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[Odyssey 1.1] Skill group name changes

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anishamora
Atelierele Grivita
#261 - 2013-07-04 20:21:17 UTC
Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris wrote:

If you want to fix "fighting UI" start with drone UI and corp management UI. Skill system is(was) ok. As i said earlier in this thread its not about dumbing game, but your new skill names lost flavor and became just another skills with generic names that doesn't have the feel of cold, harsh and unforgiving universe. The only sensible change was for Nanite Control skill.


This!!

The main focus should be on UI functionality that you use "on the field" or during combat where speed and precision are of the essence. I can live with spending 2-3 more minutes to search for a certain skill but that's a luxury that you cannot afford in combat or crisis situation. For moments like that you need a fast and sleek UI, not the turd that drone control is now.
Bloodpetal
Tir Capital Management Group
#262 - 2013-07-04 20:39:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Bloodpetal
Little Dragon Khamez wrote:
CCP Ytterbium wrote:
Update based on what we have seen so far.

Multiple Targeting and Advanced Multiple Targeting:
  • Agreed, it doesn't sound that great. As with Spaceship Piloting, this will be discussed internally again - some options listed in that thread sound promising, but please remember that we would ideally like skill names to be representative of what they actually do.



    • Target Acquisition and Advanced Target Acquisition, increased levels in either skill allow you to 'aquire' more targets etc.


    Targeting Acquisition and Signal Acquisition are too similar sounding and do two totally different things.

    All other "Management" Skills increase your ability to handle the "thing" that you are managing. So it should be Target Management. And Signal Acquisition should be changed to Targeting Acquisition, because you acquire targets faster.

    Where I am.
    Cyd Sunflare
    Doomheim
    #263 - 2013-07-04 20:44:50 UTC
    Bloodpetal wrote:
    Little Dragon Khamez wrote:
    CCP Ytterbium wrote:
    Update based on what we have seen so far.

    Multiple Targeting and Advanced Multiple Targeting:
  • Agreed, it doesn't sound that great. As with Spaceship Piloting, this will be discussed internally again - some options listed in that thread sound promising, but please remember that we would ideally like skill names to be representative of what they actually do.



    • Target Acquisition and Advanced Target Acquisition, increased levels in either skill allow you to 'aquire' more targets etc.


    Targeting Acquisition and Signal Acquisition are too similar sounding and do two totally different things.

    All other "Management" Skills increase your ability to handle the "thing" that you are managing. So it should be Target Management. And Signal Acquisition should be changed to Targeting Acquisition, because you acquire targets faster.


    I believe the "Signal Acquisition" you're looking for is actually Signature Analysis, which is fine as it is.
    Lunaleil Fournier
    Viziam
    Amarr Empire
    #264 - 2013-07-04 20:59:43 UTC
    Nice changes overall.

    I'm with the others in thinking weapon upgrades and AWU seemed out of place even though they affect powergrid. Maybe its the name, or the skills being a pre-req for actual weapon upgrades and seige modules, or both.

    Also, I'm not sure that targeting needs to be its own group. All of those skills would fit within the electronics group and be justified.

    Number One Everything
    D'Anconia Commerce
    #265 - 2013-07-04 21:14:48 UTC
    Deornoth Drake wrote:
    CCP Ytterbium wrote:

    Primary and secondary attribute concerns: (more stuff)

    Still no mention about if you're really intending to change them or not!
    Due to attribute remapping we do plan ahead about a year (more or less) so it would be great if you could let us know in advance (as in several months) before you change the primary and secondary attributes. Or you could just grant additional remaps or skill points.



    The updated post Ytterbium posted is a lot better. Glad you're reading feedback, and everything in the update sounds reasonable. I would like a clarification on changing skill's attributes or not though. That's not cosmetic, that makes a difference.
    Lunaleil Fournier
    Viziam
    Amarr Empire
    #266 - 2013-07-04 21:26:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Lunaleil Fournier
    Went and re-read entire thread...all lot of synergy in this thread on feedback it seems.


    +1 for keeping sub-systems separate from rigs.
    +1 keep spaceship command.
    +1 for target management or similar.
    +1 for changing tactical weapon reconfiguration to Siege module operation

    I think that PI scanning should go in the PI group...its a different type of scanning and I think it still makes sense even though it slightly breaks the theme. There's always an exception to the rule!
    Davion Falcon
    Those Once Loyal
    #267 - 2013-07-04 22:06:43 UTC
    CCP Ytterbium wrote:


    Simply put, the hard and unforgiving nature of EVE should not be to retrieve information on a basic level, it should be on how players act based on that information and interact with the gameplay that revolves around it.


    Beautiful. Simply beautiful.

    Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise. Never forgotten, never forgiven.
    Maldiro Selkurk
    Radiation Sickness
    #268 - 2013-07-04 22:21:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Maldiro Selkurk
    Post removed, decided bitter vet counter post was not worth another post from me.

    Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
    Ashterothi
    The Order of Thelemic Ascension
    The Invited
    #269 - 2013-07-04 22:29:48 UTC
    One of the ways I make my isk in this game is recruiting people into EVE with the recruit a friend option. I also like helping out newer players and help run a newbie friendly corp. On that note may I please ask you to not change the skills that match name with the categories.


    As it stands right now I can tell people to go after the "named" skills if they do not know what else to do. Pretty much across the board, if you want to do stuff involving that category, training the skill that is named after the category is a good idea. This allows it to be very approachable to a newer player. They do not need to worry about certs, or reading to much of stuff. They know Engineering, Electronics, Gunnery, Drones, etc are all good skills.

    It is quick to convey, easy to remember, and simple to execute. Change the names in my opinion clears up nothing, and disrupts this simple first step to understanding the skill system.

    Watch me live for all your Empyrean news and analysis!

    Tony S7ark
    Center for Advanced Studies
    Gallente Federation
    #270 - 2013-07-04 22:37:49 UTC
    marVLs wrote:
    Cool but "Spaceship Piloting" ? Spaceship Command sounds better
    Maldiro Selkurk
    Radiation Sickness
    #271 - 2013-07-04 22:51:46 UTC
    tasman devil wrote:
    I know I will be probably ignored but I just cannot let this go past without me saying my mind about it.

    The whole refurbishing of the skill groups sounds nice, but...
    BUT!


    So what SHOULD we do?

    Spaceship Command ALL T1 ship command skills
    ├ Advanced Spacehip Command (Tech 2 ship command skills)
    ├ Armour Management (Armour skills)
    ├ Drone Management (Drone skills)
    ├ Electronic Systems Management (CPU skills)
    ├ Electronic Warfare Management (EW / Anti-EW skills)
    ├ Engineering Management (PG skills)
    ├ Gunnery Management (Gunnery skills)
    ├ Missiles Management (Missile skills)
    ├ Navigation Management (Navigation skills)
    ├ Shield Management (Shield skills)
    ├ Ship Modifications (Rigs and T3 subsystems skills)


    1st thank you for posting a well thought out post.

    2nd my only real criticism is that you use the word 'management' repeatedly for this group, management to me is a human/human interaction and doesn't fit well with human/machine interactions. I'm sure that human/machine interactions come with the title management in some form in RL but i just feel another word here would fit better.

    Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
    Tanaka Aiko
    Ministry of War
    Amarr Empire
    #272 - 2013-07-04 22:57:48 UTC
    I like this change, it will be way clearer this way, and identical to the market. Less time lost searching where is this damn skill.
    Enthes goldhart
    Federal Navy Academy
    Gallente Federation
    #273 - 2013-07-04 22:59:30 UTC
    If it aint broke don’t fix it.

    Some of these changed make sense and will make it simpler for new players but for everyone else (your current player base) it’s just a pain in the ass having to re-learn things.


    Just seems like a waste of resources to me, I’d rather you put in a second undock button (where it used to be) and made it change colour when your undocking.
    Maldiro Selkurk
    Radiation Sickness
    #274 - 2013-07-04 23:14:24 UTC
    Unforgiven Storm wrote:


    you have a point, but CCP wants to clean/fix all the stuff that scares off the newbies first.

    You, me, we are already dependent, our money is in their pockets, now they want other people money.

    In the end of the day this is a business an money comes first. Don't forget that when you see them making changes to things that vets don't care about. Skill change is the bottom of any backlog list of a vet player like us, in CCP is in the top... $

    Well, just do like I do, embrace the opportunity and try to make this change a good one, even if is not important for you.


    Nice!

    Big +1

    You have a very good attitude about changes, none of us gets everything we want from changes to a game but a good healthy attitude about game development sure helps discussion about those changes immensely.

    Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
    TehCloud
    Guardians of the Dodixie
    #275 - 2013-07-04 23:15:27 UTC
    marVLs wrote:
    Cool but "Spaceship Piloting" ? Spaceship Command sounds better


    This!

    Also "Shields" and "Armor" sounds incredibly lame.

    Make it either Shield Tanking and Armor Tanking. Or maybe put "Management" after each.

    just my 0.02ISK

    My Condor costs less than that module!
    Maldiro Selkurk
    Radiation Sickness
    #276 - 2013-07-04 23:25:53 UTC
    Little Dragon Khamez wrote:


    Target Acquisition and Advanced Target Acquisition, increased levels in either skill allow you to 'aquire' more targets etc.


    I posted to this idea earlier, the term 'acquisition' is vague it could easily refer to locking time or an increase in targeting range, these are both abilities that increase your ability to 'acquire' a target.

    Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
    Shereza
    Center for Advanced Studies
    Gallente Federation
    #277 - 2013-07-04 23:34:54 UTC
    CCP Ytterbium wrote:

    Electronic System: is the old “electronics” group. Now only contains offense EW related skills.

  • Contains the Cloaking, Electronic Warfare, Frequency Modulation, Long Distance Jamming, Projected Electronic Counter Measures, Propulsion Jamming, Sensor Linking, Signal Dispersion, Signal Suppression, Signature Focusing, Tactical Logistics Reconfiguration, Target Breaker Amplification, Target Painting, Turret Destabilization and Weapon Disruption skills.

    • I think you forgot the Warfare in between Electronic and Systems. If they're all electronic warfare skills shouldn't it be Electronic Warfare Systems? Lol
    Joelleaveek
    Center for Advanced Studies
    Gallente Federation
    #278 - 2013-07-05 00:00:28 UTC
    "Spaceship Piloting" sounds like what a young child would say. How about "Starship Command".
    Daniel Plain
    Doomheim
    #279 - 2013-07-05 00:37:56 UTC
    just gona drop another .02ISK here: please stop making skill anmes too generic, straightforward and 'unsciencefictiony'. even a newbie should not be spared the effort to read what the skill actuallly does, so if the name does not desctibe it precisely but instead sounds atmospheric that's a win in my book. (multitalsking and nanite control can go away though, they're just dumb.)

    I should buy an Ishtar.
    Michael Harari
    Genos Occidere
    TRUTH. HONOUR. LIGHT.
    #280 - 2013-07-05 01:18:58 UTC
    I think electronic systems (the group) might be confused with the racial electronic subsystem skill