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Bad new player experience
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Amarra Mandalin
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#21 - 2013-06-15 20:49:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Amarra Mandalin
Jason Novork wrote:
Once you get past the forumites, who seems to add absolutely nothing to every thread there is, its a fair question.
Most games have something in place to prevent abuse of certain game mechanics, but I agree with this one, why add a 24 hour period before the event? rather than doing what almost every other game does, and add it after an event?

It create issues with accessibility which for any game should be fluid.


No. I normally go out of my way to help new people (attitude is everything). -- I have longwinded posts on several accounts explaining mundane things as they aren't mundane to new players. I still remember what it is like.

But will I help someone who claims to be "a long term player" and doesn't have the patience or creativity to find something for her/his friends to do for 24 hours and blames the game. -- sounds more like a troll.

I would expect more from a "long term player" and if nothing else, don't play EVE for that 24 hours.
Capt Tenguru10
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#22 - 2013-06-15 21:26:10 UTC
Contract all your assets to me.

http://i.imgur.com/EYX5Zi7.gif
Xavier Liche
ACME Mineral and Gas
#23 - 2013-06-15 21:47:39 UTC
It sounds to me like you joined your corp, I didn't know individuals in an NPC corp had to wait?
Kali Maat
PVP FAST
#24 - 2013-06-15 22:01:01 UTC
Worstluck wrote:
It doesn't need to be improved. It's that way for a reason.

You could have, you know, looked into it first, asked anyone about it, or even gone to the wiki and read something. Here you go, was tough to find:

http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/How_To_Join_Factional_Warfare

We did and KNEW about this before hand.
the point is from the moment oyu make the desision
ok let go
there is this 24h delay.
even as a single player.
Erotica 1 wrote:
I'm waiting for a couple of new threads where the new guys quit Eve over this.

I am not gonna quit eve over this
I want to have an open discussion about what you guys think of this 24h time delai
for factional warfare single player and small corp in mind
Jason Novork wrote:
Once you get past the forumites, who seems to add absolutely nothing to every thread there is, its a fair question.
Most games have something in place to prevent abuse of certain game mechanics, but I agree with this one, why add a 24 hour period before the event? rather than doing what almost every other game does, and add it after an event?

It create issues with accessibility which for any game should be fluid.
exactly
Paul Leonard Kersey wrote:
Learn to research

we did research and we want to do it: ok let's go
nope 24h
I dont need 24h of research to understand what I am getting into
took me about 20/30 min of research.
the point is research or not
from the moment you make this decision of joining the militia you have to wait 24h before it become effective.
Jason Novork
Novafox Union
#25 - 2013-06-15 22:04:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Jason Novork
NightCrawler 85 wrote:
Jason Novork wrote:
Once you get past the forumites, who seems to add absolutely nothing to every thread there is, its a fair question.
Most games have something in place to prevent abuse of certain game mechanics, but I agree with this one, why add a 24 hour period before the event? rather than doing what almost every other game does, and add it after an event?

It create issues with accessibility which for any game should be fluid.


This is a pure guess, and based more on alliances then FW.

As it stands now you can war dec a corp and have members join instantly after the war dec is officially started, thus catching your opponents off guard. Lets be honest, a one man corp war deccing you will make a lot of people laugh and not do any preparation, but a 50 man corp will cause the war decced corp to do their best to prepare and be as ready as they can be.

With alliances it could work the same way but on a much larger scale. Instead of the alliance growing with a few members, it grows with a few corps and suddenly they are a much larger threat, and finding all the new members fast can be challenging (not to mention who is actually active) and there is a higher chance for ships to be lost due to people not paying attention, or knowing who to look for (yes most would notice the red star in local and such, but some wont).

But on the other hand, it does not make much difference if they join just as the war starts, or 24 hours after the war started. The war decced corp will not get any notifications (as far as i know) about a new corp joining the alliance so the 24 hour wait timer will not give the war decced corp a chance for more preparation.

But its also possible its simply just a part of the game mechanics for reasons that are related to the programming it self, but me being a complete idiot when it comes to computers would not be able to even begin to guess on reasons for this.


Interesting, if its for preparation time I can understand that as eve in almost its entirety is a preparation. I know I spend as much time preparing for something than I actually 'do' that something, but thats what I like about eve, its not instant gratification.
Maybe thats a good and bad thing however, I guess the question is, how do you add both without taking from each other? In this case with the OP they had a plan, and was looking forward to it but then as they mentioned, Eve put an instant stopper in that which really dumb downed the potential experience they could have had/will have.

As you said, does it really make a difference to put a 24 pre timer on this as each method will be exploited by some, just as everything is.
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#26 - 2013-06-15 22:07:37 UTC
The ability to join or leave instantly would be exploited, that's all that really needs to be said.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Kali Maat
PVP FAST
#27 - 2013-06-15 22:08:52 UTC
Xavier Liche wrote:
It sounds to me like you joined your corp, I didn't know individuals in an NPC corp had to wait?

a more flexible aproche to beeing in a corp with my 2 friends (maybe more eventually is to have shared assets between us.
and we want to join as a group.
Amarra Mandalin
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#28 - 2013-06-15 22:12:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Amarra Mandalin
Kali Maat wrote:

I am not gonna quit eve over this
I want to have an open discussion about what you guys think of this 24h time delai
for factional warfare single player and small corp in mind


Ok, then I would have just asked how people feel about it in your OP. Your post came off more as a rant, pitting EVE against other games. Apples/Oranges

As for how I feel? I never really thought about it (the short wait) but as Ranger said, the lack of a stasis period would be exploited.
Kali Maat
PVP FAST
#29 - 2013-06-15 22:14:03 UTC
Ranger 1 wrote:
The ability to join or leave instantly would be exploited, that's all that really needs to be said.

as an older Eve player I understand the possible abuses.
but the verry first time?
a 24h delai to leave ok
a 48h total tecnicly possible minimum to go from on faction to the other ok

but the very first time you hit this 24h delay it is not really understandable.
Amyclas Amatin
SUNDERING
Goonswarm Federation
#30 - 2013-06-15 22:21:55 UTC
Faction warfare is single player?

Did anyone tell him about gatecamps and roaming gangs crashing into his sites? And he's whining about a timer?

For more information on the New Order of High-Sec, please visit: http://www.minerbumping.com/

Remember that whenever you have a bad day in EVE, the correct reponse is "Thank you CCP, may I please have another?"
Amarra Mandalin
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#31 - 2013-06-15 22:22:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Amarra Mandalin
Kali Maat wrote:
Ranger 1 wrote:
The ability to join or leave instantly would be exploited, that's all that really needs to be said.

as an older Eve player I understand the possible abuses.
but the verry first time?
a 24h delai to leave ok
a 48h total tecnicly possible minimum to go from on faction to the other ok

but the very first time you hit this 24h delay it is not really understandable.


You're in an NPC corp the first time. You can join any corp instantly.

"f the pilot is joining from a player corporation, then the pilot may not have any roles or grantable roles in order to be able to leave his or her former corporation instantly."

So what you're asking is for the ability to join a second corporation without a delay -- not the same thing as "first time."
Kali Maat
PVP FAST
#32 - 2013-06-15 22:28:47 UTC
Amarra Mandalin wrote:
Kali Maat wrote:

but the very first time you hit this 24h delay it is not really understandable.

So what your asking is for the ability to join a second corporation without a delay -- not the same thing as "first time."

it is the very first time for the militia for all the 3 of us.
Amyclas Amatin wrote:
Faction warfare is single player?

Did anyone tell him about gatecamps and roaming gangs crashing into his sites? And he's whining about a timer?

we know what we are getting into.
i mean real action
reward vs risk
Amarra Mandalin
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#33 - 2013-06-15 22:36:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Amarra Mandalin
Kali Maat wrote:
Amarra Mandalin wrote:
Kali Maat wrote:

but the very first time you hit this 24h delay it is not really understandable.

So what your asking is for the ability to join a second corporation without a delay -- not the same thing as "first time."

it is the very first time for the militia for all the 3 of us.
Amyclas Amatin wrote:
Faction warfare is single player?

Did anyone tell him about gatecamps and roaming gangs crashing into his sites? And he's whining about a timer?

we know what we are getting into.
i mean real action
reward vs risk


I'm not sure what is difficult to understand. You are joining a corporation in the militia.

Since you and your friends joined (your?) corp AND wanted to (did) join the militia, that is a corp jump.

You said you understand how that can be abused, so I'm not sure what you're asking.
Noriko Mai
#34 - 2013-06-15 22:38:47 UTC
Sentamon wrote:
Why did you bold today and twice? It's freaking me out.

"Meh.." - Albert Einstein
BoSau Hotim
Uitraan Diversified Holdings Incorporated
#35 - 2013-06-15 22:43:47 UTC
Ranger 1 wrote:
The ability to join or leave instantly would be exploited, that's all that really needs to be said.


^this one

Seems quite a logical reason IMO.

I wouldn't bother answering the trolls if I were you, it only gives them more ammo for their flamethrowers Cool

I think that it would be wise to realize that this game isn't going to provide a perfect scenario for every player according to his or her beliefs on how this game should be running. No doubt that you and your friends will run into many other situations that you won't like. But I wouldn't call this a bad experience, maybe an inconvenience, but not bad. Having your wealthy corp infiltrated that you took 3 years to build and all it's assets and isk stolen, now that may fall under bad...but still totally legit Blink

I'm not a carebear... I'm a SPACE BARBIE!  Now... where's Ken?
Amarra Mandalin
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#36 - 2013-06-15 22:48:50 UTC
BoSau Hotim wrote:
Ranger 1 wrote:
The ability to join or leave instantly would be exploited, that's all that really needs to be said.


^this one

Seems quite a logical reason IMO.

I wouldn't bother answering the trolls if I were you, it only gives them more ammo for their flamethrowers Cool

I think that it would be wise to realize that this game isn't going to provide a perfect scenario for every player according to his or her beliefs on how this game should be running. No doubt that you and your friends will run into many other situations that you won't like. But I wouldn't call this a bad experience, maybe an inconvenience, but not bad. Having your wealthy corp infiltrated that you took 3 years to build and all it's assets and isk stolen, now that may fall under bad...but still totally legit Blink



I'm about to revert back to my troll assumption. I'm giving the player the benefit of the doubt, figuring the lack of capitalization and patience for a 24-hour wait might mean this player is quite young.

But yeah, I'm done 'splaining, Lucy.
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#37 - 2013-06-15 22:57:44 UTC  |  Edited by: DeMichael Crimson
BoSau Hotim wrote:
Ranger 1 wrote:
The ability to join or leave instantly would be exploited, that's all that really needs to be said.


^this one

Seems quite a logical reason IMO.

I wouldn't bother answering the trolls if I were you, it only gives them more ammo for their flamethrowers Cool

I think that it would be wise to realize that this game isn't going to provide a perfect scenario for every player according to his or her beliefs on how this game should be running. No doubt that you and your friends will run into many other situations that you won't like. But I wouldn't call this a bad experience, maybe an inconvenience, but not bad. Having your wealthy corp infiltrated that you took 3 years to build and all it's assets and isk stolen, now that may fall under bad...but still totally legit Blink


I agree.

It seems CCP definitely has a thing for 24 hr timers placed on a lot of things other than just joining Militia or doing WarDec's.

Jump Clones and Expeditions are also on a 24 hr timer. I'm sure there's other aspects of this game that's also on the same timer as well.


DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Amarra Mandalin
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#38 - 2013-06-15 23:03:05 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#39 - 2013-06-15 23:05:16 UTC
Most of the seemingly annoying things in the game, make sense when you look a little deeper.

If you could instantly swap FW back and forth, it would be thoroughly abused by the plex farming botters.

It's not intended to discourage the new players, either.

It's to give you a chance to move your assets into FW space before the timer is up. Because when the timer is up, you are basically flagged to everyone of the opposite faction, highsec or not, they can attack you at will.

And you can't do faction warfare with just one ship.

So the timer is supposed to give you the time to move your assets and ships into a decent staging area for FW.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Kali Maat
PVP FAST
#40 - 2013-06-15 23:16:27 UTC
it's hard to talk with people that don't even read. (pls do no be offended if you did in fact read)
and yes I will bold it again
I understand the possible abuse if people would be able to swap militia instantly.
so 24h time to leave the militia 24h to join the other one (i guess)
but what about joining the militia for the first time?
couldn't there be a corp vote instead of the timer?
(because I understand some corp member could be surprised / exploited being pushed instantly into the changed rule of engagement militia represent.)
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