Science & Industry

Not sure that would help, as not every type of ore node is in high or low sec space. Example, you can not find a Hedbergite node in high sec space.

I was thinking a change in mining to help populate 0.0. I find it too easy to mine in hi sec right now. As it stand I can make more isk mining hi sec asteroids then I can in 0.0 asteroids when you factor in lower prices for mins, lower refine rates, and hauling costs, if you mine in 0.0.

I don't know any miners when I was in 0.0 that didn't at least rat as well.

Exactly my point... I moved to hi sec after running the numbers after a month in null. I make more isk more safely in 0.5 then I did in 0.0

Really? I found a large Hedbergite deposit only yesterday in highsec though...


To the OP - if you explained *why* you feel these changes are needed, or at least describe the problem which you are trying to address, the discussions which follow are generally more interesting.

So why not change mining all together

Let’s take a look on the economy of the game. From the understanding of a self-sufficient player driven Economy circle the game is pillared on:
1. Mining (Ore, PI, Moon, Recycling)
2. Production
3. Market
For the sole purpose to supply in one or other way:
4. PvP

Some call a sandbox I rather call it an economic simulation placed in hostile environment. Set the notations beside let’s focus on 1 mining in the relevance of a self-sufficient player driven economy; the retrieve of raw materials. I combine here Moon mining, planetary interaction and ORE mining under the terms of RME, Raw Material Extraction. Whether this is form Moon materials, PI,or ORE Mining. I explicitly leaf out RME trough recycling (drones and modules) as it would well exceed the size of the proposal.

A brief history of ORE mining in the Game:
In 2003 it seems appropriate for a new game to adapt to the general play style of almost any MMP Games at the time with some sort of mining. The economy of EvE evolved during the last 8 Years and being more dedicated to other materials than the basic ORE mining.
To my consideration and in the progress of economical evolving the present ORE mining has become outdated and therefore obsolete.
I focus hereby strict on the cost (investment, maintenance) and reward point of view

Cost/ reward scheme:

1.Moon mining (low and 0.0.) high cost
2. PI (all) median to low cost
3.ORE mining (all) low cost

With PI you set up your factory’s and take in the profit with no risk to the installation.

With ORE mining there is just an initial expense of the exhumer and non-other than a gank.
As for PI there are possible implements on the way to rise the rist/cost factor which will give it a more realistic place within the simulation (sandbox) by private owned custom offices and a possible role in a future Dust involvement.
Leaves mining ORE as a classic RME with only some little changes ever since. However it contains no real cost factor to run a mining operation and take the profit. No fuel cost (exept the rouqual). The other factor is, ORE mining as today can be done semi Afk ore full AfK which is not in the sense of the game.
However the action of mining itself commands doing it in AfK moode or at least semi AfK. Even the godfather of Mining Halada postulated in his well lauded Mining guide: “Staring for a sustained time on the mining laser will have you end up in the psych ward.” He was seriouse on it!

Whilst two of the RME’s, Moon mining and PI are for a good reason mostly automated processes, ORE mining isn’t, but should be!
As a side effect: A bot on a Moon POS, a bot on a PI installation are obsolete and ineffective as the material retrieving processes is already automated and only need attention requirement to restart the process. Of course you can place a bot to do some steering but as for PI, the available resource amount change and therefore require player attention.

Similar could apply to ORE Mining.

A Proposal:
No more Asteroid belts in any system as known.
Player driven Mining and refining colonies

The Source:
1. ORE belts around a complete planet and not just some rocks somewhere in a system.
Once mined, the Roids re-spawn on in-calculable time and size. Some death nuts are amongst them.
2. ORE asteroids are of significantly size revealing its ORE similar to PI. I prefer 1 as better since there already is PI.

The Equipment:
A POS similar mining colony means with the profit coms the expense. The excavators are operated from the mining POS. Small medium and large determine the amount of excavators.
Yes, they can be installed on High sec planets with a significantly lower resistance than a low sec or 0.0 Mining-colony. They are simpler to set up and faster to be demounted as the regular POS, and as such more mobile.

The Calculation:
Base calculation can be the amount mined by any Human operated vessel in the belt for a max of 2 hr. I personally think this is the max time one can pay attention to it without slipping in some sort of hypnosis. AfK mining is not considered in estimation!
8.000m³ volumes could be the amount of one excavator for 24hr. as the excavator can run just like a moon harvester or a PI installation, adjustable from one to 24 hr. The Mining-colony can be upgraded to do refining jobs.


New player modus.
Since mining is a source of income for new players:
Civilian Mining excavators with a loading capacity of 600m³/24hr. Ore must be transported to Player owned Mining colonies for refining.

I expect the fast majority of the mining community will dismiss this proposal but again, I do believe attention should be paid to the fact any action in the game supporting AfK and watch your favored TV show in the meantime, is not what the game is design for, any action within the game obsoleting the request of direct attention is an open door for botting and thus should be left to automated processes in first place.

Assumable, big alliances will not go for this proposal just as they state unanimously they don’t have any bots running in their hidden 0.0. Systems, but it is illusive to buy into this argument, the temptation is just too big!
So, more time to actually play the game and lifting ORE mining in a more realistic market situation equal to moon mining and future PI. On a second thought may even attract to a better use of Low sec.

It's just a raw frame work but somthing need to be done about mining on a bigger scale.

Im all for a hi sec mining nerf but I have some questions:

Wouldn't you need to nerf hi sec missions?
Wouldn't you need to nerf or eliminate all together refining loot?

If you nerf mining in hi sec, more people will just gravitate to missions and NO one will mine in hi sec leading to skyrocketing ship costs.

Also, some people are just hell bent on NOT going to low sec, which is fine.

I dont think that Hi sec mining needs to be nerfed (not against it) but I think Low sec needs to be buffed big time.

Just throwing this RADICAL idea out there to help buff low sec mining. How about:

Concord only in Hi sec (1.0, 0.9, 0.8, 0.7, 0.6)

Faction Navies only in 0.5, 0.4, 0.3, and 0.2

0.4 Navies difficult to tank, but can be tanked, will attack any criminal act just like Concord

0.3, 0.2 Navies relatively easy to tank, will attack any criminal act just like Concord - dificulty of escaping/tanking attack in 0.3 and 0.2 depends on players sec status. If you're a weak ass pirate, maybe two ships come to try to take you out. If you're a bad ass uber pirate, 10-15 ships come to try and take you out

0.1 sec no Navies present

You could take this even further for the pirates. If you're able to tank or get away from the Navy forces or even destroy some of their ships, you'll place the navy factions on a "regroup timer" in which you will have free reign to do whatever you want without the Navy coming to attack you as they are regrouping after the ass beating you just gave them. Lets say the timer is set to 30 minutes.

Maybe you could add some social skills to this. If you gain rep with an NPC pirate corp, maybe train up a new skill (call it Bribery). You do missions for the NPC pirate corp, they give you Bribe points that you can use with the factions navies to beasically say "Leave me alone for the next 3 hours". You'd still loose Sec standings, but the Navy wouldnt come attack you during this time. Bribe points can be tradeable.

Outside of introducing some uber valuable item in low sec that causes a gold rush, I think the only way miners or missions runners will go into low sec is if they THINK there is some kind of protection out there. Otherwise, Low sec will remain what it is, a desert.

My info must be out of date, but then I have not found this in high sec.

If you are seriously into mining, you cant count the skillpoints into wasted time ..... what else do you wanna train if you are miner ? :)

Scan down gravimetric site takes you one minute, and you can mine for 4 days there (if you are solo, you wont mine out it so quickly) ..... dont tell me THIS reduce your profit from mining :D