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Teenage gamer may go to prison for 8 years.

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Bort Malice
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#141 - 2013-07-01 13:09:18 UTC
Teenagers should be sent to prison. I don't see the issue here.
Simetraz
State War Academy
Caldari State
#142 - 2013-07-01 13:09:31 UTC
Bischopt wrote:
Simetraz wrote:
Bischopt wrote:
Tobias Hareka wrote:
Norian Lonark wrote:
Seems it was obviously intended as a joke, it may cause offence but lots of people make jokes about things that people would find offensive and do not get put in jail.


When was the last time you read newspaper or watched news from TV?

This should always be taken seriously. Joke or not. You just can't go to airport, shout you have bomb in your backpack -> "Dude! It was a joke!".


That's a pretty extreme example. Airports may actually be a special thing, especially in the states.

But I sure as hell can say to someone in real life that I'm gonna shoot up a school, laugh about it and say "just kidding" without the cops coming and locking me up.

Freedom of speech.


Afraid not you need to look up freedom.
Freedom to do something means there will be no repercussions from the government for your actions.
If there are repercussions like going to jail or receiving a fine your actions are not free.

Example - you can talk about hating your government all you want. (Freedom of speech)

Now if you start talking about killing your leader you are no longer talking but now implying a possible action and that can have repercussions.

Too many people/companies (especially news agencies) believe freedom gives them the right to be irresponsible it doesn't.
Your are responsible for your actions, and can be punished if you cross the line.


Prison.

For words.
We just went back in time.


Not back in time, it has never changed.
You must dress a certain way when at work.
You can't say certain things to your boss or you get fired.
You can't do certain things while in public.
The list goes on and on.
The internet allows people to say things they would never say if they were face to face.
Is that a good or bad thing.
A little of both perhaps.
In this case the kid would have been better off saying it face to face.
Keep in mind the written word has always been a binding contract, so saying something out loud does not always have the same consequences as putting it down on paper.
And that is the catch 22 so to speak with the internet.

EVERYBODY KNOWS
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#143 - 2013-07-01 13:14:21 UTC
War Kitten wrote:
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
War Kitten wrote:
Confirming that "lol, j/k" is a get out of jail free-card.

If the una-bomber had put it at the end of his manifesto, everyone would've known it was just a big joke.

Freedom of speech is not freedom to be an idiot and make threats in a public forum. Let the system work it out - that's what the system is for.

Mittens learned there was a line not to cross - this kid jumped past the line a bit farther. Both may have been joking, but both actions have consequences.

Did you really just compare a known murderer to some kid who made a smart assed comment on the internet? Seriously?


No, I pointed out the idiocy of taking "lol, j/k" as cancelling anything you just said, regardless of how threatening, stupid or ignorant it may have been.

Quote:

Edit: Mittens also didn't spend eight years in prison either, smartass.


No, but he felt repercussions for what he said "jokingly" in a public forum. Pay attention. Read critically, not emotionally. This 19 year old "kid" hasn't spent 8 years in prison yet either. That is the maximum potential penalty for the charges he is facing today.


The difference is that the example you used was for a person who DID commit acts of violence. The issue here is a case of someone assuming that another person intends to commit violence. I have been in similar situations to how this all started. Someone makes a comment about me being nuts, and I respond with something like "yeap, you should see the pile of hacked up old lady parts I have in my basement dipshit." Now, if the recipient of this message had gone to the police, and they investigated, I am sure they would be most shocked to find that I don't even have a basement. Then upon searching my apartment, they wouldn't find anything even remotely resembling what I was reported to have. That whole thing about assuming...yeah, it tends to make people look stupid.

As for the Mittens statement, allow me to rephrase then: there was absolutely zero chance of him serving prison time over his joke.
Ziphis
4S Corporation
The Initiative.
#144 - 2013-07-01 13:22:36 UTC
also does this mean all out dreams will come true and LoL will be shut down?

He was the sort of person who stood on mountaintops during thunderstorms in wet copper armour shouting 'All the Gods are bastards.'  - T. Pratchett
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#145 - 2013-07-01 13:24:16 UTC
Ziphis wrote:
also does this mean all out dreams will come true and LoL will be shut down?

I hope not. I need LoL to keep distracting the better PvPers in my corp so I can actually get some kills.
Bischopt
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#146 - 2013-07-01 13:24:24 UTC
Simetraz wrote:


Not back in time, it has never changed.
You must dress a certain way when at work.
You can't say certain things to your boss or you get fired.
You can't do certain things while in public.
The list goes on and on.
The internet allows people to say things they would never say if they were face to face.
Is that a good or bad thing.
A little of both perhaps.
In this case the kid would have been better off saying it face to face.
Keep in mind the written word has always been a binding contract, so saying something out loud does not always have the same consequences as putting it down on paper.
And that is the catch 22 so to speak with the internet.



Like I've said, looking into threats can be a good thing.
Throwing people into prison for them is not a good thing.

Even if you don't care about the life (or lives) being ruined by bad law(?) enforcement, do you really think as a tax-payer that this is a good idea? If we start putting everyone in prison who has made a violent joke on the internet, all prisons in all the world will see a spike of new inmates every one of which take tax money to keep alive and well.

I agree that actions have consequeces, but is 8 years in prison really the right consequece for this particular action?
I think not. I hope you think not as well.
Altho I don't really care what you think.
Hessian Arcturus
Doomheim
#147 - 2013-07-01 13:27:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Hessian Arcturus
Bischopt wrote:
Simetraz wrote:


Not back in time, it has never changed.
You must dress a certain way when at work.
You can't say certain things to your boss or you get fired.
You can't do certain things while in public.
The list goes on and on.
The internet allows people to say things they would never say if they were face to face.
Is that a good or bad thing.
A little of both perhaps.
In this case the kid would have been better off saying it face to face.
Keep in mind the written word has always been a binding contract, so saying something out loud does not always have the same consequences as putting it down on paper.
And that is the catch 22 so to speak with the internet.



Like I've said, looking into threats can be a good thing.
Throwing people into prison for them is not a good thing.

Even if you don't care about the life (or lives) being ruined by bad law(?) enforcement, do you really think as a tax-payer that this is a good idea? If we start putting everyone in prison who has made a violent joke on the internet, all prisons in all the world will see a spike of new inmates every one of which take tax money to keep alive and well.

I agree that actions have consequeces, but is 8 years in prison really the right consequece for this particular action?
I think not. I hope you think not as well.
Altho I don't really care what you think.


Not to mention that prisons (in the UK anyway, unsure about America) are already overcrowded.

It's human nature to want to explore. To find your line and go beyond it. The only limit, is the one you set yourself.
Space Juden
Supermassive Potato Pancake
#148 - 2013-07-01 13:28:08 UTC
It's a good thing AlphaOmegaSin has video games to help keep him off the meth
Jarod Garamonde
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#149 - 2013-07-01 13:31:02 UTC
Hessian Arcturus wrote:
This is an absolute joke of a court case.

EVE online better watch out because alot of us are always posting similar sh*t in local or somewhere. Apparently sarcasm is dead to the world now.

What's your verdict on sarcasm in EVE people?

EDIT: If you don't want to watch the youtube vid, links to the news article are in the description. I just find AlphaOmegaSin's reaction brilliant, and it pretty much mirrors my own view on the topic.


This is why you have to say "(in game of course)" after making a threat.

Also, I agree with goatee dude.... this crap is out of control.

That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right...

    [#savethelance]
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#150 - 2013-07-01 13:31:43 UTC
Hessian Arcturus wrote:

Not to mention that prisons (in the UK anyway, unsure about America) are already overcrowded.

I haven't looked much into this particular statistic in a long time, but the US has a proud tradition of incarcerating the highest percentage of it's population of any country in the world. Welp, since the whole economic superpower thing is falling apart, and Australia is now officially more obese than the US, we have to be in first place for something.
Balkor Wolf
Doomheim
#151 - 2013-07-01 13:35:05 UTC
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Hessian Arcturus wrote:

Not to mention that prisons (in the UK anyway, unsure about America) are already overcrowded.

I haven't looked much into this particular statistic in a long time, but the US has a proud tradition of incarcerating the highest percentage of it's population of any country in the world. Welp, since the whole economic superpower thing is falling apart, and Australia is now officially more obese than the US, we have to be in first place for something.


I wonder if the UK is still #1 in Teen Pregnancies... We've held that title for damn long time
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#152 - 2013-07-01 13:35:41 UTC
We live in a double plus good world. Crimethink is a reality.

Don't ban me, bro!
Simetraz
State War Academy
Caldari State
#153 - 2013-07-01 13:36:28 UTC
Bischopt wrote:
Simetraz wrote:


Not back in time, it has never changed.
You must dress a certain way when at work.
You can't say certain things to your boss or you get fired.
You can't do certain things while in public.
The list goes on and on.
The internet allows people to say things they would never say if they were face to face.
Is that a good or bad thing.
A little of both perhaps.
In this case the kid would have been better off saying it face to face.
Keep in mind the written word has always been a binding contract, so saying something out loud does not always have the same consequences as putting it down on paper.
And that is the catch 22 so to speak with the internet.



Like I've said, looking into threats can be a good thing.
Throwing people into prison for them is not a good thing.

Even if you don't care about the life (or lives) being ruined by bad law(?) enforcement, do you really think as a tax-payer that this is a good idea? If we start putting everyone in prison who has made a violent joke on the internet, all prisons in all the world will see a spike of new inmates every one of which take tax money to keep alive and well.

I agree that actions have consequeces, but is 8 years in prison really the right consequece for this particular action?
I think not. I hope you think not as well.
Altho I don't really care what you think.


I this case a private citizen filed charges against a person.
The police by law can't ignore it, they have to investigate.
Obviously they found enough evidence to arrest him and he goes to trial, and now the courts have to decide if he guilty or just foolish.
3 things could have prevented the entire incident.

1 - The kid could have used good judgement (which he didn't or maybe he wasn't joking now wouldn't that be a twist)
2 - The lady could have done nothing, she had to fill out all kinds of paperwork to get the police to respond (think about that)
3 - Change the law to give the police more power to ignore the law and do whatever they want (now that is not a good idea)

Last as other have stated the guy is NOT serving a 8 year sentence he is awaiting trial, nothing more.
He is still innocent as it stands right now.

EVERYBODY KNOWS
Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#154 - 2013-07-01 13:38:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Rordan D'Kherr
DreznicK wrote:

If you have a good dictator then in some respects you are much better off then with a group of people.


Shortening quotes and ignoring the context may lead to a statement that one didn't want to give really. See how this works? It is as easy for any law enforcement guy to give a spin on everything. To do good things only, of course. And only against "terror". Obviously.

Don't be scared, because being afk is not a crime.
Jarod Garamonde
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#155 - 2013-07-01 13:38:15 UTC
Mr Kidd wrote:
We live in a double plus good world. Crimethink is a reality.




You just went full 1984. You never go full 1984.

That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right...

    [#savethelance]
Hessian Arcturus
Doomheim
#156 - 2013-07-01 13:45:15 UTC
Simetraz wrote:
Bischopt wrote:
Simetraz wrote:


Not back in time, it has never changed.
You must dress a certain way when at work.
You can't say certain things to your boss or you get fired.
You can't do certain things while in public.
The list goes on and on.
The internet allows people to say things they would never say if they were face to face.
Is that a good or bad thing.
A little of both perhaps.
In this case the kid would have been better off saying it face to face.
Keep in mind the written word has always been a binding contract, so saying something out loud does not always have the same consequences as putting it down on paper.
And that is the catch 22 so to speak with the internet.



Like I've said, looking into threats can be a good thing.
Throwing people into prison for them is not a good thing.

Even if you don't care about the life (or lives) being ruined by bad law(?) enforcement, do you really think as a tax-payer that this is a good idea? If we start putting everyone in prison who has made a violent joke on the internet, all prisons in all the world will see a spike of new inmates every one of which take tax money to keep alive and well.

I agree that actions have consequeces, but is 8 years in prison really the right consequece for this particular action?
I think not. I hope you think not as well.
Altho I don't really care what you think.


I this case a private citizen filed charges against a person.
The police by law can't ignore it, they have to investigate.
Obviously they found enough evidence to arrest him and he goes to trial, and now the courts have to decide if he guilty or just foolish.
3 things could have prevented the entire incident.

1 - The kid could have used good judgement (which he didn't or maybe he wasn't joking now wouldn't that be a twist)
2 - The lady could have done nothing, she had to fill out all kinds of paperwork to get the police to respond (think about that)
3 - Change the law to give the police more power to ignore the law and do whatever they want (now that is not a good idea)

Last as other have stated the guy is NOT serving a 8 year sentence he is awaiting trial, nothing more.
He is still innocent as it stands right now.



Innocent but has been incarcerated for months while his date of his trial was to be decided and come around. Everyone at some point has said something sarcastically that they shouldn't have...

And yeah he's finding out today if he gets a jail sentance. Personally I hope not because if it carries on, it will eventually bring about stricter laws and monitering of games. Look at all the sensorship laws at the minute, there was uproar because the xbox kinect thing "watches" you. Imagine what will happen if thing like this carry on.

It's human nature to want to explore. To find your line and go beyond it. The only limit, is the one you set yourself.
Colonel Xaven
Perkone
Caldari State
#157 - 2013-07-01 13:47:18 UTC
Some people do not get sarcasm, irony etc. They don't need to go to jail for that, but a lesson would be a good idea.

Tutorial - How to be sarcastic and how to recognize sarcasm.

www.facebook.com/RazorAlliance
Linna Baresi
#158 - 2013-07-01 13:47:33 UTC
Hessian Arcturus wrote:
This is an absolute joke of a court case.

EVE online better watch out because alot of us are always posting similar sh*t in local or somewhere. Apparently sarcasm is dead to the world now.

What's your verdict on sarcasm in EVE people?

EDIT: If you don't want to watch the youtube vid, links to the news article are in the description. I just find AlphaOmegaSin's reaction brilliant, and it pretty much mirrors my own view on the topic.


I feel sorry for the kid, but it was bound to happen eventually, especially when people who watch in from the outside get involved. Stuff that's taken out of context, combined with not understanding gamer lingo, can lead to some pretty odd conclusions. And there is a LOT of prejudice about games and gamers to start with. Apparently we're all psychos who are rehearsing in game what we'd like to perpetrate in real life*... or so some media would have you believe. I'm pretty sure actual research shows gamers are LESS likely to have RL violent tendencies, but hey, who cares about facts when there's nicely bloodcurdling urban legends to be had...

* so OK, I know this gaming lawyer who's THE worst in game price gouger you'll ever see, but let's call him an exception. Besides, his only contribution to violence is making his customers want to commit it.

Member of since 2003 fated.europefreeforum.com
Q 5
999 HOLDINGS LLC
#159 - 2013-07-01 13:48:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Q 5
Epeen's everywhere now reduced.

That's the new America for you, ooops so sorry now I got to run cause now I'm officially a dissident wanted by the GOV for posting this unharmoniously things about our GOV.

On the other hand he may get awarded millions for them infringing on his constitutional rights.

If not it's officially the movie 1984 big brother here in the states.

Oh here's our soon to be national anthem;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U06jlgpMtQs&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#160 - 2013-07-01 13:49:06 UTC
Hessian Arcturus wrote:

Innocent but has been incarcerated for months while his date of his trial was to be decided and come around. Everyone at some point has said something sarcastically that they shouldn't have...

And yeah he's finding out today if he gets a jail sentance. Personally I hope not because if it carries on, it will eventually bring about stricter laws and monitering of games. Look at all the sensorship laws at the minute, there was uproar because the xbox kinect thing "watches" you. Imagine what will happen if thing like this carry on.

Therein lies the problem. Most people don't see a problem with this kind of thing. "It's for your own good" is being lapped up by useful idiots (pardon the Leninist phrasing) left and right. I once thought it was strange, but now it's getting downright pathetic.