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Hi-sec suicide ganking

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Elizabeth Aideron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#41 - 2013-07-06 12:16:03 UTC
you're saying highsec is unsafe because ganking exists at all, which is laughable
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#42 - 2013-07-06 12:17:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Infinity Ziona
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:

no, "quite unsafe" would be having no counters to ganking

You can delude yourself into thinking high sec is quite safe now but we all know its not quite that way atm

Im saying its not quite safe because its far too easy and risk free to gank. Not just small ships but some of the largest ships allowed in high sec.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#43 - 2013-07-06 12:22:49 UTC
i feel we simply have a misunderstanding here

infinite ziona, highsec space is the area with CONCORD and faction police

it's the other areas that don't have these things
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#44 - 2013-07-06 12:25:12 UTC
Zoum wrote:
I didn't really need that much isk invested in one ship

Finally a highsec missionrunner gets it.

Billions of isk is not a worthwhile investment for running a mission 3% faster.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#45 - 2013-07-06 12:35:48 UTC
Benny Ohu wrote:
i feel we simply have a misunderstanding here

infinite ziona, highsec space is the area with CONCORD and faction police

it's the other areas that don't have these things

Faction play no role. Concord is irrelevant when it comes to ganking since ganking is so quick even on a capital class hull.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Thar Saal
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#46 - 2013-07-06 12:38:32 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
Zoum wrote:
I didn't really need that much isk invested in one ship

Finally a highsec missionrunner gets it.

Billions of isk is not a worthwhile investment for running a mission 3% faster.



shhhhhhhhhh.....


dont mind Vortis's delusioned ranting, investing billions into a ship is a efficent and excellent decision for mission running.
Elizabeth Aideron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2013-07-06 12:39:51 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:

no, "quite unsafe" would be having no counters to ganking

You can delude yourself into thinking high sec is quite safe now but we all know its not quite that way atm

Im saying its not quite safe because its far too easy and risk free to gank. Not just small ships but some of the largest ships allowed in high sec.


prove it
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#48 - 2013-07-06 12:48:47 UTC
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:

no, "quite unsafe" would be having no counters to ganking

You can delude yourself into thinking high sec is quite safe now but we all know its not quite that way atm

Im saying its not quite safe because its far too easy and risk free to gank. Not just small ships but some of the largest ships allowed in high sec.


prove it

Lol.

What needs to happen is EHP should be a proper balance to dissuade ganking for giggles. A ship should only be woth suiciding if its fitted with or carrying enough to justify the gank on economic terms. The devs have done this before when exhumers were released with way too little HP. They need to do it again to account for the increased DPS of current skills and ships.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Elizabeth Aideron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#49 - 2013-07-06 12:53:57 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:

no, "quite unsafe" would be having no counters to ganking

You can delude yourself into thinking high sec is quite safe now but we all know its not quite that way atm

Im saying its not quite safe because its far too easy and risk free to gank. Not just small ships but some of the largest ships allowed in high sec.


prove it

Lol.

What needs to happen is EHP should be a proper balance to dissuade ganking for giggles. A ship should only be woth suiciding if its fitted with or carrying enough to justify the gank on economic terms. The devs have done this before when exhumers were released with way too little HP. They need to do it again to account for the increased DPS of current skills and ships.


so if i put plex inside a freighter it would suddenly lose ehp?
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#50 - 2013-07-06 13:08:19 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Faction play no role. Concord is irrelevant when it comes to ganking since ganking is so quick even on a capital class hull.
ganking needs to be fast because after a certain amount of time CONCORD shows up and kills everybody

that's why they call it 'suicide ganking'

if you have any more questions about basic game mechanics feel free to ask
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#51 - 2013-07-06 13:22:00 UTC
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:

no, "quite unsafe" would be having no counters to ganking

You can delude yourself into thinking high sec is quite safe now but we all know its not quite that way atm

Im saying its not quite safe because its far too easy and risk free to gank. Not just small ships but some of the largest ships allowed in high sec.


prove it

Lol.

What needs to happen is EHP should be a proper balance to dissuade ganking for giggles. A ship should only be woth suiciding if its fitted with or carrying enough to justify the gank on economic terms. The devs have done this before when exhumers were released with way too little HP. They need to do it again to account for the increased DPS of current skills and ships.


so if i put plex inside a freighter it would suddenly lose ehp?

If there was enough plex to justify ganking the freighter than it would be worth the 2 billion cost of ganking one. Problem at the moment is you can gank a freighter for a fraction of the cost of a freighter.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#52 - 2013-07-06 13:24:22 UTC
Benny Ohu wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Faction play no role. Concord is irrelevant when it comes to ganking since ganking is so quick even on a capital class hull.
ganking needs to be fast because after a certain amount of time CONCORD shows up and kills everybody

that's why they call it 'suicide ganking'

if you have any more questions about basic game mechanics feel free to ask

Lol. You need to think before you post. You just agreed with what I said without even realising it.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Elizabeth Aideron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2013-07-06 13:28:29 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:

You can delude yourself into thinking high sec is quite safe now but we all know its not quite that way atm

Im saying its not quite safe because its far too easy and risk free to gank. Not just small ships but some of the largest ships allowed in high sec.


prove it

Lol.

What needs to happen is EHP should be a proper balance to dissuade ganking for giggles. A ship should only be woth suiciding if its fitted with or carrying enough to justify the gank on economic terms. The devs have done this before when exhumers were released with way too little HP. They need to do it again to account for the increased DPS of current skills and ships.


so if i put plex inside a freighter it would suddenly lose ehp?

If there was enough plex to justify ganking the freighter than it would be worth the 2 billion cost of ganking one. Problem at the moment is you can gank a freighter for a fraction of the cost of a freighter.


oh so you believe in isk tanking, lmao

a t1 catalyst costs 2 million and does 418 dps. a t2 catalyst costs 11 million and does 686 dps. which one should it be balanced against?
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#54 - 2013-07-06 13:38:05 UTC
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:

oh so you believe in isk tanking, lmao

a t1 catalyst costs 2 million and does 418 dps. a t2 catalyst costs 11 million and does 686 dps. which one should it be balanced against?

EHP and build cost have always been used to balance ships in EvE. Apparently devs believe in it to and always have.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#55 - 2013-07-06 13:48:48 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Benny Ohu wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Faction play no role. Concord is irrelevant when it comes to ganking since ganking is so quick even on a capital class hull.
ganking needs to be fast because after a certain amount of time CONCORD shows up and kills everybody

that's why they call it 'suicide ganking'

if you have any more questions about basic game mechanics feel free to ask

Lol. You need to think before you post. You just agreed with what I said without even realising it.

you're unable to comprehend or unwilling to accept that the reason what few organised ganking groups exist are able to operate within the strict limitations imposed by highsec mechanics are able to do so because they have numbers, they plan well, they have good knowledge of mechanics and calulating ehp/expected dps, they have well organised fleets and patient, competent, experienced members

the point of my post was to try and make this clear to you - that the reason ganking must be quick is due to the limitation of CONCORD and faction police. it is not that ganking as an activity is too easy that CONCORD cannot turn up in time, it is that the fleet is forced by game mechanics to be incredibly efficient

the fact that you thought my post was in any way agreeing with you doesn't speak well for your comprehension skills
Elizabeth Aideron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#56 - 2013-07-06 13:50:49 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:

oh so you believe in isk tanking, lmao

a t1 catalyst costs 2 million and does 418 dps. a t2 catalyst costs 11 million and does 686 dps. which one should it be balanced against?

EHP and build cost have always been used to balance ships in EvE. Apparently devs believe in it to and always have.


since you refuse to answer i will for you. if you balance it for t2 catalysts you can obviously use more t1 catalysts much cheaper. if you balance against t1 catalysts and want a 2b ganking cost, you need to make it cost 1000 catalysts, which can together do 6.3 million damage over the gank. giving the freighter 6.3 million ehp makes it as tanky as a supercarrier and ungankable, which was your goal all along of course :)
Elizabeth Aideron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#57 - 2013-07-06 13:53:04 UTC
"i dont want to make ganking impossible, im just saying if you have anything less than 1000 pilots against a single freighter you're a stupid nullbear"
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#58 - 2013-07-06 13:54:32 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
EHP and build cost have always been used to balance ships in EvE. Apparently devs believe in it to and always have.


one of my ships has 42m EHP

another ship of a different type has 35m EHP

guess which one is more expensive

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#59 - 2013-07-06 13:57:01 UTC
Andski wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
EHP and build cost have always been used to balance ships in EvE. Apparently devs believe in it to and always have.


one of my ships has 42m EHP

another ship of a different type has 35m EHP

guess which one is more expensive

They're irrelevant to the discussion.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#60 - 2013-07-06 13:58:28 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
They're irrelevant to the discussion.


no, they're not, because you claim that EHP increases with build cost which is a lie

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar