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Missions & Complexes

 
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Missions and the eve sandbox...
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JAG Fox
GunStars
#41 - 2013-06-29 01:05:05 UTC
what would be the point in doing this though? other than pissing off mission runners..

 Fox Pin-up

Kisses!Foxie.
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#42 - 2013-06-29 02:05:06 UTC
missions are not "instanced" where nobody can enter it like other mmos. You can be scanned down and killed inside your own mission.

Art of Explosions
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#43 - 2013-06-29 02:45:43 UTC
Aren't mission payouts scaled based on the average mission running time? So if you run missions for a popular corporation that others blitz fast, the payouts are smaller? I haven't run missions in forever so I don't know if I am remembering that correctly.
Rain6638
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#44 - 2013-06-29 06:20:30 UTC
Derath Ellecon wrote:
Aren't mission payouts scaled based on the average mission running time? So if you run missions for a popular corporation that others blitz fast, the payouts are smaller? I haven't run missions in forever so I don't know if I am remembering that correctly.

I did notice a particular mission was worth nearly 7k LP for a certain corporation, while it is slightly better than 4k LP with Caldari Navy. so it might be true.

[ 2013.06.21 09:52:05 ] (notify) For initiating combat your security status has been adjusted by -0.1337
Xequecal
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#45 - 2013-06-29 06:38:56 UTC
The creation of the Tornado was the biggest missioning nerf ever. You get the same suicide-gank capability of a Maelstrom for a third of the price. Shield tanks really, really suck without a deadspace booster and the Tornado means it's pretty much always profitable to suicide gank a missioner with a deadspace booster, even if the entire rest of the fit is T2.
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#46 - 2013-06-29 09:07:09 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
missions are not "instanced" where nobody can enter it like other mmos. You can be scanned down and killed inside your own mission.


If you mine you are forced to sit in a belt that does not need to be scanned down, exploration you need to scan down to enter, but don't need to be scanned down with combat probes. Missions runners can only be scanned down with combat probes, which might be fair do to the fact it's more predictable in which systems my might find them.

But the consequence of someone scanning down your mission site, is nothing compared to having someone else enter a deadspace site. Unless you need a special item to complete the mission you can just ignore the person warping in, and kill what needs to be killed. If you lose the item you can just decline the mission, or just decline the mission start with.

Someone can repeatedly scan down you ship id, nothing special about that, harassment is not something unique that only affects mission runners, bumping miners seems to be much worse then someone scanning down mission runners.

Mission running is easy mode compared to all other professions, mainly because you get a solo site to do the mission, and the consequence of someone scanning down the site is close to non.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#47 - 2013-06-29 09:09:57 UTC
Xequecal wrote:
The creation of the Tornado was the biggest missioning nerf ever.


Not something unique for mission runners, industrial and freighters suffer as much if not more then mission runners.

It was a buff to suicide ganking, not a direct nerf to mission runners. You still have the option to fly something else then 10B faction battleships, and you are no longer at juice target.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
Turelus
Utassi Security
#48 - 2013-06-29 09:43:07 UTC
This is why I was in fully support of dynamic quality for agents.
If your agent becomes over used then the quality will lower and you'll be better finding a new one.

You can stay and run missions for the agent you want but if it's over used the LP/ISK payouts will go down as well, you would see more people moving around systems (if they want ISK) as well as maybe even people heading out of Caldari space as the LP there becomes much lower compared to the other less populated regions.

If you want to go even deeper into a dynamic universe then make the changes reflect FW as well, meaning there is more reason to want/need your side in the war to do well.

There is a lot of work that could be done to make HighSec more dynamic and involved. This can also be tired into the "nerfs" people are calling for within Empire.

Turelus CEO Utassi Security
Tarmaniel
State War Academy
Caldari State
#49 - 2013-06-29 10:30:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Tarmaniel
dexington wrote:
Xequecal wrote:
The creation of the Tornado was the biggest missioning nerf ever.


Not something unique for mission runners, industrial and freighters suffer as much if not more then mission runners.

It was a buff to suicide ganking, not a direct nerf to mission runners. You still have the option to fly something else then 10B faction battleships, and you are no longer at juice target.


Pretty much any shield-tanking BS with a deadspace booster is profitable to gank. Even a C-type LSB is 300 million, and that alone pays for the costs of the ships it takes to gank it. A C-type XLSB is worth 750 million, now you're making a gigantic profit via ganking. The profitability only goes up from there if other faction/deadspace stuff is being used.

So just use T2 stuff? Well, a T2 shield tank simply does not cut it in L4s. You need that deadspace booster. A Gist C-type has over double the cap efficiency of a T2 booster, and costs 70 CPU less to fit. People just don't understand how much of a game changer the Gist booster is, it's this line of items alone that makes shield tanking so supreme in PvE. PvE shield tanks without one just suck, and I mean they really really suck.

A 6-slot T2 shield tank with 2x CCC II and a CCC I on a RNI only tanks 300 DPS. That's with max skills, something missioners are not likely to have. It's just not enough, you'll get killed horribly in many missions. Running this "epic" 300 dps tank also means no prop mod and no catalyst rigs. Missions with a far-away gate take forever, missions with a bunch of elite frigs can't be done at all as they switch to your drones and your missiles cannot damage them without said rigs.
imbaRabbit
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#50 - 2013-06-29 12:16:44 UTC  |  Edited by: imbaRabbit
Feanira Darr wrote:
imbaRabbit wrote:

ship ID stays the same through the game for evar?


So, I've conducted few tests (again), and here are the results:

After I've scanned the ship, I've got the Signature ID. It seems that this Signature ID is tied to specific ship and a player. Once when you assemble ship it seems that it creates the new Signature ID which is in space (SigID = f(Character ID, ship)). I haven't tested out what will happen if you give your ship via the contract. It would be nice to see if it's possible to get the same Signature ID if you just contract the ship to other user who will then fly it in the space.

* Scanning the ship, I got the ship ID = #1.

* Checking the Signature ID after dock/un-dock: the Signature ID is same (#1).

* Checking the Signature ID after ship change: the Signature ID is not the same (#2).

* Checking the Signature ID after coming back into the first ship: the signature ID is the same (#1).

* Repackaging the ship has influenced the Signature ID - new ship ID is #3.

* Restarted client (session restart) and the signature is the same (#3).

* Changed the system, and the signature is the same (#3).

* Returning back into original system and the signature is the same (#3).

What is left to test?

* Check the Signature ID after server down-time. Pre-Odyssey the signature has stood the same, but I'll update this topic later (tomorrow).

EDIT: Same Signature ID after down-time (#3).

* Check the Signature ID after changing the ship owner (via contract, and without repackaging). Since we know that repackaging will change the Signature ID.

EDIT #2: Same Signature ID after exchange. Another pilot had the same Signature ID which I had (#3). I have the same ID after coming in the space (#3).
Zor'katar
Matari Recreation
#51 - 2013-06-29 14:10:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Zor'katar
dexington wrote:
Mission running is easy mode compared to all other professions, mainly because you get a solo site to do the mission, and the consequence of someone scanning down the site is close to non.

You haven't yet explained to us why this is a problem. Some professions are going to be easier/harder than others, which logically means there needs to be an easiest. You're telling us you think missioning is the easiest. So what?
imbaRabbit
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#52 - 2013-06-30 12:27:52 UTC
Cipher Jones wrote:
no its ship and resets at downtime.


It's not ship ID, to be more exact it's Signature ID.

Also, it does not reset after down-time, as I've said:

imbaRabbit wrote:

Does not matter where you are when someone gets your ship ID. It does not change, even after down-time, even after re-docking, even after changing ships


Although, I would just like to correct myself and change Ship ID into the Signature ID.
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#53 - 2013-06-30 12:35:50 UTC
imbaRabbit wrote:
Cipher Jones wrote:
no its ship and resets at downtime.


It's not ship ID, to be more exact it's Signature ID.

Also, it does not reset after down-time, as I've said:

imbaRabbit wrote:

Does not matter where you are when someone gets your ship ID. It does not change, even after down-time, even after re-docking, even after changing ships


Although, I would just like to correct myself and change Ship ID into the Signature ID.


Have you tried repacking the ship?, if i remember correctly that will give it a new id.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
imbaRabbit
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#54 - 2013-06-30 12:41:11 UTC  |  Edited by: imbaRabbit
dexington wrote:

Have you tried repacking the ship?, if i remember correctly that will give it a new id.


Post above: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3277458#post3277458 (EDIT: removed dot, lol).

I just have to test sharing the same ship without repackaging.

But probably, the Signature ID will stay since I think they're assigning a key which is not found within the list of occupied signatures.
Trudeaux Margaret
University of Caille
#55 - 2013-06-30 14:57:30 UTC
dexington wrote:
Dilligafmofo wrote:
Anyone is able to scan out your mission once you are inside it and take the mission objective / kill rats or indeed kill you.

Player interaction is everywhere


It's sooooo likely someone is going to scan you down while in a mission,




Has happened to me. In highsec.


> anyone willing to give me like a 5 min politics crash course?

> grr goons, lowsec is full of elitist sh*s, all roads lead to the bittervet pl
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#56 - 2013-06-30 20:35:58 UTC
This thread is missing something.. umm.. oh yea... Show me where the mission runner touched you???

if its so much fun and so easy.. doityourselfmate Roll
If you don't like it.. move on and do something you do like...
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#57 - 2013-06-30 23:58:10 UTC
1. regardless of the mechanic, missions are competetive negating the the question in the OP

2. who the **** repackages ships while missioning?

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
Jared Falkenberg
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#58 - 2013-07-01 06:25:44 UTC
If missions are such a great deal, why don't you run missions instead of trying to ruin someone else's fun?
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#59 - 2013-07-01 06:34:25 UTC  |  Edited by: dexington
Jared Falkenberg wrote:
If missions are such a great deal, why don't you run missions instead of trying to ruin someone else's fun?


I guess the idea of risk / reward, steep learning curve and harsh and cold universe don't appeal to you... maybe you should play something else instead of trying to ruin someone else's fun.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#60 - 2013-07-01 09:34:53 UTC
dexington wrote:
Why are we allowed to run missions without having to compete against other players?, no other profession is allowed to do that....
I know some Pirates that would disagree. They have lots of fun and make loads of ISK killing mission runners.