PvE fitted ships solo when you are at war?

If you are an easy target in high sec, the only reason for that is that you choose to be one.


There is no way for a solo player to prevent themselves from being alpha'd.

Not even in a Titan.




There is no way to alpha a decent tanked ship solo for profit.

There is no thinking human who believes highsec pirates do it for profit... they do it because it is easy killmails and zero risk.
Uma D
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#69 - 2013-07-18 07:39:19 UTC
Kyperion wrote:
Uma D wrote:
Xen Solarus wrote:


Why hunt for targets in areas of space where they could potentially shoot back, when there is an entire region full of defenceless players that can't / won't / don't want to fight back?



Could you please give me a link explaining the game mechanic which prevents people in high sec to defend themselves? The only reason people in high sec are easy to kill is the fact that they refuse to work in a team.

Who is stopping you from using a command ship in a mining fleet in high sec that will boost your tank, to make it a lot harder for suicide gankers to kill you? Who is stopping you from escorting freighters with logistics ships and scouting trade routes before you fly your freighter through there?

Who is forcing you to fly around in PvE fitted ships solo when you are at war?

If you are an easy target in high sec, the only reason for that is that you choose to be one.

Another ridiculous epeen post.

Mission fits and missions themselves make PVE centered players easy targets for pirates....

Command ships take forever to train, cost WAY more to fit than a gank ship, and most high sec people don't really have the income levels to maintain that sort of thing.... They want to kill a few rocks/rats and enjoy their time.... preferrably away from epeen null/lowsec antisocial scumbags.


No one forces you to run Missions solo in a ship worth billions of ISK. Who are the Epeen ppl here? T2 / faction fitted ships run mission totally fine and are not worth suicide ganking. Officer / Deadspace fitted ships are worth it. it is your choice.

Not the income you say? How can a corporation with several missionrunners who each easily earn 60mil+ / hour when they know what they are doing not afford something like command ships? Also how can you fly around in ships that are worth suiciding but would not be able to afford something like that? Maybe you just need to rearrange your priorities.

Skill training time is a bad excuse for not wanting to invest the time. You just want to do your stuff solo and point at the evil gankers saying they are anti-social.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#70 - 2013-07-18 07:40:59 UTC
Kyperion wrote:
There is no thinking human who believes highsec pirates do it for profit.
You've got your negations mixed up a bit there. No thinking human believes highsec pirates don't do it for profit. That's why is such a ridiculously rare event: because the cost of ganking has gone up, and as people have learned to fit their ships properly (or fill their cargo holds more judiciously in the case of haulers), the rewards have gone down.
Kyperion
#71 - 2013-07-18 07:41:40 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Adunh Slavy wrote:
[Yes Eve is game, but its flaw is, it is played by humans. Good luck changing human nature.
As luck would have it, the location of industry is not part of human nature and can therefore be skewed towards low and nullsec just fine.

Kyperion wrote:
Mission fits and missions themselves make PVE centered players easy targets for pirates.
…if you choose to. You can also choose not to. Your choice.

Quote:
Command ships take forever to train, cost WAY more to fit than a gank ship, and most high sec people don't really have the income levels to maintain that sort of thing.
There is no maintenance cost, and the cost of the Command ship is pretty small on the scale of things. The point is that the tools are there. It's your choice whether to use them or not.

Command ships and fittings are not small scale to high sec players derp derp, maybe to null/lowsec blob alliance players. .... which again points to the fact that high sec needs no money making nerf....

in fact, it goes counter to your own interests if you want highsec nerfed, by your own logic you will reduce your supposed reason for highsec PVP.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#72 - 2013-07-18 07:43:52 UTC
Kyperion wrote:
Command ships and fittings are not small scale to high sec players
Compared to the equipment needed for high-end mission running and mining, they sure are, and they're a drop in the bucket compared to the kind of income you can get and the benfits they provide towards earning that income.

Quote:
in fact, it goes counter to your own interests if you want highsec nerfed
How so?
Uma D
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#73 - 2013-07-18 07:46:17 UTC
Kyperion wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Adunh Slavy wrote:
[Yes Eve is game, but its flaw is, it is played by humans. Good luck changing human nature.
As luck would have it, the location of industry is not part of human nature and can therefore be skewed towards low and nullsec just fine.

Kyperion wrote:
Mission fits and missions themselves make PVE centered players easy targets for pirates.
…if you choose to. You can also choose not to. Your choice.

Quote:
Command ships take forever to train, cost WAY more to fit than a gank ship, and most high sec people don't really have the income levels to maintain that sort of thing.
There is no maintenance cost, and the cost of the Command ship is pretty small on the scale of things. The point is that the tools are there. It's your choice whether to use them or not.

Command ships and fittings are not small scale to high sec players derp derp, maybe to null/lowsec blob alliance players. .... which again points to the fact that high sec needs no money making nerf....

in fact, it goes counter to your own interests if you want highsec nerfed, by your own logic you will reduce your supposed reason for highsec PVP.


So judging by your logic no1 in high sec would be able to afford an "industrial command ship" (orca) which is way more expansive than an ordinary command ship.

Wonder where all those are coming from.
Starkiller Lothlorien
Doomheim
#74 - 2013-07-18 07:51:05 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
I'd pose the opposite question to you.

Why not nerf highsec? It's become, thanks to some pretty loud QQ from various groups, rather more safe than it was ever intended to be. It stands out like the Blue Man Group in an A.A. meeting, especially compared to the other portions of the game, which are a complete 180 from highsec.

One could easily argue that it's disingenuous of the game as a whole, and leads new players to an unreasonable expectation of safety in the game, with disappointing results.

So, yeah, why not nerf highsec?


Not unreasonable if stay in hisec. Hisec safety level give good example to noobs of hisec safety level.

Staying in hisec good for two reasons. 1. Safe. 2. Losec full of cockerels.
Adunh Slavy
#75 - 2013-07-18 07:52:32 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Adunh Slavy wrote:
[Yes Eve is game, but its flaw is, it is played by humans. Good luck changing human nature.
As luck would have it, the location of industry is not part of human nature and can therefore be skewed towards low and nullsec just fine.



ROFL, way to miss the point.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#76 - 2013-07-18 08:07:31 UTC
It's way too hot for this. Any talk of "nerfing hi-sec" is forum rabble rabble.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#77 - 2013-07-18 08:08:46 UTC
Paging Dinsdale! Dinsdale Pirhana, cleanup in this Thread!

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Lipbite
Express Hauler
#78 - 2013-07-18 08:19:27 UTC
> Why nerf high sec?

For StarCitizen to get another 15 millions $$$ in pledges.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#79 - 2013-07-18 08:30:29 UTC
Kyperion wrote:
There is no thinking human who believes highsec pirates do it for profit... they do it because it is easy killmails and zero risk.


piracy is inherently done for profit, hope this helps

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#80 - 2013-07-18 08:41:07 UTC
In terms of isk / risk from easiest to hardest

Sov null PVE - basically risk free isk printing 500 mill per hour
High Sec PVE - 70 mill per hour
WH Space PVE - not sure per hour but quite risky due to no local
Low Sec PVE - screw this

If we're going to point fingers lets start at the top maybe?

Left out incursions because never done them

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)