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Nightmare Lows for Level 4's

Author
IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#21 - 2013-07-10 14:07:55 UTC
Wow some ummm "interesting" fits posted here.

I use a cap booster with 2 TC in the mids and lows with 1 TE + 4 faction heatsinks.


A deadspace shield booster is helpful but the rest of the tank is fine with T2. Using faction or deadspace invulns and SBA paint a sign on your ship that says "please gank me"

If you're having issues with tank it means you're not putting out enough DPS to kill the rats fast enough. Your gun DPS should be at least 750 with multifreq. If it's any less than that something is wrong with your skills or fitting. You want the gun DPS to be around 1000.

Also faction or T2 crystals are standard practice for any laser ship since they don't cost much and last a long time. The extra DPS will pay for itself.
Julius Priscus
#22 - 2013-07-10 15:53:08 UTC
REALLY????

there is so many levels of fail on this fit.

Kozlack wrote:
[Nightmare, New Setup 1]
Caldari Navy Power Diagnostic System
Caldari Navy Power Diagnostic System
True Sansha Heat Sink
True Sansha Heat Sink
True Sansha Heat Sink

Gist X-Type X-Large Shield Booster
Pith X-Type Shield Boost Amplifier
Pithum C-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field
Pithum C-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

Tachyon Beam Laser II, Multifrequency L
Tachyon Beam Laser II, Multifrequency L
Tachyon Beam Laser II, Multifrequency L
Tachyon Beam Laser II, Multifrequency L
[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I



Train for T2 guns....

Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#23 - 2013-07-10 16:17:42 UTC
Shereza wrote:
Kozlack wrote:
Uhh no, the reason to use T2 is that the T2 skill makes guns do more damage... l2p.


Covered that. Faction do 95% of the damage at 76% of the capacitor consumption when using T1 and faction crystals. That leaves using T2 damage crystals to "make guns do more damage" which gets trumped by pulse lasers.

Kozlack wrote:
Amarr BS 4/5 means you dont need TE's/TC's, besides that fact that anything buring right at you has super low transversal.


Tracking enhancers and computers do more than boost tracking, they boost optimal range and falloff. I rather like being able to eke out 44km optimal with tachyons. Of course I also like being able to peg frigates at 15km and under and avoiding as much as possible situations such as the one I find my machariel in all too frequently where NPC frigates are able to avoid all but its first round of fire at them until they get in so close not even ACs will hit them and I have to deploy drones.

I'm still puzzled by that one. The frigates come rushing in, orbit one of the ships I have in the mission area, and the entire time my machariel can't even touch them. It can't touch them when they're coming in from 40km out, it can't touch them as they close in, it can't touch them as it burns out to 40km, and I generally have to resort to using drones to off them. All things considered I doubt that enhancing the tracking on my ships, especially on tachyon lasers, is going to help reduce the chances of something like that happening, but at the very least it provides a placebo effect.

Kozlack wrote:
AND if you're doing L4's that are heavy TD'n you then you need to just get a raven with some faction launchers (Because missile spec 5 DOES NOT make T2 lauchers ROF faster then faction) and pewpew the stuff.


Or an armageddon. It would take many players a bit to recover from either fit we posted if they were to build it from scratch and didn't already have comparable modules laying about, and a cheaper alternative to a navy raven is useful.

don't bash this guy. clearly, he is 'special'...

I should buy an Ishtar.

Hank Hakaarii
Doomheim
#24 - 2013-07-10 18:22:47 UTC
So here's what I ended up doing...

Highs:

Imperial Navy Tach Beams with Imperial Navy Crystals. Multi, Ultra, and Microwave for their respective ranges. Currently the Microwave will reach out further than I can target.

Mids:

Pith X Large Shield Booster
Large ASB
Caldari Navy Shield Boost Amplifier
Caldari Navy Adaptive Invuln
Caldari Navy Mission Specific
Caldari Navy Secondary Mission Specific
Tracking Computer (Meta 4 due to skills)

Lows:

T2 Heat Sink
T2 Heat Sink
T2 Heat Sink
T2 TE
T2 TE

Rigs:

Large Energy Turret tracking speed bonus (forget the name)
EM Hardner
Thermal Hardner

I'm cap stable without the Pith X running, and can last just under 2 minutes with everything running.

I'm considering dropping the Amplifier for that jump drive thing. I've not tried that, but I like the idea of hitting a button and instantly having more space between them and I. But if I were to do that, I'd need to drop the ASB most likely to get a sensor booster on so that my targeting range increases from 100km. Hmm...

And to add to the fun...I'm not using it against rats weak to lasers. :) I don't want to hear any garbage about it not being efficient either. I like lasers...so I use lasers.
Shereza
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2013-07-10 19:05:44 UTC
IIshira wrote:
A deadspace shield booster is helpful but the rest of the tank is fine with T2. Using faction or deadspace invulns and SBA paint a sign on your ship that says "please gank me"


The thing is that if you're already using a deadspace booster trying to keep the "gank bait" factor down is probably pointless. Worse still is the fact that if you're careful and smart you can significantly reduce the chances of being ganked while using such modules. I've been flying expensive ships and fits in high-sec L4s for the better part of 5 years now and I have yet to get ganked.

Yes, yes, "eventually" it will happen, but so far "eventually' seems to be pretty low order odds and getting lower with each month that passes.

The fact is that the Gist A-Type XL booster, EM hardener, and thermal hardener come in at or cheaper than the X-Type XLSB on the market so if you're going to okay an X-Type XLSB you might as well okay three A-Types.

IIshira wrote:
If you're having issues with tank it means you're not putting out enough DPS to kill the rats fast enough. Your gun DPS should be at least 750 with multifreq. If it's any less than that something is wrong with your skills or fitting. You want the gun DPS to be around 1000.


You can hit 1001 rDPS with a nightmare using T2 tachyons, AmNav MF crystals, and 5 faction heat sinks. You can eke out 1015 with gleam. With T2 pulses and conflagration you'll reach 1182 while ANMF crystals will yield 1059 rDPS. Drop one heat sink and you'll get 1033 with ANMF crystals.

In short while 1100 DPS might be practical for pulse laser builds it's not very practical for tachyon laser builds, and a lot of nightmare build are tachyon builds.

IIshira wrote:
Also faction or T2 crystals are standard practice for any laser ship since they don't cost much and last a long time. The extra DPS will pay for itself.


And some people, like myself, tend to avoid them outside of specific circumstances like Spike'ing rats from 150km on WC4 with my rokh or Scorch on my naval apocalypse just to keep things simple, at least for laser ships.

Hank Hakaarii wrote:

And to add to the fun...I'm not using it against rats weak to lasers. :) I don't want to hear any garbage about it not being efficient either. I like lasers...so I use lasers.


If you're not dealing with EM-weak NPCs like Blood Raiders or Sansha then you can get a better-than-EM/Thermal tank with fewer tanking modules resulting in your ship being a tad over-tanked, especially with the LASB. On top of that unless you do a lot of mercenary or rogue drone missions or want to do missions without needing to change out your hardeners invulnerability fields aren't really needed.

You've got six modules for tanking. If you drop them to the booster, amp, and one each rat damage hardeners you should be fine. If that's not enough you might consider swapping the amplifier out for a second rat-specific hardener for your enemy's primary damage type. A CalNav amplifier might be good for boosting capacitor efficiency, but a second hardener is better for boosting your tank while your capacitor lasts.

Also, if capacitor is that much of an issue you should really fit vampires. Even if they don't function the same as they do in PvP a pair of vampires, even mediums, can help you eke through tight places where you might otherwise have to warp out.
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