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CCP fix your dam game, Welcome to Tidi online

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Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#61 - 2013-06-24 08:00:51 UTC
Funny to see all the pubbies complaining about the best improvement an MMO has got ever.

Guys, if you are new to the game, remember: There were times when you had 1-2 frames per minute with 300 people on grid.

Don't be scared, because being afk is not a crime.
Lady Areola Fappington
#62 - 2013-06-24 08:38:45 UTC
Grimpak wrote:


well, the other improvement they had in sight was to implement something akin to Ifiniband to move processing threads about the whole network of processors in the server cluster. you don't need to be a tecnojumbo guy to understand that this bit here is pretty much hi-tech edge that only a handfull of companies have the capability to have it done, if there was anybody that did it.

when they implenented TiDi, it was visible that it was a stopgap so that they could catch some air and develop new ways, including the Infiniband project. Players, as usual, think the system can handle 1 zillion of players, so they try to put 2 zillion players in the same system. so yes, it's no wonder you get max TiDi in the end.


It's honestly rather funny to listen to the Dunning-Kruger know-it-alls screaming "Fix TiDi, Fix lag, I'm not a tech just fix it! More servers more code!" (This of course, not directed at you Mr. Grim, you seem to grasp it.)

If you actually pay attention to the tech world, and MMO gaming in particular, you find out CCP does some groundbreaking things with it's systems. IIRC, CCP has one of the either top 10 or top 25 supercomputers in the world, and Jita lives on hardware originally designed to keep up with high-speed high-volume Wall Street style trading (ironic, huh?).

The problem is us players. Population will always follow lag. Pack 2500 in a system, we'll try putting 3000 in. Get 3000 working smooth, we'll go up to 3500.

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide
Neuntausend
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#63 - 2013-06-24 12:28:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Neuntausend
Rordan D'Kherr wrote:
Funny to see all the pubbies complaining about the best improvement an MMO has got ever.

Guys, if you are new to the game, remember: There were times when you had 1-2 frames per minute with 300 people on grid.



Tidi is indeed a good thing. When it lags despite of time running at 10% it still sucks.

TQ is nowhere near top 10 btw, of that I am certain. In gaming there's nothing like it, but modern supercomputers are way out of TQs reach.
Muad 'dib
State War Academy
Caldari State
#64 - 2013-06-24 12:31:45 UTC
I always thought TiDi was a bit of a werid thing to introduce.

Take a fight that lasts 2 hours, with heavy TiDi who knows how long you have to wait before you blown up/win

People have lives and need to eat etc TiDi is very bad for people with specific time windows to play and this makes 0.0 more unattractive.

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.
Neuntausend
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#65 - 2013-06-24 12:36:01 UTC
Muad 'dib wrote:
People have lives and need to eat etc TiDi is very bad for people with specific time windows to play and this makes 0.0 more unattractive.


The same was true before as well. Fights before TiDi could take just as long as you had to wait for sessiontimers for 20 minutes straight, modules fired once and then either never again or you couldn't turn them of for the next 15 minutes. Blobfights don't work well with time restrictions, especially since players will not adapt to your plans as well.
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#66 - 2013-06-24 12:50:53 UTC
Muad 'dib wrote:
I always thought TiDi was a bit of a werid thing to introduce.

Take a fight that lasts 2 hours, with heavy TiDi who knows how long you have to wait before you blown up/win

People have lives and need to eat etc TiDi is very bad for people with specific time windows to play and this makes 0.0 more unattractive.



When you fleet up for a fight and spend already more than 2 fighting with TiDI just to get at destination, then another 1.5H fighting again with TiDi flowing warp/aling instructions to finally fight for 30min with only 1000 in system sucks.

Last year I've done fights with over 2800 in local, super/titan fleets on grid drones deployed, several support fleets fighting each other, bubbles popping everywhere and was far more playable than these last 600+guys fleets I've been doing lately.

Don't know wtf CCP is doing about reinforcement nodes or the heck they do but it's getting worst, not better.

removed inappropriate ASCII art signature - CCP Eterne
Smoking Blunts
ZC Omega
#67 - 2013-06-24 13:22:43 UTC
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:
Muad 'dib wrote:
I always thought TiDi was a bit of a werid thing to introduce.

Take a fight that lasts 2 hours, with heavy TiDi who knows how long you have to wait before you blown up/win

People have lives and need to eat etc TiDi is very bad for people with specific time windows to play and this makes 0.0 more unattractive.



When you fleet up for a fight and spend already more than 2 fighting with TiDI just to get at destination, then another 1.5H fighting again with TiDi flowing warp/aling instructions to finally fight for 30min with only 1000 in system sucks.

Last year I've done fights with over 2800 in local, super/titan fleets on grid drones deployed, several support fleets fighting each other, bubbles popping everywhere and was far more playable than these last 600+guys fleets I've been doing lately.

Don't know wtf CCP is doing about reinforcement nodes or the heck they do but it's getting worst, not better.



tbh I think the newly introduced lag into TiDi is caused by all the extra fluffy crap they added that cant be turned off. 2000 people jumping into a system scanning for anoms. like wtf were they thinking?

OMG when can i get a pic here
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#68 - 2013-06-24 13:27:08 UTC
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:
Muad 'dib wrote:
I always thought TiDi was a bit of a werid thing to introduce.

Take a fight that lasts 2 hours, with heavy TiDi who knows how long you have to wait before you blown up/win

People have lives and need to eat etc TiDi is very bad for people with specific time windows to play and this makes 0.0 more unattractive.



When you fleet up for a fight and spend already more than 2 fighting with TiDI just to get at destination, then another 1.5H fighting again with TiDi flowing warp/aling instructions to finally fight for 30min with only 1000 in system sucks.

Last year I've done fights with over 2800 in local, super/titan fleets on grid drones deployed, several support fleets fighting each other, bubbles popping everywhere and was far more playable than these last 600+guys fleets I've been doing lately.

Don't know wtf CCP is doing about reinforcement nodes or the heck they do but it's getting worst, not better.


Those fights happened on a reinforced node.
Muad 'dib
State War Academy
Caldari State
#69 - 2013-06-24 13:35:25 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:
Muad 'dib wrote:
I always thought TiDi was a bit of a werid thing to introduce.

Take a fight that lasts 2 hours, with heavy TiDi who knows how long you have to wait before you blown up/win

People have lives and need to eat etc TiDi is very bad for people with specific time windows to play and this makes 0.0 more unattractive.



When you fleet up for a fight and spend already more than 2 fighting with TiDI just to get at destination, then another 1.5H fighting again with TiDi flowing warp/aling instructions to finally fight for 30min with only 1000 in system sucks.

Last year I've done fights with over 2800 in local, super/titan fleets on grid drones deployed, several support fleets fighting each other, bubbles popping everywhere and was far more playable than these last 600+guys fleets I've been doing lately.

Don't know wtf CCP is doing about reinforcement nodes or the heck they do but it's getting worst, not better.


Those fights happened on a reinforced node.


http://i.imgur.com/A18FbLt.jpg ?

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.
BoBoZoBo
MGroup9
#70 - 2013-06-24 14:59:49 UTC  |  Edited by: BoBoZoBo
Really? You don't remember the kind of lag and black screens we had before TiDi was introduced do you?

It's like banging a smoking hot woman and asking CCP to bring that old smelly hag back, but only because you forget how bad it was, or you just were not here to experience it;

TiDi is a fu@king gift. Why don't you go play that other game that lets you fight in 2000 man fleets...

Primary Test Subject • SmackTalker Elite
Urgg Boolean
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#71 - 2013-06-24 16:18:32 UTC
Time dilation is a program to hire older, fatter, slower and burnt out hamsters and simultaneously avoid age-related job discrimination. These hamsters are better off making a living wage compared to being on the dole and dragging down society. We must learn to accept this for the sake geriatric hamsters and society in general.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#72 - 2013-06-24 16:56:25 UTC
Grimpak wrote:
when they implenented TiDi, it was visible that it was a stopgap so that they could catch some air and develop new ways, including the Infiniband project. Players, as usual, think the system can handle 1 zillion of players, so they try to put 2 zillion players in the same system. so yes, it's no wonder you get max TiDi in the end.

Of course, we're blobbers. You better count on one-upping the other side until we're all in a TiDi Wonderland.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Ruskarn Andedare
Lion Investments
#73 - 2013-06-24 18:02:36 UTC
Smoking Blunts wrote:

tbh I think the newly introduced lag into TiDi is caused by all the extra fluffy crap they added that cant be turned off. 2000 people jumping into a system scanning for anoms. like wtf were they thinking?


Surely most of that is client side, the server just has to feed the anom info with the rest of the system data
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#74 - 2013-06-24 18:05:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Murk Paradox
Edited since the information was already posted/addressed.

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#75 - 2013-06-24 18:12:03 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Pisov viet wrote:
Vicar2008 wrote:
I really aint wanting to login to this crap. This is all.......

Already on the way to fix the issue, then.

This is part of a war winning strategy.

Imagine shooting structures in TiDi, the joy.



That would actually be fun.

Make bets on the % of shields the structure has left at the next "update".

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#76 - 2013-06-24 18:16:21 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Isn't there a paperwork to be done to request a node to be reinforced in advance? If yes, was it filled in due time before the event?

Also, would it be possible for an invasion to happen in ultiple system insetda of all jumping in the same at the same time? I mean by now everybody know it jams after a few hundred. Is it impossible to work around the current limitation since a hard fix probably won't happen soon?



I would assume that something like Fountain should already be filed, and that any CCP employee in any of those corps involved should have made the necessary calls.

Anything less is irresponsible.

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Toshiro Hasegawa
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#77 - 2013-06-24 18:38:32 UTC
lolz me loves da pvp tears .. QQ

moar please ccp

History is the study of change.

Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#78 - 2013-06-24 18:48:57 UTC
Kharamete wrote:

The primary thing being that you do not actually understand is the nature of the problem, which is social rather than technological. CCP can never solve the problem of too many people in the same fight, because as soon as CCP achieve a level of stability at a certain level, then the players bring in even more players until the system once again becomes unstable.

TiDi is a solution to a social problem. Unfortunately it does not act much as a deterrent to the lemming behaviour of the player base that insist on bringing more and more people to a fight. CCP can never engineer away the human element, no matter how much hardware they dedicate to the problem.


Look, overpopulation phenomenon happens in nature. Nature has developed efficient ways to deal with the issue, be it simple starvation due to scarcity of resources to lemmings brute force migrations that result in mass deaths.

In MMOs the most used and efficient way to deal with overpopulation is to place diminishing returns. If benefits from taking in more people would rapidly decrease past a certain thresold, then it'd be useless to farm huge tons of disposable fresh meat to throw to the grinder and the phenomenon would slowly settle down to the last best known balance between numbers and efficiency.

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Amarra Mandalin
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#79 - 2013-06-24 19:00:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Amarra Mandalin
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
[quote=Grimpak]

It's honestly rather funny to listen to the Dunning-Kruger know-it-alls screaming "Fix TiDi, Fix lag, I'm not a tech just fix it! More servers more code!" (This of course, not directed at you Mr. Grim, you seem to grasp it.)

If you actually pay attention to the tech world, and MMO gaming in particular, you find out CCP does some groundbreaking things with it's systems. IIRC, CCP has one of the either top 10 or top 25 supercomputers in the world, and Jita lives on hardware originally designed to keep up with high-speed high-volume Wall Street style trading (ironic, huh?).

The problem is us players. Population will always follow lag. Pack 2500 in a system, we'll try putting 3000 in. Get 3000 working smooth, we'll go up to 3500.


One of my beats was soft tech and I have 250+ games, so I have an inkling of what is going on, out there. But if you pay attention to the business world, the customer is always right -- even when they are wrong. They (the majority) don't care about military-grade supercomputers, they care if their dam things work. That is business, that is life.

ETA: That EVE is thriving despite problems is testament to the talent, concern and passion CCP has for their product as well as the patience, enthusiasm and the like of its loyal subscribers.

BUT, if EVE had competition, and it really doesn't (yet), I can nearly guarantee TiDi would be less of a problem; as EVE would be held to the same standards of most MMOs where people leave if they don't like it or it performs poorly, sometimes en masse.

That SWTOR is still breathing just goes to show money means little (relatively speaking), but what really matters is if the pros outweigh the cons to an individual in a particular product or service. Such is why we put up with "Made in China," sadly.

Another example is Kingdoms of Amalur -- a beautiful product by an obsolete, bankrupt company who misspent their resources.
Smoking Blunts
ZC Omega
#80 - 2013-06-24 19:04:07 UTC
Ruskarn Andedare wrote:
Smoking Blunts wrote:

tbh I think the newly introduced lag into TiDi is caused by all the extra fluffy crap they added that cant be turned off. 2000 people jumping into a system scanning for anoms. like wtf were they thinking?


Surely most of that is client side, the server just has to feed the anom info with the rest of the system data


yeh probably, but before all the pointless fluffy stuff was dumped on us TiDi wasn't this extreme, id just love them to remove what ever has made the game worse to play

pre patch 10% TiDi was not this bad. most people ive spoken agree on this, and this is what needs to be addressed imho

OMG when can i get a pic here