EVE General Discussion

Yup, there is a margin trading scam. Now you know how to spot one, as will the people who bother to read the forums.

Edit: and those players with enough common sense to realise that if an offer looks too good to be true, there must be a catch.

Curious anecdote in no way related to the OP:

In my part of the world, largely due to lack of governmental oversight a variety of loan - providing "businesses" offer loans with interest rates almost 4-5 times that of a legal financial institution. They provide loans to startups and small businesses in need of liquid cash, the type that larger banks and finance companies would not consider financing. Now, whenever someone defaults on a contract signed with such below - the - table companies, the companies in question typically resort to hiring thugs to intimidate the defaulter into making good on his promise. At which point said defaulter has learned to run to a local politico, who in turn relates the entire sob story to the local media always keen to take the side of the poor, bullied small man.

I'm acquainted with a few characters behind such operations, and a few of their clients. The clients who made good on their promise have generally held the opinion that even though the interest rates are excessive comparitively, the loans have proven life - saving at times - and that the people providing them are rough but will leave you alone as long as you uphold your end of the agreement. Interestingly, even if they had trouble coughing up the cash for a particular week/month, usually it is probable to negotiate some sort of settlement - Longer period with a reduced interest rate, for instance. Much like any other legitimate financial institution. The loan providers don't view themselves as bad people (who does?) but have also related that many of the defaulters had no serious intention of making good on their promise right from the start. Such providers are doing business, in their own words, and would rather take a significantly reduced profit from giving concessions to the defaulter rather than having to go to the trouble and cost of calling in bully boys on top of losing the entire loan itself.

So basically - Where shady business practices meet unbridled greed, you get lots of finger pointing, no small amount of tears, and little to no assumption of personal responsibility. Usually, from the first one to claim the moral high ground.

Out of curiousity, what is a good policy in this instance? (I ask you because, if anyone knows the dirty side of this game, it's your esteemed self)

I simply tend to go into paranoia mode, and assume that anyone posting in local is a scammer.

My first days of EVE... made some good iskies, saw that stupid I'm giving away all my stuff for 1 tritanium and I was about to fall for it if not for the colors on what to take and what to give on that contract

Now, I got natural resistance against any type of scam, not only that tritaium one (though sometimes I lose good deals because I was like 'this is a scam don't go for it' and it turns out to be an awesome deal of ore or ships bpcs...)

Everyone has his first time

[quote=Aribeth Fireeye] Oh well, isk lost is a lesson learned. Hopefully I can find a corp that will finance my losses.[/quote

Do you also have an amazon wishlist perchance?

Frankly, this and other threads won't stop this from happening again and again and again. I wish they would address it since it relies on inconsistencies in the mechanics but it's no sweat off my back if they don't.

While I've not fallen for this, the fact is new players are repeatedly told that there is isk to be made with ttrading, arbitrage and hauling. Most players who have even a slight interest in trading will at least consider someone's margin trading bait.

Some will research well enough to realize that there is a skill that allows you to screw other players by posting a buy you never ever intended on filling.

But it's allowed. At this point, have to assume it is encouraged. So players who have fallen for this or were about to: consider the fact that this mechanic is still in game after this amount of time as a green light to use this to screw new subscribers to get back your isk.

He was calling you Mintchip she has a wish list on amazon its full of pink dildos.

If you truly believe that there is no purpose to the margin trading skill but to scam, then you truly ignorant of a whole portionof Eve economics. I have a trade character that will often have a a couple hundred outstanding buy orders at any one time. They are legit orders which are always covered . I make ISK and sellers are able to sell their goods at what they consider a goo price. As CCP would say... Working as intended.

I agree that it would be great to be able to tell the difference between buy orders that are fully funded and ready to complete right now, and those that are not. I've had perfectly boring transactions at very standard market prices run into the "wait! let us set up a sell order for you because that guy ran out of money!" from the ever-helpful brokers, and it's just effing annoying.

I'd rather see the margin trading risk switched over to the buyer, also... but making underfunded orders visible would be a step in the right direction for market clarity.

Agreed, except for the thing about contracts. Contracts actually are very open and transparent; unlike the market with its margin trading buy orders contracts do exactly what they say.

The main problem with this solution is not that it is unfair, but that it is an exploitable ISK faucet. This creates far more problems than it solves because you can't ensure that a character with negative wallet balance ever pays back his debt to the economy.

That would work, though I think just removing those unbacked orders is the simpler solution.