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CCP, AC Nerf Is Necessary

Author
Lysander Kaldenn
Cruel Sword
#21 - 2011-11-07 23:28:47 UTC
Hungry Eyes wrote:
Jiji Hamin wrote:
Man, Hungry Eyes... i see you post so much on this sisi section, and it's pretty much all so fail... I'm saying this as someone who is NOT a minnie ***** and who has their SPs into Amarr and Gallente... just stop it already


ive basically made two major threads, no big deal. if you dont support the threads, dont troll them and they'll sink. you just seem like an emo baby who doesnt want pulse lazors taken away from his baby hands.

something tells me this patch will be delicious.


I thought this thread was about Autocannons? You slipped up bro. Just tell the truth, you want every weapon system that isn't a blaster or a rail nerfed...
Hungry Eyes
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#22 - 2011-11-07 23:51:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Hungry Eyes
Lysander Kaldenn wrote:


I thought this thread was about Autocannons? You slipped up bro. Just tell the truth, you want every weapon system that isn't a blaster or a rail nerfed...



slipped up from what? there's not pretense here, hybrids need a spot in this game.

option A is make hybrids fit the current meta. blasters dont belong here, unless you buff Null damage and fall off by like 200%

option B is bring pulses and AC's closer toward hybrid level while buffing hybrids from their current state.

im actually hoping for a middle-ground solution, which is option B. this include a nerf to AC falloff and/or tracking. what is it that youre proposing?
Voith
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2011-11-08 00:34:58 UTC
Hungry Eyes wrote:
Lysander Kaldenn wrote:


I thought this thread was about Autocannons? You slipped up bro. Just tell the truth, you want every weapon system that isn't a blaster or a rail nerfed...



slipped up from what? there's not pretense here, hybrids need a spot in this game.

option A is make hybrids fit the current meta. blasters dont belong here, unless you buff Null damage and fall off by like 200%

option B is bring pulses and AC's closer toward hybrid level while buffing hybrids from their current state.

im actually hoping for a middle-ground solution, which is option B. this include a nerf to AC falloff and/or tracking. what is it that youre proposing?

Option C:
Leave Hybrids as **** because only two races are meant to be viable. One for PvP and one for PvE.


Guess which one will be picked.
Lysander Kaldenn
Cruel Sword
#24 - 2011-11-08 00:35:28 UTC
You're a bit slow aren't you. I'm not proposing anything. You are the one who is making (terrible) proposals.
Grimpak
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2011-11-08 01:06:34 UTC
hmm... nerfing falloff bonus from falloff bonused hulls. 10 to 5%?

[img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]

[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right

Yvan Ratamnim
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#26 - 2011-11-08 01:41:10 UTC
NO CCP DO NOT LISTEN TO THIS BS...

NO MORE NERFING

IF ANYTHING BUFF OTHER WEAPONS THAT NEED LOVE! Hybrids need love, Lasers feel fine to me just ask the hundreds of 0.0 fleet fights, missles are ok... but honestly due to there travel time will never be premo pvp weapons.
Jiji Hamin
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2011-11-08 02:26:44 UTC
Yvan Ratamnim wrote:
NO CCP DO NOT LISTEN TO THIS BS...

NO MORE NERFING

IF ANYTHING BUFF OTHER WEAPONS THAT NEED LOVE! Hybrids need love, Lasers feel fine to me just ask the hundreds of 0.0 fleet fights, missles are ok... but honestly due to there travel time will never be premo pvp weapons.


qft
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#28 - 2011-11-08 05:26:19 UTC
At this point, I am adapt or die. Was running some killer fits that were smoking tornados earlier on the sisi. It really comes down to ship and fleet config. First off, if those weren't ecm drones, you would have had munching. Imagine if it was a couple berserker sws, two volley from the abaddon and poof? Is what I did to a guy when I was doing counter T3 in a bs. Naga? WTF was the guy doing close range with 425s to begin with. Antimatter and good bc skills, 100km operational range not much problem and speeds of 2500m/s. Saw an oracle take out 7 agressed tornadoes.

In testing, they are very much rock paper scissors. There are power fits, and there are easy ways to take them out. T3 are the most extreme end of the spectrum. We can play all we want on sisi, and yes, there are many points of imbalance, but we are not getting proper fleet fights.

As the new YARR, we be pirates ship, is epic, the power of battleships, the maneuverability of cruisers. This will make piracy faster paced, and same with counter piracy. The concept is very sound. But in my opinion, it is a ship which balance cannot truely be found until it really does hit TQ. Right now the only main issue is there are some kinda iffy bugs that need work around that I can see.

To quote Lfod Shi

The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.

Gypsio III
State War Academy
Caldari State
#29 - 2011-11-08 08:38:12 UTC
Yvan Ratamnim wrote:
NO CCP DO NOT LISTEN TO THIS BS...

NO MORE NERFING

IF ANYTHING BUFF OTHER WEAPONS THAT NEED LOVE! Hybrids need love, Lasers feel fine to me just ask the hundreds of 0.0 fleet fights, missles are ok... but honestly due to there travel time will never be premo pvp weapons.


Won't work. The previous power creep of which you are so fond has resulted in the intrusion of ACs and Pulse into blasters' realm and artillery and Beams/Tachyons into rails' realm. Boosting hybrids doesn't change the fact that, since projectiles and lasers are now highly effective at close- and long-range, hybrids are unnecessary.

The only way to solve this is to evict projectiles and lasers from hybrids' roles. Deal with it.
Keen Fallsword
Skyway Patrol
#30 - 2011-11-08 11:47:17 UTC
There is only one option Stats switching between AC in Hybrids only that way game has a chance to be balanced. And I can fly both so Im not Gal only. This is stupid at it is now coz we have nice ships that we cant. fly. How long I can fly CANE or Vaga ... Its 3 yrs now ! Im bored !

STATS SWITCHING !!! "SO SAY WE ALL" !
Spc One
The Chodak
Void Alliance
#31 - 2011-11-08 14:06:43 UTC
Grimpak wrote:
hmm... nerfing falloff bonus from falloff bonused hulls. 10 to 5%?

Don't nerf anything as said before, buff stuff or improve guns that are broken, but do not nerf.
VeloxMors
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#32 - 2011-11-08 14:14:14 UTC  |  Edited by: VeloxMors
Seems more like tears to me, tbh.

Put a dual web+scram cane/brutix in the same situations as the Tornado in that video... same outcomes.

It's pretty easy to look at a few chance encounters that went the Tornado pilots way and call that OP. Realistically, the pilots he faced were pretty stupid.
Jiji Hamin
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#33 - 2011-11-08 15:47:01 UTC
Keen Fallsword wrote:
There is only one option Stats switching between AC in Hybrids only that way game has a chance to be balanced. And I can fly both so Im not Gal only. This is stupid at it is now coz we have nice ships that we cant. fly. How long I can fly CANE or Vaga ... Its 3 yrs now ! Im bored !

STATS SWITCHING !!! "SO SAY WE ALL" !


**** off
Captain Alcatraz
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#34 - 2011-11-08 17:54:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Captain Alcatraz
Hungry Eyes wrote:
Lysander Kaldenn wrote:


I thought this thread was about Autocannons? You slipped up bro. Just tell the truth, you want every weapon system that isn't a blaster or a rail nerfed...



slipped up from what? there's not pretense here, hybrids need a spot in this game.

option A is make hybrids fit the current meta. blasters dont belong here, unless you buff Null damage and fall off by like 200%

option B is bring pulses and AC's closer toward hybrid level while buffing hybrids from their current state.

im actually hoping for a middle-ground solution, which is option B. this include a nerf to AC falloff and/or tracking. what is it that youre proposing?


Leveling down sucks. If your blasters are not on par dont ask for ACs to get nerfed, that's a pathetic mindset.

If they ever nerfed ACs you'd be asking for a laser nerf few weeks later?

Dont touch what's working and what people enjoy.

Now blasters, they should not become ACs 2.0. They should excell at what they are supposed to: point blank DPS and tracking. Stop expecting them to work like ACs and go use them in scram + web range, they're pretty damn good at that with the changes.

Next
Akturous
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#35 - 2011-11-09 01:29:48 UTC
Hungry Eyes wrote:
Akturous wrote:
Foff to put it lightly,


yes, i agree. fall off is the problem, that's what ive been saying.


Akturous wrote:
Autos do not need a nerf, if they nerfed the falloff or speed of minmatar, kiting wouldn't be possible, which takes out a whole aspect of the game.


it takes the Win out of Winmatar, thats for sure. heavens forbid you actually have to use some skill every now and then.



Use some skill? Are you serious?

You want Minmatar slower than Gallente with short range weapons, so you can catch them and pwn them without even trying.

God forbid you might actually use some skill or timing to catch a kiting ship. Ever tried running out of point range and then pulling a crazy ivan, heat your mids and catch the kiter when he overshoots back towards you? Didn't think so. Ever tried a heavy neut or two to shut of their mwd?

Take the Vagabond as an example. It doesn't have the pg to fit arty's, so you fit 220's. The actual dps at point range is around 350, hardly epic. Both a drake and Harby WTF BBQ it (the harby less so). I'd say missiles and scorch need a nerf, but I don't, because I'm not a ****** who can't pilot a ship and just wants to web/scram/kill.

The claim that autos do too much damage at close range is bull, blasters and lasers do more, so it's pretty balanced really (with the exception of blasters needing more damage and tracking).

In point of fact, I use artillery on my cane because at point range they do way more damage than autos, so it's balanced according to your criteria. Now shut up and pray for a damage buff to blasters.

Vote Item Heck One for CSM8

Hungry Eyes
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#36 - 2011-11-09 01:41:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Hungry Eyes
Akturous wrote:


You want Minmatar slower than Gallente with short range weapons, so you can catch them and pwn them without even trying.



i dont know where you got this from (it's so off base that i refrained from reading the rest of your post to prevent an aneurysm). my issue is that Minmatard ships dont take enough skill (relative to their effectiveness) because kiting with such a huge fall off with agile, high-speed ships is brainless. if maintaining optimal range to deal most of your dps played more of a role in PVP (like it does only for sniping ships and laser boats), this would be a much more interesting game. there's a reason why canes and drakes are ubiquitous. both ships always hit.
Akturous
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#37 - 2011-11-09 01:49:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Akturous
Hungry Eyes wrote:
Akturous wrote:


You want Minmatar slower than Gallente with short range weapons, so you can catch them and pwn them without even trying.



i dont know where you got this from (it's so off base that i refrained from reading the rest of your post to prevent an aneurysm). my issue is that Minmatard ships dont take enough skill (relative to their effectiveness) because kiting with such a huge fall off with agile, high-speed ships is brainless. if maintaining optimal range to deal most of your dps played more of a role in PVP (like it does only for sniping ships and laser boats), this would be a much more interesting game. there's a reason why canes and drakes are ubiquitous. both ships always hit.



Fine, make autos optimal range 25k like scorch with barrage and I'll take that anyday over fall off. Your failing to read my whole post proves what I thought. You seem to fail to understand that falloff gives much reduced damage and even the chance to miss completely quite often.

Have you ever honestly used a kiting minmatar ship in pvp for an extended period? Or are you just a fail Gallente pilot who's had their arse handed to them (frankly because basters are shite right now).

How about you post with your main as well, instead of a cyno alt.

Here's some cold hard facts for your simple arse:

http://my.jetscreenshot.com/6200/20111109-idnw-336kb

Light blue is Mega dps, Dark blue is pest, both without drones (remember you have 50 more b/w and capacity). Pest has 65k ehp, mega has 114k ehp. Post patch mega can fit a heavy cap booster with the heavy neut, so the dual neuts of the pest aren't too much of a problem.

Fit's for comparison:

http://my.jetscreenshot.com/6200/20111109-jpv1-414kb Pest

http://my.jetscreenshot.com/6200/20111109-afqa-407kb Mega

Now stop bitching.

Vote Item Heck One for CSM8

Shivus Tao
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#38 - 2011-11-09 02:01:35 UTC
Buff the harb so that it can field a full set of heavy pulses along with a good armor tank. Buff the myrm to have 20% drone damage per level instead of 10% to offset ye olde bandwidth nerf.
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