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Salvage drones not working correctly?

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Naevea Sar'Daen
Explosive When Microwaved
#1 - 2013-04-21 23:24:32 UTC
I have been running a salvager mod + tractor beam on my Harbinger while escorting our miners... today decided to put my 6tyh gun back on and use salvage drones instead of the salvage module.

From my understanding 3 thigns happenw hen a salvager makes a cycle:
1. Failed salvage, try again.
2. Salvage successful, get loot
3. Salvage successful but no parts

My drones are giving me number 1 but destroy the wreck like number 2/3 would. now, i thought this might be from message overlap so i jet-canned my entire invo, started fresh.

0/15 wrecks tested gave me salvage, all wrecks 'salvaged' after 1 cycle, no loot what so ever.

Either they are broken, im doing something wrong or they are ******** and i'm better off using my salvager.

Tried not setting specific targets and letting them 'freeroam' the wrecks AND directly ordering them after a specific wreck.
Setaceous
Nexus Prima
#2 - 2013-04-21 23:54:19 UTC
Salvage drones will always have a lower chance at salvage than a dedicated module, but I've never had them come up empty that many times in a row. Maybe a bug? I'm assuming your wrecks are just ships and not NPC drones (I've not been doing this for long, but I've never had a salvage drone get anything from an NPC drone).
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#3 - 2013-04-22 00:02:52 UTC
With only a 2% chance per level, even at max skill salvage drones can only do pretty low level wrecks with any degree of certainty. Like all non-combat drones they get zero bonus from your drone ship skills and there are no modules, rigs or implants that can improve them in any way. Get used to that.

The paradox of this lack of utility against high level wrecks is that the lower level of the wreck the less likely it is to have any salvage for the taking. So to summarize: Salvage drones are best used to salvage the wrecks that are the least likely to be salvageable.

We just have to file this under "CCP Drone Hate" and move on. Cry

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0
Setaceous
Nexus Prima
#4 - 2013-04-22 00:12:27 UTC
They normally get some loot. They're also a blessing if you're in a slow combat ship with a large drone bay, a long way from a dedicated salvage ship. I usually use mine of I'm sitting 30km+ off an anomaly site that I've just cleared with sentries. I get a reasonable amount of salvage and they're done by the time I can fly in close enough to pick up any cans left over.
Naevea Sar'Daen
Explosive When Microwaved
#5 - 2013-04-22 00:20:22 UTC
im in 0.3 sec, on standard sansha frigate-battleship with the rare commander (gotten only 2)(bounties between 15,000 and 600,000)

Using 4 Salvager I drones, with a salvage skill of 4.

On 15 wrecks, majority of which were frigate, i should have gotten SOMETHING judging by rarely getting any non-loots using a normal salvager I module.

My main issue here is they are only doing 1 cycle per wreck, and the wreck disappears even if i only get a cycle failed message (on a normal salvager I module a cycle fail means try again on the same wreck)
Tuttomenui II
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-04-22 05:44:37 UTC
if the wreck has salvage it will give it to you regardless of what device you use to access the wreck. If the drones cant salvage a wreck they just wont work period. If they poof a wreck it means they worked if you didn't get salvage then nothing of value was in the wreck. Frigates don't really give much salvage especially if they are just belt rats.
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#7 - 2013-04-22 07:30:42 UTC
Are the drones returning to your ship? They have to physically carry the salvage back to you, after all, and if you interrupt them then the salvage tends to go poof.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0
GreenSeed
#8 - 2013-04-22 07:36:19 UTC
hmm... some people here seem to be under the impression that % chance to salvage determines if you get loot or not... the loot is there. the % chance is the chance to access it on that cycle.

that said, no, salvage drones wont result in less salvage, it will only take longer.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#9 - 2013-04-22 08:53:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
If you think there is something wrong, bug report it.


As for the other topic of salvage probabilities:

Chance to salvage with at least one of N drones = 1 - Chance to fail to salvage with all drones
= 1 - Chance to fail to salvage with one drone ^ N
= 1 - (1 - Chance to salvage with one drone) ^ N
= 1 - (1 - Salvage Drones Skill * 2% - 3% Salvage Drone Base Chance) ^ N

With five salvage drones:

Salvage Drones 1: 22.62%
Salvage Drones 2: 30.43%
Salvage Drones 3: 37.59%
Salvage Drones 4: 44.15%
Salvage Drones 5: 50.15%


And no, salvage chance does not affect the type or amount of salvage, just the time it takes to salvage.
ISD Gallifreyan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#10 - 2013-04-22 09:11:36 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Gallifreyan
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
Are the drones returning to your ship? They have to physically carry the salvage back to you, after all, and if you interrupt them then the salvage tends to go poof.


This sound likely what is happening.
I ensure to assign salvage drones individually to wrecks and then un-lock them (the drones will continue to salvage).
Once they show returning, you need to wait until they show idle before you re-assign them.
Salvage from returning drones is alo stacked seperately each deposit. (not like mining drones where it auto stacks)

GreenSeed wrote:
hmm... some people here seem to be under the impression that % chance to salvage determines if you get loot or not... the loot is there. the % chance is the chance to access it on that cycle.that said, no, salvage drones wont result in less salvage, it will only take longer.


This is correct.

ISD Gallifreyan

Lt. Commander

Community Communication Liaisons (CCL)

Interstellar Services Department
Janna Sway
Ember Inc.
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#11 - 2013-07-06 20:29:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Janna Sway
Katran Luftschreck wrote:
With only a 2% chance per level, even at max skill salvage drones can only do pretty low level wrecks with any degree of certainty. Like all non-combat drones they get zero bonus from your drone ship skills and there are no modules, rigs or implants that can improve them in any way. Get used to that.

The paradox of this lack of utility against high level wrecks is that the lower level of the wreck the less likely it is to have any salvage for the taking. So to summarize: Salvage drones are best used to salvage the wrecks that are the least likely to be salvageable.

We just have to file this under "CCP Drone Hate" and move on. Cry


I guess the salvage %-chance is so low because you can have 5 salvager drones active that work on a wreck at the same time.

I am not sure whether it is justified to compare %-chances of salvager drones with those of salvager modules.
Furthermore, consider that salvager modules in highslots are static with a limited range of 5000 m.
The salvager drones combine the function of salvager and tractor beam in themselves.
Salvager drones have their goods and bads and are pretty balanced in what they do and do not offer.
Nefer tite
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2013-07-10 13:06:38 UTC
Shocked Why are you targeting wrecks when all you need to do is launch the drones and tell them to salvage, they then starts to salvage all wrecks in range(who are yours ofc) . Then they return the salvaged stuff and go back to work again to all wrecks are done in the range that is.

Just a esyer way to salvage with them, dont target they find wrecks on their own.
Ruskarn Andedare
Lion Investments
#13 - 2013-07-10 13:23:16 UTC
Nefer tite wrote:
Shocked Why are you targeting wrecks when all you need to do is launch the drones and tell them to salvage, they then starts to salvage all wrecks in range(who are yours ofc) . Then they return the salvaged stuff and go back to work again to all wrecks are done in the range that is.

Just a esyer way to salvage with them, dont target they find wrecks on their own.


And there's no risk of you reassigning them when they have loot on them
Tobias Hareka
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2013-07-10 14:07:54 UTC
Nefer tite wrote:
Shocked Why are you targeting wrecks when all you need to do is launch the drones and tell them to salvage, they then starts to salvage all wrecks in range(who are yours ofc) . Then they return the salvaged stuff and go back to work again to all wrecks are done in the range that is.

Just a esyer way to salvage with them, dont target they find wrecks on their own.


Sure, if you don't have problems waiting for them to finish. Some of the wrecks can be 80+ km from your ship so it takes time. They are slow. They can't even keep up with cruiser/battlecruiser (if you loot that is).
SabersKunk Dallocort
Incognito Mode
Brotherhood of Spacers
#15 - 2013-07-10 15:00:19 UTC
Nefer tite wrote:
Shocked Why are you targeting wrecks when all you need to do is launch the drones and tell them to salvage, they then starts to salvage all wrecks in range(who are yours ofc) . Then they return the salvaged stuff and go back to work again to all wrecks are done in the range that is.

Just a esyer way to salvage with them, dont target they find wrecks on their own.


I did not know that /facepalm
Nambu
Two Dogs Operations
#16 - 2013-07-10 15:00:32 UTC
Tobias Hareka wrote:
Nefer tite wrote:
Shocked Why are you targeting wrecks when all you need to do is launch the drones and tell them to salvage, they then starts to salvage all wrecks in range(who are yours ofc) . Then they return the salvaged stuff and go back to work again to all wrecks are done in the range that is.

Just a esyer way to salvage with them, dont target they find wrecks on their own.


Sure, if you don't have problems waiting for them to finish. Some of the wrecks can be 80+ km from your ship so it takes time. They are slow. They can't even keep up with cruiser/battlecruiser (if you loot that is).


They dont seem especially slow, with 5 of them at skill level 3. I just set them loose and tractor stuff in close so that the cans will be in range. With a Noctis it works like a dream, so much so that I am tempted to get rid of all the salvagers I have on it and just run 8 tractors.
Cagot
Zendian Solutions
#17 - 2013-07-10 16:04:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Cagot
If you target the salvage drones individually to speed up the process, you can avoid reassigning full ones by waiting until one is idle before giving it a new target. Usually putting them on "auto" is fast enough unless you have a big field of empty wrecks, like the ones with massive waves of now-lootless drones.

On my Noctis I use 6 tractors and two salvagers. I seldom bother to turn on the salvagers.
Tobias Hareka
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2013-07-10 16:08:09 UTC
Nambu wrote:
Tobias Hareka wrote:
Nefer tite wrote:
Shocked Why are you targeting wrecks when all you need to do is launch the drones and tell them to salvage, they then starts to salvage all wrecks in range(who are yours ofc) . Then they return the salvaged stuff and go back to work again to all wrecks are done in the range that is.

Just a esyer way to salvage with them, dont target they find wrecks on their own.


Sure, if you don't have problems waiting for them to finish. Some of the wrecks can be 80+ km from your ship so it takes time. They are slow. They can't even keep up with cruiser/battlecruiser (if you loot that is).


They dont seem especially slow, with 5 of them at skill level 3. I just set them loose and tractor stuff in close so that the cans will be in range. With a Noctis it works like a dream, so much so that I am tempted to get rid of all the salvagers I have on it and just run 8 tractors.


Well, it's a bit difficult to fit Ishtar/Gila with 96km tractor beams.
Q 5
999 HOLDINGS LLC
#19 - 2013-07-10 16:28:47 UTC
I notice that the same thing is happening to me as well, I don't think it's a bug I think its a stealth nerf.
Q 5
999 HOLDINGS LLC
#20 - 2013-07-10 16:34:06 UTC
Tobias Hareka wrote:
Nefer tite wrote:
Shocked Why are you targeting wrecks when all you need to do is launch the drones and tell them to salvage, they then starts to salvage all wrecks in range(who are yours ofc) . Then they return the salvaged stuff and go back to work again to all wrecks are done in the range that is.

Just a esyer way to salvage with them, dont target they find wrecks on their own.


Sure, if you don't have problems waiting for them to finish. Some of the wrecks can be 80+ km from your ship so it takes time. They are slow. They can't even keep up with cruiser/battlecruiser (if you loot that is).


Easy to fix that, in the drone box choose 1 then right click approach as your drones salvage your ship will follow them, as they do that you can collect the cargo containers as they finish the wreck.

You can put an afterburner on so your ship keeps in close proximity to drones.
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