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Advanced Minmatar Cruisers

Author
hwhiskey
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1 - 2011-11-06 22:45:45 UTC
Hi all,

I'm now about 2 days away from finishing up Minmatar cruiser V (thank god), and I'm looking for some input as to the various pros and cons of the advanced minmatar cruisers.

From my understanding, the minmatar advanced cruiser lineup primarily shines in PvP (vaga, huginn/rapier, etc.), but I'm wondering what other purposes I can use this cruiser lineup for, excluding the scimitar as I don't plan on flying logistics any time soon.

In particular, I would like to get into some better low sec / null sec exploration while my alt account works closer towards a tengu. I can currently fly a pretty decent cane / maelstrom, but I'm wondering how ships like the Loki and Muninn hold up in PvE? The Muninn seems to be a bit lackluster, and I haven't really heard about them being used a lot, but the Loki is a bit expensive for me :/

Are any of the advanced minmatar cruisers particularly useful for PvE purposes besides the Loki? I would appreciate any and all input on these advanced cruisers and their respective fittings. Thanks for any help!
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2011-11-06 22:53:32 UTC
For low sec exploration you will want two things, probe launcher and cloak. That means you loose two high slots to those two modules. Now go look and see which cruiser has most high slots so that you can fit those two modules mentioned above and the guns for killing rats.

Scimitar is destroyer hull, if I remember right. I though you were talking about cruisers.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

Nimrod Nemesis
Doomheim
#3 - 2011-11-06 22:57:05 UTC
Caleidascope wrote:
Scimitar is destroyer hull, if I remember right.


You do not.
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2011-11-06 22:57:55 UTC
Nimrod Nemesis wrote:
Caleidascope wrote:
Scimitar is destroyer hull, if I remember right.


You do not.

It happens. Smile

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

river Zateki
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2011-11-07 02:40:53 UTC
all t2 cruisers are primarily for pvp, Sacrilege excluded for amarr since it can PvE and PvP I mean some can PvE(Ishtar mostly) but they are mostly meant for pvp i believe.
Capn Orgasmo
Dmacks Minnions
#6 - 2011-11-07 02:47:10 UTC
Good pve cruisers
Cerberus
Zealot
Muninn (underestimated)
Deimos
Eagle
Ishtar
Sacrielege


these are all good for low sec

muninn has 2 slots if i remember correctly that you can use for the cloaky and scanner so i think the muninn with autocannons could be quite tasty.
hwhiskey
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#7 - 2011-11-07 03:47:48 UTC
Capn Orgasmo wrote:
Good pve cruisers
Cerberus
Zealot
Muninn (underestimated)
Deimos
Eagle
Ishtar
Sacrielege


these are all good for low sec

muninn has 2 slots if i remember correctly that you can use for the cloaky and scanner so i think the muninn with autocannons could be quite tasty.


Thanks for the input, would you happen to have any good fits for the muninn for this purpose?
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2011-11-07 04:01:30 UTC
I have to say, Muninn looks pretty sweet. With those bonuses, it does not need much of dps mods in low slots so you can concentrate on the armor tank.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

hwhiskey
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#9 - 2011-11-07 11:34:45 UTC
After reading up on some more similar posts, browsing around battleclinic loadouts, and playing with Pyfa for awhile, it's looking like my options for low sec (or even null sec) exploration are essentially limited to either using the Loki due to its superior tanking, dps, and overall utility, or sticking with my current Hurricane setup.

I was mainly hoping to unlock some good ships I could use for some pve purposes while I build up the experience / isk I would need to even think about flying T2 cruisers in pvp situations. From the stats I've seen in my pyfa warrioring, as well as the general sentiment towards minmatar advanced cruisers in pve I've observed, it seems as though I'd be best off either continuing to blast through L4s in my mael until I can afford a good Loki (or just buy a mach and destroy missions even faster...) and just save the whole exploration thing until my tengu-flying alt is ready to go.

The isk earning method I've found that I enjoy the most is definitely exploration, but I'm concerned that I'll be wasting my training time on this main character trying to build a subpar setup with these minmatar ships to run sites in low and null sec. Would I be better off just forgoing exploration until my alt is ready to fly a tengu and sticking with missioning on my main for now? I only have about 600m in my bank and setting up a loki to go exploring in would be a huge endeavor for me that could cause a major setback if I were to find it undesirable (or god forbid, lose the thing..).

Thanks for the input that has already been provided, and I would love to hear some other players' opinions.

Cheers

Cyniac
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2011-11-07 11:51:29 UTC
The Matar cruiser lineup is as always interesting the problem is that it is very skill intensive to use properly - if you have strong support skills all of the following can do well in exploration:


Muninn - Plenty of high slots to play with, but short on midslots if you are planning to run those hacking sites, still a great little ship and as has been pointed out, underestimated in many ways.

Vagabond - Will also work, but has less high slots. It works best when you know exactly how to run the sites so you go for the objectives you really need, rather than trying to fight your way through everything. Will need both good support skills and piloting ability.

Huggin - Requires excellent drone skills to work, and the split weapons system doesn't do it any favours. May struggle in the combat plexes too because of low resists but it's doable - problem with this ship is that you need to have good drone skills, good gunnery skills AND good missile skills to get the most out of it.

Rapier - Excellent little ship - dps wise it's less able than the Huggin and also relies greatly on drones, however its ability to use a covops cloak is very useful, and actually probably makes for a good "test out the sites ship".


I'd say Minnie ships are some which greatly benefit from having the scanning done by another ship and then do the actual hard work in one of the above, I'd go for the Muninn personally or the Rapier (but I'm biased towards drones and cloaky stuff). All of them should have enough DPS to deal with the sites up to DED 4/10 and the better ones will hit DED 5/10 with good skills.


My recommendation? Hop in a Cheetah, scan a few systems till you find a few sigs you like then blast through in your cruiser. It's not the "optimal" way of doing things - but it definitely works.

Good luck.
hwhiskey
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#11 - 2011-11-07 12:04:56 UTC
Cyniac wrote:
The Matar cruiser lineup is as always interesting the problem is that it is very skill intensive to use properly - if you have strong support skills all of the following can do well in exploration:


Muninn - Plenty of high slots to play with, but short on midslots if you are planning to run those hacking sites, still a great little ship and as has been pointed out, underestimated in many ways.

Vagabond - Will also work, but has less high slots. It works best when you know exactly how to run the sites so you go for the objectives you really need, rather than trying to fight your way through everything. Will need both good support skills and piloting ability.

Huggin - Requires excellent drone skills to work, and the split weapons system doesn't do it any favours. May struggle in the combat plexes too because of low resists but it's doable - problem with this ship is that you need to have good drone skills, good gunnery skills AND good missile skills to get the most out of it.

Rapier - Excellent little ship - dps wise it's less able than the Huggin and also relies greatly on drones, however its ability to use a covops cloak is very useful, and actually probably makes for a good "test out the sites ship".


I'd say Minnie ships are some which greatly benefit from having the scanning done by another ship and then do the actual hard work in one of the above, I'd go for the Muninn personally or the Rapier (but I'm biased towards drones and cloaky stuff). All of them should have enough DPS to deal with the sites up to DED 4/10 and the better ones will hit DED 5/10 with good skills.


My recommendation? Hop in a Cheetah, scan a few systems till you find a few sigs you like then blast through in your cruiser. It's not the "optimal" way of doing things - but it definitely works.

Good luck.


Cyniac - Thanks for the great reply! I'm glad to hear the Muninn is indeed an underestimated ship, rather than just being mediocre. The rupture has been one of my favorite ships to fly around, and I'm glad to hear that it could handle the 4/10 sites I hope to come across.

My alt account is actually pretty close to flying covert ops, and already has decent scan skills so I think I'll start using that to scan the sites rather than trying to force an all-in-one fit like I've been doing with my Hurricane.

The vaga has always greatly appealed to me as a ship I'd one day love to fly in pvp, but my navigation skills (and mainly my pvp abilities in general) need a lot of work to get to that point. I'm glad to know I'll eventually get to fly some great ships in pvp having gone with Minmatar as my first race to highly specialize in at the cruiser level.
DaRiKavus
Mosh Pit
THE BESTICLES
#12 - 2011-11-07 16:28:49 UTC
My two cents worth,

Vaga, Huggin/Rapier and Schimmy are very good pew ships. Munnin a little more specialised and works well in bigger fleets.

As mentioned before they are skill intensive and I would recommend Recon V, especially if crosstraining Amarr. I digress.

As far as PVE goes......why would you want to spend 150 mil and up on a ship for ratting and plexing that is equalled or bettered by a Drake ?

Having never considered it myself maybe you have some reasons I havent thought !!

If anything I would train Logi up and get into a Schimmy and Logi in Incursions, you will make more ISK there (Although a Basi will make it easier to get into fleets ofc)

Opinions are like arseholes though Blink

Regards Darik

hwhiskey
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#13 - 2011-11-07 16:35:35 UTC
DaRiKavus wrote:
My two cents worth,

Vaga, Huggin/Rapier and Schimmy are very good pew ships. Munnin a little more specialised and works well in bigger fleets.

As mentioned before they are skill intensive and I would recommend Recon V, especially if crosstraining Amarr. I digress.

As far as PVE goes......why would you want to spend 150 mil and up on a ship for ratting and plexing that is equalled or bettered by a Drake ?

Having never considered it myself maybe you have some reasons I havent thought !!

If anything I would train Logi up and get into a Schimmy and Logi in Incursions, you will make more ISK there (Although a Basi will make it easier to get into fleets ofc)

Opinions are like arseholes though Blink

Regards Darik



Well in the long run my commitment, at least for now, to minmatar ships is based around pvp. I haven't actually given much consideration to how comparable a simply drake setup would be to a Loki/muninn/whatever for pve, I just assumed the advanced cruisers might bring something else to the table.

Having said that, my alt is nearing the point of being able to fly a basic T2 drake setup (my main has no missile skills), and I will most certainly be considering that as an alternative to trying to explore with a minmatar advanced cruiser. Thank for the input!
TrollFace TrololMcFluf
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2011-11-07 17:10:39 UTC
If you want a good PVE T2 cruiser for low sec work im afraid to say this but you should now train up for a pilgrim its got everything you need for low sec explo

Its damn hard to catch as its got a covert cloak

Its got enough room to fit a good tank with salvager/codebreaker and analyser

Its drones and the nutes you should fit to it regardless of what your doing are good for when people jump you just align to a SS apply nutes and wait for them to cap out and the tackle to turn off.

Although now you got minny 5 you might want to look into a cloaky loki its pretty good too
Pookoko
Sigma Sagittarii Inc.
#15 - 2011-11-07 23:31:46 UTC
It hasnt been mentioned yet but brodswordia a great tanker to keep aggro in higher level complex and lvl5 if you got an alt to do dps/logi
Salvia Olima
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2011-11-08 09:09:28 UTC
Matar Cruiser V is good for the Cynabal. It is a good ship both for pvp/pve.
mxzf
Shovel Bros
#17 - 2011-11-08 16:55:47 UTC
Salvia Olima wrote:
Matar Cruiser V is good for the Cynabal. It is a good ship both for pvp/pve.


Really? I haven't seen may PvE fits for it. Care to share some?
Dibblerette
Solitude-Industries
#18 - 2011-11-09 00:21:18 UTC
My alt used a Huginn cruiser for vanguard Incursions. Webbing out to 40k is a great asset, and I never had much issue with getting a fleet. You don't even need fancy webs, since T2/meta 4 have the best available speed reduction (60%). Just don't web things TOO far away if you have lots of Vindicators or whatever.