These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Assembly Hall

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Planetary Ring Mining

First post
Author
Naomi Hale
#1 - 2013-05-19 13:47:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Naomi Hale
Disclaimer – 1) This idea and accompanying images was put together quickly and there is plenty of room for refinement and additions. 2) The models are quick Sketch-up drafts and have no textures 3) The base close-up image of the planetary rings is not mine and was found by a google search, I only added the ship, drones and overlay. 4) I'm posting this idea in both the 'Features & Ideas' section as well as the 'Assembly Hall' for more coverage and traffic, please post additions and refinements in the 'Features' post and support (if any) in the Assembly Hall. Thank you.

Planetary Ring Mining


By Now I'm sure CCP have their own plans for this feature and several players have probably posted their own proposals, but this is my take on it and an idea I feel has merit.

The idea and inspiration for this post comes from Fishing Trawlers and the feel of setting a course and following it along the rings as others also trawl alongside you, casting out your net and hoping for the big score, sometimes you get it sometimes you don't. Ring mining should be like this and different from other mining in EVE, this post hopefully reflects that.

As to resources, ideally the materials recovered from ring mining would go towards Stargate construction, as plans shown at fanfest (2013) pointed out this goal for the next few years. However the resources could be used for any production or research CCP wishes to introduce (i.e. implants, Dust equipment, Tech 3 modules and so on). To me though, Stargate’s make the most sense, as these would not be new resources to New Eden (since high sec Empire planets have rings) but would be more along the lines of Concord granting permission to Capsuleers to finally mine them. The Empires have been able to build gates for a long time and that implies the resources do or did exist in their home systems.
That said, lets talk ring mining...

Stage One – Surveying the Rings

Planetary Ring Survey

Second Concept

So once you've found a suitable planetary body with rings, you'll need to survey it to find the best mining spot. Right clicking the planet and selecting 'Survey' will bring up the 'Mining Operation' screen (see above image) where you can plan and locate where the most efficient spot for you is.

You begin with an initial scan that displays if there are any other miners currently harvesting the rings and what ores are present.

Other Miners - If these miners are ahead of your chosen course through the rings then this could impact your mining yield as they may have already harvested the richest deposits of your chosen ore (however, there is no way to tell what they are mining short of asking them, and they could still lie). These players are shown by the red dots on the planetary rings and also includes the wake of their ships as they move along their orbit around the planet. A toggle is also available to show player names so you know who to contact, negotiate with or threaten if you chose.

Present Ores – Icons of all the available/discovered ores are also shown and highlighting one will display it's abundance within the rings and where those pockets are located. Similar to 'Planetary Interaction' these scan results can be refined and narrowed down with skills and adjustable filters. Mineral deposit positions vary from planet to planet as dictated by the planet's mass, radius, gravitational pull, the mass of the ores and their velocity in orbit.

Once you've select an ore to mine you then chose a distance from the planet that will be your orbital route or path that your ship will move along until you choose to stop mining. Confirming this selection leads to the beginning of your operation.

Stage Two – Planetary Ring Mining Barge

Mining Barge

Now this is where ring mining differs from other mining. Your ship, a new type of barge (possibly called a trawler or harvester), travels along it's orbital path just above the surface of the rings. A powerful and dedicated sensor system, located at the front of the ship, scans all material that passes below it and tags any that contain the desired ore.

Users can adjust and customise the threshold at which rocks are tagged. This is because unlike asteroids, ring rocks are taken whole and processed at a refinery, so it is possible to collect a large rock that contains only small amounts of the desired ore. Conversely it is possible to find small rocks containing an abundance of material. Managing and being selective about what you chose to recover is important as your ore hold is limited.

Stage Three – Tag it and bring it home.

Tagged Rocks

Successfully scanned and tagged rocks are highlighted in space. To avoid confusion and frustration only highlighted and tagged rocks can be recovered, so it doesn't matter if several other rocks are between you and the target as, while they are still visible, the non-highlighted cannot be clicked or selected. The overlay is also visible through non-tagged rocks so that they won't be impossible to see if other rocks move in front of the target (a sort of x-ray vision, holographic overlay). Tagged rocks can however move beyond your drone control range so skills and modules to extend this are strongly recommended. If you chose to recover a rock then select it and order a drone (or drones) to recover it.

I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.

Naomi Hale
#2 - 2013-05-19 13:48:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Naomi Hale
Stage Four - Drones

Ring Mining Drones

The Planetary Ring Miner (harvester) has no direct means by which to recover resources, as the nature of rings is a constantly in motion sea of tumbling and overlapping rocks, moving a ship of any significant size into the rings would lead to dozens of impacts to the hull and delicate sensor array, so the Barge is dependent upon drones for mining and resource recovery. 'Planetary Ring Mining Drones' travel to selected targets and, using four powerful spikes, spear the desired rock. They then manoeuvre the rock back to the Barge. However, the size of a rock and it's mass affect the drone's speed and manoeuvrability (with some larger rock requiring more than one drone). A skilled pilot can improve the effectiveness of their drones with increased speed, thrust and certain drone skills.

The Ring Mining Barge also features an ability rarely seen in ships of it's size, that is to field more than the maximum five drones seen on other vessels. Making it a task orientated small scale carrier. The upper limit of this would be ten ring mining drones in total, one for each level of the ship's skill.

Notes -

To defense and offence I imagine the barge to have a good defense in the form of a solid tank (either shield or hull) but a very limited offence, something like five light drones. This would be because rings don't/shouldn't spawn regular rats but something more like rogue mining drones and stray rocks that threaten the barge. Miners can also be attacked by rival capsuleers. Bringing combat ships with you for mining ops in low/null/w space will be a must and you'll need enough to protect all your barges/trawlers at differing locations along the rings or patrol between them. A well managed corp/fleet could be seen using ten or more trawlers moving slowly around a planet with a small cruiser escort each and patrols of fast moving tackler and ECM frigates flying between them.

Groups of Trawlers could also share and exchange survey data so that a corp/fleet member can alert you to an approaching hotspot or warn you of a limited yeild path.

Once the Barge's Ore hold is full or comes under attack the operation is cancelled or ended and the ship must unload it's cargo to a station or POS to be refined or for partially filled holds, begin a new run at the rings..

So, that's the bare bones of my idea... be kind.

Link to F&I Post

Ideas that link into or complement ring mining (which should really be called ring harvesting I'm told)

Prospecting by Gilligan Zaftig

Lay Claim to Asteroid Belts With Mining Charters by Andrea Griffin

New Mining Mechanics: Multi Ore, Multi Methods by Abrazzar

I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.

Benar Ellecon
Card games on MOTORCYCLES
#3 - 2013-05-20 16:56:31 UTC
+1
Nice idea and a good start on it as well.

Fly with your hair on FIRE!

John Grimm
East India Ore Trade
#4 - 2013-05-21 09:17:23 UTC
+1 This is epic and can totally replace current mining mechanics.

Steel and Iron guard me well, or else i'm dead and doomed to Hell

Naomi Hale
#5 - 2013-05-22 11:37:18 UTC
Three days and so few responses? Is this a tl;dr problem or do poeple really hate the idea?

I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.

JahMun
Doomheim
#6 - 2013-05-22 13:17:54 UTC
Your idea is well thought out and those are nice pictures explaining it.

It gives more depth to mining, but I'm not very convinced it actually makes it any fun. It's still going to be alot of obvious clicking and waiting, just like the current system.

Making mining fun is the biggest challenge for CCP, imo a good mining concept has some sort of minigame, promotes teamplay and has some depth with different mining strategies and toolsets.
Naomi Hale
#7 - 2013-05-22 13:59:16 UTC
JahMun wrote:
Your idea is well thought out and those are nice pictures explaining it.

It gives more depth to mining, but I'm not very convinced it actually makes it any fun. It's still going to be alot of obvious clicking and waiting, just like the current system.

Making mining fun is the biggest challenge for CCP, imo a good mining concept has some sort of minigame, promotes teamplay and has some depth with different mining strategies and toolsets.


Tagged Rocks would be their own mining mini game. Depending on your skills, filters and chosen ore you could be seeing dozens or hundreds of results and highlighted rocks onscreen at once, particularly in rings found in null/w space where resources are higher in concentration. Balancing which rocks to collect and which to let float away would keep a miner's attention on the screen and focused on their mining.

I've heard people throw around the idea of using the new jettison can mechanic for hacking sites as a new mining feature but that doesn't fit the trawler feel I was looking at. It would fit more of a large asteriod or comet mining feature, where you blast off chunks and collect them.

But if you have other ideas of how to make mining 'fun' I'd love to hear them Big smile.

I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.

Naomi Hale
#8 - 2013-06-04 22:31:37 UTC
Two weeks of no activity and it only reached the second page, this section either has a low turn out or the first page threads are hot topics Big smile

I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.

Mike Azariah
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2013-06-05 16:41:40 UTC
what resources do you propose for the rings?

will they be like ice belts and mined out in a given period?

m

Mike Azariah  ┬──┬ ¯|(ツ)

Naomi Hale
#10 - 2013-06-05 20:28:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Naomi Hale
Mike Azariah wrote:
what resources do you propose for the rings?

will they be like ice belts and mined out in a given period?

m

As Sentinel zx pointed out to me (here), CCP Fozzie said yesterday that ring mining isn't something being worked on anytime soon (if ever).

That said. I'd imagine completely new resources for the rings that tie into a new industry (ideally stargate construction), I'm sure existing minerals and ore are there but the ring harvester is looking for only certain types of resources, something that exists in planetary rings only, plus asteroids provide richer yields of those already available ores.

Scientifically speaking they should contain moon minerals spread across the ring as a fine dust or micro asteroids. But I wouldn't want ring mining to tread on any ones toes so a new resource works better.

Ideally it would be something like the Actinides and other radioactive elements and you'd harvest the decay products (eg. Thorium is collected to create Radon gas which is then used in some way to aid the long-range jumping effects of stargates, perhaps as a radioactive tracer between the two gates that maintains the connection).

There wouldn't be a limitless supply of the resources in rings, but I would see them more like belts, a fixed amount that is respawned after downtime (do belts still work that way?). It certainly wouldn't be like the old ice mining, more like the newer version, yes, but it would take a well run mining operation to deplete a ring within a day.

I also imagine that mining the rings in high sec would require something like the 'Starbase Charters' so that you need permission from the Empires to do it, low and null sec (and wormholes) would be free to mine and have greater quantities of resources.

I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.

Benteen
Atra Mortis Industries
#11 - 2013-06-09 09:46:33 UTC
Sounds pretty reasonable, one question though. What would happen to the existing mining barges? Would they be rendered obsolete?
Naomi Hale
#12 - 2013-06-09 11:45:00 UTC
Benteen wrote:
Sounds pretty reasonable, one question though. What would happen to the existing mining barges? Would they be rendered obsolete?

No, definitely not.

The two types of mining would be completely separate from each other except for some shared skills, ships from one simply can't perform the tasks of the other, for instance the Ring harvester would have no turret points and cannot fit strip miners, it is dependent on it's unique mining drones for harvesting. The idea is to add a new type of mining, not to replace an existing one.

I'm Naomi Hale and this is my favourite thread on the forums.

Benteen
Atra Mortis Industries
#13 - 2013-06-09 22:13:20 UTC
Could be interesting way to do things for those of us fancying a little interaction while mining that isn't just changing target...
Bo Kantrel
GETCO
#14 - 2013-06-16 14:49:23 UTC
Great Idea.

I would add some type of shielding native to the ship, say Radiation.
Similar to the missions that give environmental damage.
Fly a Rifter into one of these rings and it could go pop pretty quick.

Instead of the Charters, I think that a faction or Concord standing would be required.

Not sure of the 10 drones. I can see the 5, of course.
Alternately, you could create an asteroid tractor beam.
Have a drone tag the rock and tractor it in.
That would be competitive just like Salvaging.
ROCK MELTER
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2013-06-16 20:52:23 UTC
Interesting idea but I think it should be handled a different way. The current mining mechanic is being messed with in Ice mining now which means that the ore side of it will be also tweaked soon enough. CCP can never leave things alone. Always have to NERF things for the sake of new ideas seems to always be the CCP idea of the day.

Perhaps using your idea with a POS mechanic would be a better reason to do it. Not to have it as an individual level item but something that should be at the corp level and does not have to be done at the alliance level. Something that requires teamwork.