Wormholes

After the rail buff, shield kiting prots are going to be IWIN buttons.

We tested a Vindicator today with only 2 scimis agaisnt an 60 man kitchen fleet on a wormhole. The vindi killed everything and survived in structure. 3 v 60 ftw. This may work.

I will try to address the "problems" as I've encountered them, and suggest possible fixes.
Being a wormhole denizen myself, my experience, offensively, and defensibly with tech 3's is this: Between my toons, I use and fly all four of them for what it's worth.

--You faction fit t3's. Not tech two, but faction, or even deadspace. You want every bang for your ship's buck, especially in wh space, so you're going to get better results out of it because of that.

--Hacs suck at the moment

--The loki, from my experience, is about perfectly balanced. You have to chose between tank or gank. The proteus and to some extent the tengu can do both while having bonuses to ewar.

--The proteus and tengu are the two "OP" if anything: The proteus gets over 1k dps, while having more low slots than a legion (being amarr, that's odd). Doing as much damage as a battleship...in a cruiser hull...causes issues.
my old HAMgu is an issue-950-1k dps with implants, BUT you have to sacrifice tank and/or propulsion mods to do so. Which basically balances it out.

For the stats I fly with and run into, I frequently see these numbers:
Legion (ham or laser), 80k ehp @750dps; or 125k ehp @650 dps (I have a dual plate fit that's 163k ehp @646 dps, but the resistances are mediocre)
Loki (armor): 100k ehp @650 dps; (shield) 70k ehp @800 dps
Protues: 163k ehp @950 dps; 195k ehp @800 dps
tengu (hm): 105k-85k ehp @635 dps; (ham) 110k ehp @775 dps [my cloaky ham tengu does 545 dps]


Possible fixes:
--If anything, the legion needs a slight buff; one more low slot added to the augmented plating and adaptive augmentor should fix that. If you cloak fit it, you're usually running 5 low slots compared to the proteus' 7.
--revoke a low slot on the proteus-then you will have to live with a resist hole and gank, or lose damage for a better tank (like the current legion)
Tengu-I think is actually OK (shock, burn me at the stake!). You have to chose between tank and gank...usually
The loki is in great shape I think, but it got hit by the resistance nerf. It could go for an amount subsystem.

I think once we pass the 800dps ,mark on a cruiser hull, we get into dangerous territory. Looking at the stats, i'd say the legion needs a slight buff (1 more low slot with an extra 10 or so CPU), and the proteus needs a slight nerf, but I fly it the least so I can't suggest a satisfactory compromise. It's the only one on my list that gets an amazing tank and amazing dps. Better than some battleships, and better than a lot of current command ships.

WH life is not about making ISK primary.
Its like to be sitting on your own Island.
W-Space is for individualists, who get tired from the old world.

Please post fittings.. and how much isk do you put in it.
Everyone say someting abbout OP T3 but no one say how much ISK where spend for the ship.

Sure thing!
high dps ham legion
normal laser legion
normal proteus
cloaky proteus
cloaky legion

Now all those are tailored to some personal preference, and your views of a better fit will differ. I don't fit a damage control for one, just a personal preference. I'm estimating prices are around the 750 mil mark; faction heatsinks are of course cheaper than FN magstabs. No fleet boosts applied.

Also change out tech 2 ammo for faction where you would use it-I would rarely use conflagration up close unless both it and myself weren't moving quickly. my gallente friends dislike void for that reason. CN antimatter drops 100dps off the non-cloaked prot.

If you downgrade to tech 1 trimarks, then ehp changes to this, respectively:
no change; 129k ehp; 119.8k ehp; 119.8k ehp; 102k ehp.
another oddity is that the proteus can keep 7 lowslots in the cloaked configuration, wheras the legion drops to 5. I keep noticing more oddities as I delve into this more thoughtfully. (like why does the loki webbing subsystem take away a midslot? so you can't shield tank and do ewar at the same time?)

Why noany speak about range of fire on the Proteus vs others T3? Before proteus can make any damage the others T3s can open fire, scram, web and even run away with 100mn AB. Why noany speak how easy take off that " overpovered" dps just by using neutralizers (yep cap needed for shoot ;p )

And how about rails? All others T3 have chose long or short dps fit but only proteus have this ****** rails for chose.
..

Overpowered or under-powered, it's all relative. You can't make a fit on eft, compare it to other ships and say use that to make an argument as to whether the ship needs a nerf. PVP in eve doesn't work like that as we are not all running around soloing each other.

It's not a game of rock, paper, scissors when that cloaky proteus is only pointing you so his 5 friends can come and get on the killmail.

here's a Harbinger fit that costs about the same:

gets a little less tank and a bit more DPS.

Try use that battlecruiser with dreads shooting to you on the grid. T3 are a lot better than BC in that case ;).... But now i go to try fit Astarte or Vigilant with 800kk fit ;)))