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Jump Freighter Ganking - CCP what you will do against this???

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baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#181 - 2013-07-02 17:34:30 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:

Except it can be aligned and ready to instawarp the moment it scoops. By the time it turns red its in warp.


Its funny to think that back when this was announced many anti-gank campaigners got all excited and bounced around celebrating the end of hauler ganking and something about ganker tears.

We adapted before crimewatch even hit.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#182 - 2013-07-02 17:34:38 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
I didnt say it was a problem. It was a response to a reply pretending the freighter scooping was at risk of getting killed.
He is. Just because you can take precautions and mitigate a risk doesn't mean the risk doesn't exist. In fact, it proves it exists, or the precautions and mitigation would not be needed.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#183 - 2013-07-02 17:40:18 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:

Except it can be aligned and ready to instawarp the moment it scoops. By the time it turns red its in warp.


Its funny to think that back when this was announced many anti-gank campaigners got all excited and bounced around celebrating the end of hauler ganking and something about ganker tears.

We adapted before crimewatch even hit.

At least thats commendable.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#184 - 2013-07-02 17:46:59 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Tippia wrote:
on top of the inherent risks involved and the consequences that need to be paid.
Thank you. I needed a good giggle in an otherwise quite bad day Lol
I know. Reality can be funny some times. Too bad so many choose to ignore it and spend their lives in some kind of miserable bubble of unreal and imagined powerlessness.

Infinity Ziona wrote:
Player A (freighter) undocks in high sec in an slot less PvE ship. Player A only takes 10% of his capacity (2 billion isk of junk loot) to avoid being ganked. Player A is using his ship for its intended purpose. Player A gets ganked anyway because a bunch of low skilled cheap dessies costing 20 times less than his ship can kill his highly skilled expensive ship so cheaply they can do it just for lulz. Player A deliberately decides that this is a good use waste of the space and proceeds to jump blindly and/or AFK through well-known camp spots (suicides). Player A is a moron and not using the right ship for the job.

Player B (Carrier) undocks in a PvP ship without PvP mods. Player B jumps his ship deliberately into a battle (suicides) because a bunch of low-skilled cheap BCs costing 20 times less than this ship can kill his highly skilled expensive ship so cheaply (zero cost) that they can do it just for lulz. Player B is a moron and not using his ship for its intended purpose the right ship for the job.
Yes? And the analogy doesn't work… why, exactly? What's being obfuscated (aside from the parts you left out)?

Using an analogy which was in no way relevent to the topic, shift the focus from what was relevent to that which was not. Its an annoying and dishonest tactic.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Callyuk
M1A12 Corp
#185 - 2013-07-02 17:59:58 UTC
If you dont understand the mechanics of the way theyre gankling people watch this video. U may want to mute it since the mouse clicks it captured are annoying as fu**
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MmIsrAQPM4
Also hit the little gear to set it to HD 720P
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#186 - 2013-07-02 18:00:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Using an analogy which was in no way relevent to the topic, shift the focus from what was relevent to that which was not. Its an annoying and dishonest tactic.
The topic is that a particular ship that happens to cost a lot dies easily when faced with the onslaught of a fleet of smaller and cheaper ships.

The analogy shows that this happens all over the place and that no, just because the attackers' fleet cost 5% of the defender's hull doesn't mean there is any kind of balance issue. Trying to foist freighter ganks off as something special and unique that somehow stands out from the overall balance of the game and thus needs to be “fixed” is far more annoying and dishonest than showing that nothing about this premise is actually true…
Callyuk
M1A12 Corp
#187 - 2013-07-02 18:14:00 UTC
Freightors and JF are easy to gank due to them being the only ships in the game (other than a shuttle) that cant add nano/tank mods that said i accept nado alpha fleets as a legitimate gank just like hulkageddon. But when you can warp scramble the freightor for an hr and keep him aggressed for an hour (so he cant log off and disappear) then something has been abused in the game. Bubbles (not catch "drag,sling") were abused on POS's back in the day pulling anyone that warped to the POS in line with the buble through the POS into the bubble (Supers included) and it was deemed an exploit. It worked dam good as it was supposed to.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#188 - 2013-07-02 18:16:52 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Using an analogy which was in no way relevent to the topic, shift the focus from what was relevent to that which was not. Its an annoying and dishonest tactic.
The topic is that a particular ship that happens to cost a lot dies easily when faced with the onslaught of a fleet of smaller and cheaper ships.

The analogy shows that this happens all over the place and that no, just because the attackers' fleet cost 5% of the defender's hull doesn't mean there is any kind of balance issue. Trying to foist freighter ganks off as something special and unique that somehow stands out from the overall balance of the game and thus needs to be “fixed” is far more annoying and dishonest than showing that nothing about this premise is actually true…

The analogy has nothing to do with highsec freighter ganking. Its based on a fantasty scenario that makes no sense at all.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#189 - 2013-07-02 18:21:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Callyuk wrote:
But when you can warp scramble the freightor for an hr and keep him aggressed for an hour (so he cant log off and disappear) then something has been abused in the game.
Neither of those have anything to do with freighters, and both of them are legitimate tactics — in fact, the aggression flagging was explicitly put into place to get rid of certain abuses. Also, being able to do it for an hour doesn't make in any more of an abuse — it all happens in 15-minute portions anyway — it just makes it a complete failure on both sides. Lol

Quote:
Bubbles (not catch "drag,sling") were abused on POS's back in the day pulling anyone that warped to the POS in line with the buble through the POS into the bubble (Supers included) and it was deemed an exploit. It worked dam good as it was supposed to.
Eh no. POS shields were not working as they supposed to, which is why that was deemed an exploit. This makes it quite unlike both bumping and aggression-flagging.

Infinity Ziona wrote:
The analogy has nothing to do with highsec freighter ganking.
It's an analogy. It doesn't have to have anything to do with the case at hand. It just have to provide an illustration that shows the same phenomenon in some other context. It does that quite nicely.
Callyuk
M1A12 Corp
#190 - 2013-07-02 18:24:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Callyuk
The point is bubbles worked just like they were designed to But the designer didnt intend for them to pull people through there POS . Even though the game would allow you to do it , it was deemed as an exploit and people got banned for it .CCP fixed it in the next patch. Better ?
ZenSun
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#191 - 2013-07-02 18:25:25 UTC
such a **** post
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#192 - 2013-07-02 18:35:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Callyuk wrote:
The point is bubbles worked just like they were designed to But the designer didnt intend for them to pull people through there POS.
…in other words, the shields were not working as intended, which makes it completely unlike bumping or aggression flagging, and which made it an exploit (again completely unlike bumping or aggression flagging).

Quote:
Better ?
You're still trying to equate using something that's working as intended with exploiting something that wasn't, so no. Still as bad since the comparison is still the same.
Barron Hammerstrike
Medusa Nova Mining And Trade
#193 - 2013-07-02 18:37:45 UTC
Elder TheRock wrote:


CCP you want this kind of "pvp"....if yes, you will lost all old players
which gave your game the chance to grow 10 years ago!



Hopefully yes they do and no they won't.

Elder TheRock wrote:


I play now over 8 years Eve....but now its over for me....



Sounds like you had a good run and will hopefully only remember the good times when you think back on your time in EVE.

Elder TheRock wrote:


and all other players who want to tell me: "why you re so dump and fly in highsec with your Jumpfreighter"

It was not my, it was only a good friend in my corporation....the second one in the last 2 month....

we will quit now....

THANKYOU CCP
Regards
Tom


Ok-- bye bye now.
Victoria Sin
Doomheim
#194 - 2013-07-02 18:41:18 UTC
Callyuk wrote:
Freightors and JF are easy to gank due to them being the only ships in the game (other than a shuttle) that cant add nano/tank mods that said i accept nado alpha fleets as a legitimate gank just like hulkageddon. But when you can warp scramble the freightor for an hr and keep him aggressed for an hour (so he cant log off and disappear) then something has been abused in the game.


How does that happen in a high-sec ganking scenario? Surely the scramblers would be deleted from grid by concord.
Callyuk
M1A12 Corp
#195 - 2013-07-02 18:43:32 UTC
Victoria Sin wrote:
Callyuk wrote:
Freightors and JF are easy to gank due to them being the only ships in the game (other than a shuttle) that cant add nano/tank mods that said i accept nado alpha fleets as a legitimate gank just like hulkageddon. But when you can warp scramble the freightor for an hr and keep him aggressed for an hour (so he cant log off and disappear) then something has been abused in the game.


How does that happen in a high-sec ganking scenario? Surely the scramblers would be deleted from grid by concord.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MmIsrAQPM4
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#196 - 2013-07-02 18:45:22 UTC
Victoria Sin wrote:
How does that happen in a high-sec ganking scenario? Surely the scramblers would be deleted from grid by concord.
It doesn't. He's equating bumping to stop ships from aligning with scrambling.

Yes, trying to scramble someone for an hour straight would result in roughly 600 lost ships and would make the actual gank much harder to do…
Callyuk
M1A12 Corp
#197 - 2013-07-02 18:49:55 UTC
U MAD BRO ?
Zaxix
State War Academy
Caldari State
#198 - 2013-07-02 19:09:25 UTC
Lesson learned by OP: Always have an emergency cyno setup in range to reel your ass in if trouble develops. I'm reasonably certain that there is at least one losec station within jump range of every hisec system in EVE. There are definitely jump outs from Niarja and Uedama.

Norm Tempesta wrote:
Glad I use contract freighters. That way I don't look very 'dump'.

The Frog loves you for it

baltec1 wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:

Except it can be aligned and ready to instawarp the moment it scoops. By the time it turns red its in warp.


Its funny to think that back when this was announced many anti-gank campaigners got all excited and bounced around celebrating the end of hauler ganking and something about ganker tears. We adapted before crimewatch even hit.

Makes you wonder why no one thinks to bump it.

Bokononist

 
Callyuk
M1A12 Corp
#199 - 2013-07-02 19:32:55 UTC
Even if you did bump it theyll just jump out . they always use a jump freightor or 2
Zaxix
State War Academy
Caldari State
#200 - 2013-07-02 19:43:15 UTC
Callyuk wrote:
Even if you did bump it theyll just jump out . they always use a jump freightor or 2

It's almost like they understand the value of a nearby cyno. However, if you bump them before they scoop, they can't scoop and the whole flashy red, must jump situation never arises. Depending on your willingness to sacrifice a ship, you might consider shooting the wreck as well. Just some thoughts. All of which assume you're thinking ahead of the game, rather than theorycrafting after the fact in some GD thread.

Bokononist