These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

t3 locked out of 4/10 site

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Litair
Nleesh
#21 - 2013-06-05 23:36:14 UTC
I think it's pretty awkward to lock out any ships from any sites in the first place anyways.. If you can afford a fancy high end ship and want to waste your time grinding easy sites, then fine with me. If you want to really use that ship to the fullest, have a challenge and probably make a lot more profit, you can do that as well with a greater risk of blowing it up.
That's kinda the EVE way, isn't it?
Nexus Day
Lustrevik Trade and Travel Bureau
#22 - 2013-06-05 23:37:18 UTC
Ace Uoweme wrote:
GreenSeed wrote:
because highsec is for new players, if you are a grown up go explore low or NPC null.

there's a ton of space on NPC null that sees less than 4 - 5 jumps/h, go there.


Loki is a combat class ship meant for PvP (Marauders are the PvE ships, designed for mission running lvl 4+s)...so off to low/null for ISK farming. They're forcing miners out there, the rest of the lazy scared profiteers in big expensive ships need to follow.

A Moa is fine for 3/10, a Drake for 4/10. Perfect ships for skilling players that need the tank for those sites. Anything else is being a chicken to possible PvP. Got the T3 ship, put it in it's environment, which isn't newbie sites.

Adding to the flawed logic.

A cruiser flown by someone with all skills at 5 is > someone who only has skills to fly a T3. Flying a T3 in of itself does not make it overkill, it just has more potential based on the pilot's skill.

And stating a T3 is a PvP ship....T3's are not a PvP'ers ship of choice. Fly what you can lose. With T3's that statement includes SP.
Nexus Day
Lustrevik Trade and Travel Bureau
#23 - 2013-06-05 23:43:30 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Nexus Day wrote:
Uh no. Different skills between a HAC and T3.
None that matter or can't be picked up in minutes.

So just go get a HAC and get on with it, or a pirate cruiser if you're particularly lazy.

Quote:
Let's follow your logic though
Ok. What other content is there that are designed around mechanical restrictions on what you can bring in order to maintain a minute shred of risk to your paintjob?

Really? Newbs read these forums so let's try and keep the content accurate. It is many days between a HAC and a T3. Throw in whatever implants you want.

Read my following post. Restricting ships is too broad as it discounts the wide disparity in pilot skills. When i first skilled into a T3 I could do like 200 dps in it and had no T2 modules. I now can do 600 dps in a catalyst so maybe catalyt's shouldn't be allowed in 4/10's. (yeah I am ignoring defense, but you are ignoring pilot skill so we are even)

But for your example, mining. There are mechanical restrictions to accessing content without gate restrictions.

Got anything else or are you going to call me a doo doo head and be done with it?
General Guardian
Perkone
Caldari State
#24 - 2013-06-05 23:45:06 UTC
People will find the most ridiculous things to complain about after patch day. And molest the English language while doing so.

What will people do now? Use Navy Battlecruisers? What a silly idea
Amarra Mandalin
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2013-06-05 23:46:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Amarra Mandalin
Just point me to the gate that people use, who are wise enough to take a battlecruiser or HAC solo into low-sec. Roll
DRGaius Baltar
Perkone
Caldari State
#26 - 2013-06-05 23:50:22 UTC
nat longshot wrote:
Ok over a year ago i got my Loki for ded 4/10 site and now there locked out of them WTF.

T3 are ship to explore and you lock them out of 4/10's i understand 3/10 site but 4/10's.

If t2 command ships can enter 4/10 sites why cant t3's hell any battlecruiser can enter them.

So what the point of having a ship that made to explore when you lock out 4/10s and stick them to only 5/10 and up?

WTF CCP.




Learn 2 EVE
Allison A'vani
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#27 - 2013-06-05 23:53:41 UTC
Nexus Day wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Nexus Day wrote:
Uh no. Different skills between a HAC and T3.
None that matter or can't be picked up in minutes.

So just go get a HAC and get on with it, or a pirate cruiser if you're particularly lazy.

Quote:
Let's follow your logic though
Ok. What other content is there that are designed around mechanical restrictions on what you can bring in order to maintain a minute shred of risk to your paintjob?

Really? Newbs read these forums so let's try and keep the content accurate. It is many days between a HAC and a T3. Throw in whatever implants you want.




MFW complaining about days of skill training, I remember when I had things that only took days instead of weeks to train...
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#28 - 2013-06-05 23:58:03 UTC
I've been watching T3s blitz 4/10s since 2010.

Every time CCP would go on an unholy rage on botters, in would come the 0.0 renters, their botters banned and thus unable to pay the rent, and they would be blitzing 4/10s like they were nothing.


I brought this up in the exploration channel and oh the insults and denials flowed like.... tears.


People have been doing this for a long time and lying about it. It's like "ooooh my easy mode". And now someone says there was no call for a change. Right. It's like Rock Hudson's sex life: everybody knew about it until he got sick then everybody was talking about it.

People have blitzed 4/10s with T3s for YEARS making a haul of it. CCP fixed that.

Life will go on. if there be tears to grease the skids, then so be it. Most of the people who will not like this are the ones who knew they had an easy mode and they deserve it.

Honestly, I waited a very long time for this day because I know a lot of names who are probably crying right about now.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#29 - 2013-06-05 23:59:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Nexus Day wrote:
It is many days between a HAC and a T3.
One requires Cruiser V and HAC I, which in turn requires three standard must-have support skills to V. The other requires StratCruiser I, which in turn requires Cruiser V and five standard must-have support skills to V.

If you can fly the latter, flying the former is just a matter of injecting the HAC skill, unless your skill set is so horrid that you shouldn't be in a T3 to begin with. It's a matter of minutes to get the ship.

Quote:
Restricting ships is too broad as it discounts the wide disparity in pilot skills.
No, that's why the restrictions are there: so that no matter how high your skills, there is a limit to what you can bring. T3s have correclty been deemed “too much” for something as trivial as a 4/10. Once they get nerfed and HACs buffed so that the two have the correct offensive capabilities in relation to each other, then maybe it should be swapped. Until then, T3s being locked out is as it should be.

Quote:
But for your example, mining. There are mechanical restrictions to accessing content without gate restrictions.
…such as?
Snapper Pumpkinpuss
Sarano Planetary Goods Distribution
DammFam
#30 - 2013-06-06 00:06:16 UTC
asshats i spent alot of time training my t3 so i could compete in 3 and 4 of 10s...i demand comensation isk and skill points you efectively ruined my carreier path
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#31 - 2013-06-06 00:08:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Snapper Pumpkinpuss wrote:
asshats i spent alot of time training my t3 so i could compete in 3 and 4 of 10s...i demand comensation isk and skill points you efectively ruined my carreier path

…except that you still can use pretty much all of it to stay competitive in 3/10s and 4/10s, and that the further rungs on your career ladder still needs the stuff you want reimbursed. So the only way to effectively ruin your career path would be to have it all reimbursed.
Amarra Mandalin
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2013-06-06 00:10:22 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
I've been watching T3s blitz 4/10s since 2010.

Every time CCP would go on an unholy rage on botters, in would come the 0.0 renters, their botters banned and thus unable to pay the rent, and they would be blitzing 4/10s like they were nothing.


I brought this up in the exploration channel and oh the insults and denials flowed like.... tears.


People have been doing this for a long time and lying about it. It's like "ooooh my easy mode". And now someone says there was no call for a change. Right. It's like Rock Hudson's sex life: everybody knew about it until he got sick then everybody was talking about it.

People have blitzed 4/10s with T3s for YEARS making a haul of it. CCP fixed that.

Life will go on. if there be tears to grease the skids, then so be it. Most of the people who will not like this are the ones who knew they had an easy mode and they deserve it.

Honestly, I waited a very long time for this day because I know a lot of names who are probably crying right about now.



I can appreciate this but there are many players who either do not make EvE a full-time job, and/or are primarily PvPers. I suppose they must adapt too even though they are contributing to EVE in every other way -- from adding content to blowing up ships. These same people don't breeze though PvE. Is it fair to them? Probably not.




Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#33 - 2013-06-06 00:11:36 UTC
Nexus Day wrote:
Adding to the flawed logic.

A cruiser flown by someone with all skills at 5 is > someone who only has skills to fly a T3. Flying a T3 in of itself does not make it overkill, it just has more potential based on the pilot's skill.

And stating a T3 is a PvP ship....T3's are not a PvP'ers ship of choice. Fly what you can lose. With T3's that statement includes SP.


The flaw is this: use ships that clearly OP for a job, then when it's nerfed, come back whining/defending it's practice.

Exploits eventually get fixed. No point complaining about the fix after the fact. You knew it'll end one day...and it's now.

All this reminds me so much what's wrong with PvP in general and how chicken PvPers tend to be. My sis was in a newbie area today fishing, a level 90 Warlock was killing quest NPCs and level <20s. Sis remembers the level 20 gankers. Sis blew the Warlock up and proceeded to kill the Horde NPCs as compensation.

Sis hates PvP.

She hates it, but doesn't make excuses like whiny big talking bratty kids do when their habit gets nerfed.

Adapt and move along.

_"In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." _ ~George Orwell
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#34 - 2013-06-06 00:14:45 UTC
Amarra Mandalin wrote:
I can appreciate this but there are many players who either do not make EvE a full-time job, and/or are primarily PvPers. I suppose they must adapt too even though they are contributing to EVE in every other way -- from adding content to blowing up ships. These same people don't breeze though PvE.
If they are primarily PvPers, they're definitely breezing through it. Whether or not it's a “full-time job” isn't particularly a factor.
Amarra Mandalin
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#35 - 2013-06-06 00:24:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Amarra Mandalin
Tippia wrote:
Amarra Mandalin wrote:
I can appreciate this but there are many players who either do not make EvE a full-time job, and/or are primarily PvPers. I suppose they must adapt too even though they are contributing to EVE in every other way -- from adding content to blowing up ships. These same people don't breeze though PvE.
If they are primarily PvPers, they're definitely breezing through it. Whether or not it's a “full-time job” isn't particularly a factor.


I think that's an over-generalization. I must hang with a different crowd. I know a lot of PvPers who know zilch about PvE. Some learn it quite well but they generally spend a lot of time on it, isk isn't an issue, and most have an alt account with a scout., if not duel PvE ships.

To be fair, I imagine it may become easy after regular practice but I can't speak for everyone on that. I'll have to check out a 4/10 again...it's been awhile.
Silvetica Dian
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#36 - 2013-06-06 00:44:22 UTC
before i started learning to PVP my main was an exploration char. i still farm isk on that char and he can fly drakes, buzzards and since the patch a raven. ie a crappy caldari toon.
The flood of t3 cruisers in high sec exploration was a curse. especially Tengu's.
You started a site and half way through some Tengu rocks up, blows all the triggers loots and leaves.
Banning them was a smart move.
My drake now does over 500 dps and so i don't do many high sec sites. i solo c1 and c2 wh's. go with friends to C3's and low sec combat sites. Wh's and low sec sites are better isk anyway and the increased risk if u pay attention results in so few losses that the extra isk more than compensates for.
New players need the high sec sites as an entry to exploration.
T3 cruisers have so many advantages for moving unmolested through low and null. can solo almost all pve content. CCP is doing you a favour and increasing your isk by making you move away from 4/10.

Money at its root is a form of rationing. When the richest 85 people have as much wealth as the poorest 3.5 billion (50% of humanity) it is clear where the source of poverty is. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/20/trickle-down-economics-broken-promise-richest-85
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#37 - 2013-06-06 00:50:58 UTC
DRGaius Baltar wrote:
nat longshot wrote:
Ok over a year ago i got my Loki for ded 4/10 site and now there locked out of them WTF.

T3 are ship to explore and you lock them out of 4/10's i understand 3/10 site but 4/10's.

If t2 command ships can enter 4/10 sites why cant t3's hell any battlecruiser can enter them.

So what the point of having a ship that made to explore when you lock out 4/10s and stick them to only 5/10 and up?

WTF CCP.




Learn 2 EVE


Err Eve is a sandbox, setting up arbitrary limitations and reducing the players ability for varity when it comes to playing, is very un-sandboxie

CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden
Shimle Hehue
Doomheim
#38 - 2013-06-06 00:56:01 UTC
Brooks Puuntai wrote:
DRGaius Baltar wrote:
nat longshot wrote:
Ok over a year ago i got my Loki for ded 4/10 site and now there locked out of them WTF.

T3 are ship to explore and you lock them out of 4/10's i understand 3/10 site but 4/10's.

If t2 command ships can enter 4/10 sites why cant t3's hell any battlecruiser can enter them.

So what the point of having a ship that made to explore when you lock out 4/10s and stick them to only 5/10 and up?

WTF CCP.




Learn 2 EVE


Err Eve is a sandbox, setting up arbitrary limitations and reducing the players ability for varity when it comes to playing, is very un-sandboxie


Titans should be able to enter hisec.

~Sandbox
Seniae 0n3
#39 - 2013-06-06 01:00:39 UTC
Shimle Hehue wrote:
Brooks Puuntai wrote:
DRGaius Baltar wrote:
nat longshot wrote:
Ok over a year ago i got my Loki for ded 4/10 site and now there locked out of them WTF.

T3 are ship to explore and you lock them out of 4/10's i understand 3/10 site but 4/10's.

If t2 command ships can enter 4/10 sites why cant t3's hell any battlecruiser can enter them.

So what the point of having a ship that made to explore when you lock out 4/10s and stick them to only 5/10 and up?

WTF CCP.




Learn 2 EVE


Err Eve is a sandbox, setting up arbitrary limitations and reducing the players ability for varity when it comes to playing, is very un-sandboxie


Titans should be able to enter hisec.

~Sandbox


erm and do what? orbit the jita button and bash the broken monument?
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#40 - 2013-06-06 01:03:09 UTC
Shimle Hehue wrote:


Titans should be able to enter hisec.

~Sandbox


Cruisers, BCs, T2 Cruisers are all still allowed in these sites, T3 being a cruiser is banned. Not the same as a capital restrictions.




CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden