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Why the PVE of the game is so bad?

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I Love Boobies
All Hail Boobies
#81 - 2013-07-10 01:25:56 UTC
Onquaber wrote:
Mining, missions, anomalies, all boring activities. I didn't any incursions yet but they seem like more difficult missions and always the same.

You will say its a pvp game, ok. If no one mines, do missions or kill rats there will be no economy so no pvp.

Many people do the boring stuff to finance their pvp.

I've tried FW and it was fun, a pve/pvp mix. But there should be more things to do in high low and null sec.

Why the pve cant be fun?






Just because you don't find them fun doesn't mean others feel the same. It's fine how it is. Don't like it, don't do it. Simple as that.
IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome
#82 - 2013-07-10 01:30:38 UTC
I Love Boobies wrote:



Just because you don't find them fun doesn't mean others feel the same.



When taking your toon name into account - This is comedy.



btw - Everyone finds them fun.

https://soundcloud.com/ibanezlaney
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#83 - 2013-07-10 02:20:01 UTC
To make PvE fun CCP needs to look to the successful PvE games. I suggest Everquest as a good template. EQ had a very large number of NPC factions, it had very rare elite spawns, somewhich could take weeks or months to spawn. The NPCs hit very hard, the special spawns harder.

In EvE NPCs are about as interesting and difficult as asteroids. In EQ on PvP servers spawns promoted PvP in EvE they dont.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Tzar Sinak
Mythic Heights
#84 - 2013-07-10 02:42:10 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:


In EvE NPCs are about as interesting and difficult as asteroids. In EQ on PvP servers spawns promoted PvP in EvE they dont.


Bingo.

Hydrostatic Podcast First class listening of all things EVE

Check out the Eve-Prosper show for your market updates!
Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#85 - 2013-07-10 03:02:50 UTC
Tzar Sinak wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:


In EvE NPCs are about as interesting and difficult as asteroids. In EQ on PvP servers spawns promoted PvP in EvE they dont.


Bingo.


And about 1000 people played it (EQ and EQII are PvE centric games, more so than even WoW [which only added PvP after the fact]).

To make PvE interesting is to have more interesting missions. These missions repeat endlessly. It's 10 year long WoW dailies. Ugh

_"In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." _ ~George Orwell
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#86 - 2013-07-10 03:25:33 UTC
PvE in EVE is bad because it's a small and rather unimportant part of the game, so it's not particularly worth putting a lot of effort into. It's more of an afterthought than anything, really.
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
#87 - 2013-07-10 03:30:13 UTC
Tippia wrote:
PvE in EVE is bad because it's a small and rather unimportant part of the game, so it's not particularly worth putting a lot of effort into. It's more of an afterthought than anything, really.


With the exception of FW, all combat pilots (sans alts) need to do some form of PVE to earn ISK. Major parts of the economy (including all faction/deadspace/officer/meta modules, ISK injection into the economy, tech 3, all LP store items...) are tied to PVE. PVE is a major part of the game. People just try to pretend it isn't and ignore it because it's ******* awful.

It's something CCP's been trying to change with wormholes and incursions, but they've failed on two major counts.

-These changes do absolutely nothing for new players, who are only ever exposed to the boring PVE
-The boring PVE is necessary enough to the ingame economy that people can't just abandon it.

"general" PVE in EVE needs a major overhaul.
Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#88 - 2013-07-10 03:30:57 UTC
Tippia wrote:
PvE in EVE is bad because it's a small and rather unimportant part of the game, so it's not particularly worth putting a lot of effort into. It's more of an afterthought than anything, really.


Actually it's so popular the null and low-sec players are running them, just like the tradeskillers and newer players.

One station that hosts L4s has more people in it doing them than you can see of PvPers in a whole zone in null (and counting the gatecamps).

And why? ISK independent of the market. And why would a rival want to pay their rival to fight them?

_"In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." _ ~George Orwell
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#89 - 2013-07-10 03:38:13 UTC
Kahega Amielden wrote:
With the exception of FW, all combat pilots (sans alts) need to do some form of PVE to earn ISK.
Not really, no. They could make the same money (or more) through industry or trading.

Quote:
Major parts of the economy (including all faction/deadspace/officer/meta modules, ISK injection into the economy, tech 3, all LP store items...) are tied to PVE.
The only one of those that is a “major part”o fthe economy is ISK injection, and PvP plays a part in that too. Injecting a bit of ISK doesn't require much, which is why I call it a small part of the game. Some people have just taken that small part and repeated it to excess, which is why so much ISK keeps showing up — it could almost be cut in half before the economy would be affected to any greater degree.

Ace Uoweme wrote:
Actually it's so popular
Popular ≠ important.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#90 - 2013-07-10 03:40:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Nevyn Auscent
PvE is easy to make 'interesting'
However.... a lot of people would cry because they could no longer make a guide for a given mission.
And the mission descriptions would become a lot more 'generic'.

With my experience which is limited as far as the game industry is concerned, I could create the psuedocode system for a more 'interesting & dynamic' PvE system with maybe.... a Fortnights work is my best guess. Given I would be working with 200 ships & thousands of modules of variation to try and create that dynamic mix.
I would then have to create a difficulty scale to somehow grade the ships that resulted from the dynamic process.
And then create yet another Psuedocode system to create a mission space by assembling objects that would have to be smart enough to not overlap them badly.
Then a third psuedocode system to populate the mission space with the appropriate mission ships.
And a fourth system to designate the objective of the mission once the space has been populates.

Since you do want to have a difficulty guide to even dynamic content. It's not 'fun' in the slightest if you are going in blind, if you enter a mission space, or an anomoly, or anything like that, you want to have some kind of idea how hard it is. See DED ratings for a good example perhaps.
So.... we are talking several man months of work probably, since someone then has to turn the psuedocode into real code after all that work is done, then to create more interesting chains, you want to tie in the anomoly escalation mechanic to the missions somehow, yet since they are far more dynamic in nature, you now have much more random types of escalations.

It's not 'difficult' but it is time consuming. Almost grind like.
All for something who's main (If we are interpreting CCP's aims correctly) is to generate Isk for people to take part in the Sandbox and PvP.
Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#91 - 2013-07-10 03:43:48 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Ace Uoweme wrote:
Actually it's so popular
Popular ≠ important.


Yeah, like WoW is so unimportant that all of gaming ignores that game, right?

It's important because it's popular, so popular to be the trendsetter for MMOs. Idea

Spin that, Tippia.

_"In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." _ ~George Orwell
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#92 - 2013-07-10 03:54:46 UTC
Ace Uoweme wrote:
Yeah, like WoW
WoW is not a game mechanic in EVE.
PvE, on the other hand, is and it's not a particularly important one on the scale of things since its purpose is limited and fairly easy to replace.
Q 5
999 HOLDINGS LLC
#93 - 2013-07-10 04:15:10 UTC
Onquaber wrote:
Mining, missions, anomalies, all boring activities. I didn't any incursions yet but they seem like more difficult missions and always the same.

You will say its a pvp game, ok. If no one mines, do missions or kill rats there will be no economy so no pvp.

Many people do the boring stuff to finance their pvp.

I've tried FW and it was fun, a pve/pvp mix. But there should be more things to do in high low and null sec.

Why the pve cant be fun?





Fun is a relative term, I enjoy myself so do many others here.

If there wasn't a grind to get things then what suggestions do you have?

Pay RL money to get things?

Adding content takes time, money, programmers, resources and to which adding it to the game (coding) so it works right.
there is a section just for a guy like you it's in the forums here, use it.
Setaceous
Nexus Prima
#94 - 2013-07-10 04:18:07 UTC
Tippia wrote:
PvE in EVE is bad because it's a small and rather unimportant part of the game, so it's not particularly worth putting a lot of effort into. It's more of an afterthought than anything, really.

Plus it captures the perfect grinding wheel aspect that's cleverly hidden in most MMOs - You want to get better stuff so you can get better stuff to get better stuff......
Esteban Dragonovic
Saidusairos Nebula Concern
#95 - 2013-07-10 05:07:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Esteban Dragonovic
No better content generators than players, turn PvE into PvP.

Have the missions set up in a way that 2 pilots are given missions with winning conditions conflicting one another's goals, similar in a fashion to APB for anyone who may have played that (one of the few good ideas in that terrible game). Ideally, missions would also be randomly generated and dynamic to further mix things up. How to implement this however, I've got no clue. And I doubt all the mission runners out there would be very sympathetic to such changes. You could probably up the reward payout to compensate, but I doubt it would make it that far before a mass ragequit of mission bears, and CCP would certainly not like the chances one would have to roll with that.

God forbid there be competition.
Robert Saint
The Grumpy Dogs
#96 - 2013-07-10 05:26:48 UTC
I think it's just a matter of changing your expectations.

To me "PVE" is sort of like Solitaire "the card game".. something that you can just chill and play to try and beat your score!

Only with EVE you get to try with different ships, etc..
ISD Gallifreyan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#97 - 2013-07-10 05:52:19 UTC
Ok, lets try to keep this thread on topic and respectfull of other players opinions.
Trolling is NOT allowed in any section of the Eve Forums.

I do like some of the ideas presented here to randomize the PVE content more.

ISD Gallifreyan

Lt. Commander

Community Communication Liaisons (CCL)

Interstellar Services Department
OldWolf69
EVE-RO
Goonswarm Federation
#98 - 2013-07-10 06:54:19 UTC
No Mad. No Sh*t. No Fun.
Max Godsnottlingson
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#99 - 2013-07-10 07:17:01 UTC
The main problem here is that folks get into a PvP vs PvE mindset, where they should be looking more at pulling the two together.

PvE can be damned boring if you sit in high sec all day sucking on rocks or churning out the same old missions all day. I know, Max has done enough of both of them.

But now, while I would never call Max a PvPer, he is definatly the Industrial type. But you will find him more often as not either deep in null sec looking for T2 rig mats, and other goodies. or in a WH digging out some ABC to provide the high end minerals he needs for building. And take it from me, that is far from boring, you have to be on the ball all of the time. Because if anybody does catch me, I am toast and probably paying for a new medical clone, as well as fitting out a new ship.

We have all gotten into this habit of thinking High Sec vs Low Sec vs Null/WH, and PvP vs PvE. The fact is, to get the most out of Eve, you have to be able to slip between all of the different parts.
Onyx Nyx
Trillium Invariant
Honorable Third Party
#100 - 2013-07-10 08:35:30 UTC
Simply remove PvE because as game design, it expired a long time ago. Bonus: We also get rid of scrubs who want the "WoW" experience and feel entitled to it because that is what WoW have.

I kill kittens, and puppies and bunnies. I maim toddlers and teens and then more.

  • Richard (http://www.lfgcomic.com/)