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Purge Insurance

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The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-07-01 14:17:29 UTC
Insurance shop is completely unnecessary. It adds dead weight to the game design. It inflates isk. Remove it.

Let players create insurance corps if the mechanic proves at all necessary and worthwile.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#2 - 2013-07-01 14:18:28 UTC


Oh shut up

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#3 - 2013-07-01 14:20:48 UTC
The Spod wrote:
Insurance shop is completely unnecessary. It adds dead weight to the game design. It inflates isk. Remove it.

Let players create insurance corps if the mechanic proves at all necessary and worthwile.


Lol

yes I'm sure that players would be queueing up to provide this service

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-07-01 14:22:38 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
The Spod wrote:
Insurance shop is completely unnecessary. It adds dead weight to the game design. It inflates isk. Remove it.

Let players create insurance corps if the mechanic proves at all necessary and worthwile.


Lol

yes I'm sure that players would be queueing up to provide this service

I would, but you wouldn't want to pay my premiums, I assure you. ;)
Evangelina Nolen
Sama Guild
#5 - 2013-07-01 14:24:19 UTC
As if scamming wasn't bad enough.
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-07-01 14:26:14 UTC
Evangelina Nolen wrote:
As if scamming wasn't bad enough.

What's so bad about it? It's like IRL insurance. You separate the healthy idiots from their money to give it to the wise elderly who are doing everything in their power to avoid death.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#7 - 2013-07-01 14:26:22 UTC
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
The Spod wrote:
Insurance shop is completely unnecessary. It adds dead weight to the game design. It inflates isk. Remove it.

Let players create insurance corps if the mechanic proves at all necessary and worthwile.


Lol

yes I'm sure that players would be queueing up to provide this service

I would, but you wouldn't want to pay my premiums, I assure you. ;)


It's like you're saying you don't want to give me free money :(

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-07-01 14:26:41 UTC
Eve-Bank.....anyone?

Don't ban me, bro!
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#9 - 2013-07-01 14:27:35 UTC
I want the title of this thread to be changed to



PURGE Insurance (Please Ignore)

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#10 - 2013-07-01 14:29:19 UTC
The Spod wrote:
Insurance shop is completely unnecessary. It adds dead weight to the game design.
…except that it incentivises combat, which is good for the game.

Quote:
It inflates isk.
Not particularly.

Quote:
Remove it.
How do you propose to reimplement the equivalent functionality without these supposed flaws?
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#11 - 2013-07-01 14:31:15 UTC
Tippia wrote:

Quote:
It inflates isk.
Not particularly.



Oh come now, insurance is one of the biggest ISK sources in EVE (3rd or 4th IIRC)

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#12 - 2013-07-01 14:31:49 UTC


Insurance keeps nublets in the game and in Isk




Why is that bad game design?

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#13 - 2013-07-01 14:33:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Malcanis wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Quote:
It inflates isk.
Not particularly.

Oh come now, insurance is one of the biggest ISK sources in EVE (3rd or 4th IIRC)
Fourth, going by the old (only) numbers we have…

…out of 5 or 6, depending on how you count mission rewards.
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2013-07-01 14:47:05 UTC
Tippia wrote:
The Spod wrote:
Insurance shop is completely unnecessary. It adds dead weight to the game design.
…except that it incentivises combat, which is good for the game.

Quote:
It inflates isk.
Not particularly.

Quote:
Remove it.
How do you propose to reimplement the equivalent functionality without these supposed flaws?


I say it doesn't incentivise combat, only using more expensive ships for it, if the insurance payout is relatively big. This does damage to the spectrum of ships used if anything, as it promotes certain ships over others.

It inflates isk by turning minerals into isk.

The same effect of polarizing pvp ship spectrum can be achieved through introducing more balance issues, but it's not a goal to pursue.
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2013-07-01 14:51:36 UTC
Ramona McCandless wrote:


Insurance keeps nublets in the game and in Isk




Why is that bad game design?


It keeps the players who are isk aware in bigger ships if anything. The tedium of all these small unnecessary steps like insuring ships drives potential players off rather than keeping them in game.

If there were no insurance, the only thing that would change is the caution at using expensive but previously insurable ships.
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2013-07-01 14:53:05 UTC
The Spod wrote:
Ramona McCandless wrote:


Insurance keeps nublets in the game and in Isk




Why is that bad game design?


It keeps the players who are isk aware in bigger ships if anything. The tedium of all these small unnecessary steps like insuring ships drives potential players off rather than keeping them in game.

If there were no insurance, the only thing that would change is the caution at using expensive but previously insurable ships.

Or you could just forget about insurance like I do, only to remember it every damned time one of your ships gets exploded by a squid. You'd think I'd be better about making those two little button clicks by now.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#17 - 2013-07-01 14:55:17 UTC
The Spod wrote:
Ramona McCandless wrote:


Insurance keeps nublets in the game and in Isk




Why is that bad game design?


It keeps the players who are isk aware in bigger ships if anything. The tedium of all these small unnecessary steps like insuring ships drives potential players off rather than keeping them in game.

If there were no insurance, the only thing that would change is the caution at using expensive but previously insurable ships.



Um.....


When you get to the stage that you are using T2 ships, there is no incentive to insure


So I don't see what point you are trying to make



Insurance allows there to be 2 things


1) A safety net for noobs to find their feet. A Cruiser is a complete fortune for a 2 week old noob.

2) A safety net for vets who get robbed out/their alliance rolled/lose everything in a gamble to recover


Do you think that children should starve and the poor suffer for simply being poor?


If so, you should be in politics, not EvE

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#18 - 2013-07-01 14:57:12 UTC
The Spod wrote:
I say it doesn't incentivise combat, only using more expensive ships for it, if the insurance payout is relatively big.
Iow, it incentivises combat. It makes more tonnage blow up. This is a good thing.

Quote:
It inflates isk by turning minerals into isk.
…by a minute amount compared to the total ISK injection, and counteracting itself by creating a demand for more minerals.

Quote:
The same effect of polarizing pvp ship spectrum
…no, how do you propos to incentivise combat and make more tonnage explode?
Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting
#19 - 2013-07-01 15:15:34 UTC
I guess it's a balance between managing inflation and getting people into PVP more easily. I'll fully admit without insurance I'd be more carefull, take less bait, and would refuse to PVP unless I stand to profit from it somehow, which basicly comes down to just killing soft targets and sure-kills for their loot. I wouldn't fight you just to fight you. With insurance I cause inflation, but at least I'm out there exploding my ships. Kind of a double edged sword if you ask me.
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2013-07-01 15:34:57 UTC
Inxentas Ultramar wrote:
I guess it's a balance between managing inflation and getting people into PVP more easily. I'll fully admit without insurance I'd be more carefull, take less bait, and would refuse to PVP unless I stand to profit from it somehow, which basicly comes down to just killing soft targets and sure-kills for their loot. I wouldn't fight you just to fight you. With insurance I cause inflation, but at least I'm out there exploding my ships. Kind of a double edged sword if you ask me.

Well, if you look at it in the meta, it's causing inflation in a couple of ways. For one, it is increasing the money supply, while the lost ships/modules are decreasing the goods supply. Now, for ships and modules that can be directly manufactured, this isn't such a big deal, as someone out there is willing to build the stuff as it explodes. However, for meta items which can only drop from NPCs, it's a different story. Ever notice how ridiculously expensive meta4 stuff can be compared to T2, even when the T2 is far superior?
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