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Don't allow hackers to exceed maximum initial coherence
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Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#1 - 2013-07-01 23:59:33 UTC
Whenever I'm hacking, and I find a "spanner" self-repair tool, I always activate it immediately, because I might as well, since the game design currently is such that it is possible for me to go above my maximum initial coherence with such a tool. My T2 ship is fit to probe, and to hack both data and archeology sites, and has a maximum initial coherence of 130, but even if I find a +10/3t tool, I just activate it right away so that my coherence increases to above its maximum value, to 160.

That makes the initial coherence value be of less value, than if that value acts as an absolute ceiling on coherence, so that the hacker becomes forced to postpone the activation of the self-repair tool untul he has actually taken sufficient coherence damage. That way, hackers have to actually think more, instead of just following a 100% routinized procedure. And the active pursuit of higher initial coherence starts to make sense, in terms of ship fitting, and skillz, and whatever else might give a bonus to initial coherence.
Endeavour Starfleet
#2 - 2013-07-02 00:33:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Endeavour Starfleet
No. In game Hacking is crap enough as it is with the 2 fail rule.
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2013-07-02 05:36:58 UTC
Endeavour Starfleet wrote:
No. In game Hacking is crap enough as it is with the 2 fail rule.

Not to mention the "lets roll the dice and se how many suppressors and restorations we can put in to give you a virtual kick in the nuts"
Systems Online
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-07-02 10:15:34 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
Endeavour Starfleet wrote:
No. In game Hacking is crap enough as it is with the 2 fail rule.

Not to mention the "lets roll the dice and se how many suppressors and restorations we can put in to give you a virtual kick in the nuts"


Those are a pain in the ass. There can literally be times where things are unsolvable with max skills. When we're talking about a can with hundreds of millions in loot to be distributed out to multiple people (as CCP insists we have), it get's really quite troublesome.

OH, unsolvable. 1 more try or all that isk is gone!
Vesan Terakol
Trollgrin Sadface
Dark Taboo
#5 - 2013-07-02 10:26:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Vesan Terakol
This lack of maximum coherence barrier is what allows relatively untrained characters to have similar odds of accessing the containers and THIS is part of one of the core principles in the game - that better equipment and higher skill levels gives you an advantage, but not a big one and at an exponentially increasing cost.

And i feel that people, that critique the system, feel too entitled to receiving all the contents of all the cans. Sorry to disappoint, but the idea is that you can't have it all - you gotta play it smart, you have to get lucky and if you finally get the good stuff out of the can, you might as well feel happy, rather that just skip to the next can, mourning the loss of those 5 charred micro circuits.
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2013-07-02 19:48:17 UTC
Vesan Terakol wrote:
This lack of maximum coherence barrier is what allows relatively untrained characters to have similar odds of accessing the containers and THIS is part of one of the core principles in the game - that better equipment and higher skill levels gives you an advantage, but not a big one and at an exponentially increasing cost.

And i feel that people, that critique the system, feel too entitled to receiving all the contents of all the cans. Sorry to disappoint, but the idea is that you can't have it all - you gotta play it smart, you have to get lucky and if you finally get the good stuff out of the can, you might as well feel happy, rather that just skip to the next can, mourning the loss of those 5 charred micro circuits.

The thing is, for MANY cans, you either go above max coehrency or you may as well close out the window and pack up your stuff, because it would be unsolvable, hell, even with max skills and more than max coherency from repair tools, there are many hacks that i literally am unable to complete due to the sheer number of suppressors and restoration modules, and THAT si what most people complain about, the fact that the game will dangle 300mil+ in front of you and then give you an unsolvable gauntlet of F U's.

right now it doesnt matter what your skills are, you are either lucky and get a fairly easy can, or your unlucky and you get a can that no amount of skill will save, and THAT is what needs to be addressed. hacking has become a game of luck, pure and simple, it's a dice roll followed by a loot spew that basically means to make any money at hacking, no matter how prepared you are, is all based on a dice roll, hell, lets assume there is a valuable BPC in a relic, so i know it will be in a data can, so lets say i try my best and finally beat the hacking minigame because the RNG god is benevolent enough to hand me a winnable puzzle. now even assuming i did everything rigth and finally beat that, and assuming i even brought two friends with me, if it drops 5-6 data cans, there is still a high chance i will get 5 data sheets and then miss the 6th can that had the BPC.

so another issue with hacking is how multiple people can queue on the same wreck, with NO way to effectively communicate coordiantion, actually lowering the loot gained for all involved (it becomes even more annoying when it is always the SECOND person who clicks it who actually gets the can).

fact is, their are so many issues and poorly thought-out "features" with hacking now, that its a joke, hackingis just accessible for a vet as it is for a newb, since everything will be decided by a dice-roll anyways.
TheButcherPete
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#7 - 2013-07-02 21:52:11 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
Vesan Terakol wrote:
This lack of maximum coherence barrier is what allows relatively untrained characters to have similar odds of accessing the containers and THIS is part of one of the core principles in the game - that better equipment and higher skill levels gives you an advantage, but not a big one and at an exponentially increasing cost.

And i feel that people, that critique the system, feel too entitled to receiving all the contents of all the cans. Sorry to disappoint, but the idea is that you can't have it all - you gotta play it smart, you have to get lucky and if you finally get the good stuff out of the can, you might as well feel happy, rather that just skip to the next can, mourning the loss of those 5 charred micro circuits.

The thing is, for MANY cans, you either go above max coehrency or you may as well close out the window and pack up your stuff, because it would be unsolvable, hell, even with max skills and more than max coherency from repair tools, there are many hacks that i literally am unable to complete due to the sheer number of suppressors and restoration modules, and THAT si what most people complain about, the fact that the game will dangle 300mil+ in front of you and then give you an unsolvable gauntlet of F U's.

right now it doesnt matter what your skills are, you are either lucky and get a fairly easy can, or your unlucky and you get a can that no amount of skill will save, and THAT is what needs to be addressed. hacking has become a game of luck, pure and simple, it's a dice roll followed by a loot spew that basically means to make any money at hacking, no matter how prepared you are, is all based on a dice roll, hell, lets assume there is a valuable BPC in a relic, so i know it will be in a data can, so lets say i try my best and finally beat the hacking minigame because the RNG god is benevolent enough to hand me a winnable puzzle. now even assuming i did everything rigth and finally beat that, and assuming i even brought two friends with me, if it drops 5-6 data cans, there is still a high chance i will get 5 data sheets and then miss the 6th can that had the BPC.

so another issue with hacking is how multiple people can queue on the same wreck, with NO way to effectively communicate coordiantion, actually lowering the loot gained for all involved (it becomes even more annoying when it is always the SECOND person who clicks it who actually gets the can).

fact is, their are so many issues and poorly thought-out "features" with hacking now, that its a joke, hackingis just accessible for a vet as it is for a newb, since everything will be decided by a dice-roll anyways.


This member of Kadeshi is correct, and he may actually be the first member of that alliance I've seen have a personality.

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