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DUST Mercs

Author
Oenark Padelain
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-07-01 07:10:12 UTC
So now that dust bunnies can run around on the battlefield and die a million times, can capsuleers get the same implant as they do?

Because until then, I'm not stepping out of my pod!! We'll text over Neocom.
Tavin Aikisen
Phoenix Naval Operations
Phoenix Naval Systems
#2 - 2013-07-01 10:07:52 UTC
Oenark Padelain wrote:
So now that dust bunnies can run around on the battlefield and die a million times, can capsuleers get the same implant as they do?

Because until then, I'm not stepping out of my pod!! We'll text over Neocom.


I'd say it's either one or the other.

But they still need to be near their clone facilities for it to work. So it's not quite any new freedoms. :)

"Remember this. Trust your eyes, you will kill each other. Trust your veins, you can all go home."

-Cold Wind

Nayo Renyk
Armored Corps
#3 - 2013-07-01 12:12:36 UTC
I asked the exact same thing awhile back and actually got lucky enough to get a dev reply:
CCP Falcon wrote:
To cut a long story short, this wouldn't be feasable.

If we break cloning down it basically fits into three separate, distinct categories :

Standard cloning :

Anyone with the money to afford it can do this, and have a replica grown and a neural backup of themselves stored. A lot of famous people, people with insane wealth, political figures and suchlike do this, effectively like life insurance. Some Capsuleers also do this as a fail safe in case of capsule hardware failure or death out of pod.

Regardless, this has the disadvantage of amnesia that reaches from the point of death back as far as the last memory imprint stores up to, so fairly regular neural scanning to keep the records up to date is required. The soft scanning process is also far more lengthy, lasting up to an hour and way more inefficient in terms of time commitment.

Capsuleer cloning :

The cloning we're all familiar with. Automated neural burning, then the injection of a nanotoxin to effectively euthanize the pilot on breach of the capsule's hull. The technology only went into full scale commercial use in 104-105YC after decades of testing and the final success of merging the capsule and the clone.

Before then, Capsuleers used to fly ships the same, via neural control with all the benefits of reaction time, but no neural burning equipment, effectively still leaving them "mortal".

The technique in use today involves basically the same process as standard cloning above in terms of mind scanning, but the scan takes a nanosecond and records the state of every neuron in the brain. The process is destructive, and causes damage to brain tissue, thus the nanotoxin is used to effectively kill the pilot.

From here the data is uploaded via burst transmission to the pilot's registered cloning facility, then parsed to the memory of the new clone where the pilot awake with his memory right up to the point of death, probably annoyed with himself, other people, and with a considerable dent in his bank balance.

DUST Cloning :

This uses a "Fifth lobe" cerebral implant that allows the instant transfer of consciousness at the moment of death, and is a vastly different technology to that used by capsuleers. The implant is not naturally grown, it's harvested from... other means... and is implanted into the subject to be cloned. In short, like becoming a capsuleer, the success margin for this is VERY small, and you have to be very lucky and genetically sound to be able to survive the process.

Right now, we can't talk much about the backstory as a lot of it is still under wraps.


In the same respect, there are CONCORD laws that are enforced very vigorously regarding the activation of more than one clone of an individual at the same time to prevent "Clonejacking". Only one person has ever been successful at this, The Broker, who subsequently developed all kinds of physical and mental issues due to it.

There are several chronicles that detail the cloning process, clonejacking, and the laws surrounding it. You should check them out on the EVE Wiki.
Oenark Padelain
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-07-06 01:49:43 UTC
So... You're only immortal inside your pod? Got it. Thanks.

Bloody dust bunnies.
Stegas Tyrano
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-07-06 18:44:31 UTC
I thought the cerebral implants used by Mercs were reverse engineered by Amarrian Scientists because the harvested implants made the Mercs crazy?(hence them 'Uprising' going AWOL and writing 514 on civilian buildings)

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Oenark Padelain
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-07-08 20:00:05 UTC
Stegas Tyrano wrote:
I thought the cerebral implants used by Mercs were reverse engineered by Amarrian Scientists because the harvested implants made the Mercs crazy?(hence them 'Uprising' going AWOL and writing 514 on civilian buildings)

me too
Esna Pitoojee
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#7 - 2013-07-08 20:40:33 UTC
At this point, this is true for the vast majority of DUST mercs, yes.
Nayo Renyk
Armored Corps
#8 - 2013-07-09 10:00:50 UTC
Nayo Renyk wrote:
Stuff CCP Falcon said

Yeah, keep in mind this was awhile ago when dust was just in its beta I believe. But it seemed relevant so that's why i posted it.
Leopold Caine
Stillwater Corporation
#9 - 2013-07-09 10:46:08 UTC
Oenark Padelain wrote:
So... You're only immortal inside your pod? Got it. Thanks.

Bloody dust bunnies.


Quote:
The crucial element in the process relies on a brain-scan snapshot being taken at the precise time of death and transmitted to the waiting clone, and so the transneural burning scanner required to do so needs to be mounted somewhere close to the person at all times.Since the snapshot itself causes massive physical damage to the gray matter, there can be no margin of error; it needs to be done at the exact time of death. In planetary vehicles, the cloning companies have experimented with mounting the transneural scanner in a variety of locations, but the almost limitless potentiality of planet-bound environments has proved time and again that it just isn’t safe – snapshots either go off due to false stimuli, leaving healthy clients in a vegetative state, or fail to go off due to circumstances unforeseen by the safeguard mechanism, leaving clients dead with no chance of retransplantation.

In the capsule, however, things are different...



Taken from scientific article The Capsule and The Clone.

tl,dr: Technically, it is possible to be immortal outside of your pod, if you happen to have the above mentioned transneural burning scanner around. However, the chances of doing it successfully like in the pod are very, very slim. Godmoding hazard, use with caution.
  • Leopold Caine, Domination Malakim

Angels are never far...

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Oenark Padelain
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2013-07-10 07:55:34 UTC
Leopold Caine wrote:
Oenark Padelain wrote:
So... You're only immortal inside your pod? Got it. Thanks.

Bloody dust bunnies.


Quote:
The crucial element in the process relies on a brain-scan snapshot being taken at the precise time of death and transmitted to the waiting clone, and so the transneural burning scanner required to do so needs to be mounted somewhere close to the person at all times.Since the snapshot itself causes massive physical damage to the gray matter, there can be no margin of error; it needs to be done at the exact time of death. In planetary vehicles, the cloning companies have experimented with mounting the transneural scanner in a variety of locations, but the almost limitless potentiality of planet-bound environments has proved time and again that it just isn’t safe – snapshots either go off due to false stimuli, leaving healthy clients in a vegetative state, or fail to go off due to circumstances unforeseen by the safeguard mechanism, leaving clients dead with no chance of retransplantation.

In the capsule, however, things are different...



Taken from scientific article The Capsule and The Clone.

tl,dr: Technically, it is possible to be immortal outside of your pod, if you happen to have the above mentioned transneural burning scanner around. However, the chances of doing it successfully like in the pod are very, very slim. Godmoding hazard, use with caution.

Or in other words, you're not immortal. While the Mercs of DUST 514 get to go wherever they please.

It's okay though, I'm just waiting till I can nuke them from orbit
Esna Pitoojee
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#11 - 2013-07-10 16:52:12 UTC
Oenark Padelain wrote:

Or in other words, you're not immortal. While the Mercs of DUST 514 get to go wherever they please.

It's okay though, I'm just waiting till I can nuke them from orbit


First off, regarding DUSTies - it was my understanding that they had to be within a certain range of their host War Barge if they want to clone.



That said, regarding capsuleers and regular people cloning outside the pod:

There has long been a convention among RPers - at times explicitly recognized by CCP - that a kind of outside-of-capsule cloning method called "softscan cloning" exists. In this method, a non-destructive but time-consuming scan is used to produce a backup without destroying the patient; this scan file is then burned onto a new clone, but the clone not yet awakened.

Should the original patient be verifiably killed while outside of the pod, the clone is woken up, with all memories up until the scan intact. This is the primary disadvantage of a softscan - it is not neccesarily up-to-date.

While this is technically fanon, it has featured in Evelopedia and news articles, and been referenced by CCP actors.