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Dual Training Is A Rip Off

First post First post
Author
Jake Tzestu
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#121 - 2013-05-31 12:52:20 UTC
i'm surprised that people even find it worth the time to complain about CCP doing this to make more money.

They need that cash to cover the cost of making things that either dont work or are unwanted.

Just imagine how much the captains quarters cost or the new launcher.... to make stuff this badly isnt easy and costs money ;0)

Just thinking out loud.
Freighdee Katt
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#122 - 2013-05-31 13:04:19 UTC
If your beef is that Dual Training should be Triple Training instead . . . sure, that would be "more." It also certainly would cost more.

I assume that someone at CCP ran the numbers and figured that Dual Training will be a net revenue win for them, since the volume of people using it who would not pay for a second account will outweigh the loss of transfer fees and full account subs from those who decide to use Dual Training instead of dual accounts for short term skilling projects.

The most likely reasons they did not make Triple Training right away are that: (1) they decided not to put it in, because it would be a net revenue loss for them, at whatever price they think they can charge for it; or (2) they want to put it in, either for the same price or for a higher price, but they want to reality check their revenue plan for it with Dual Training first.

If Dual Training turns out to be a big loss for them, they can't really take it away, but at least they would be stuck with a lower net loss than if they had unboxed Triple Training straight away. If Dual Training turns out to be a big win, then they'll probably extend it to Triple Training at some point.

EvE is supposed to suck.  Wait . . . what was the question?

Haulie Berry
#123 - 2013-05-31 13:07:35 UTC
Freeman11 wrote:
I see dual training as a particularly effective ISK sink - and nothing more. It is removing 520-580mil from the market while increasing the amount of players training skills.


*facepalm*

Excepting taxes/broker fees, it does not remove any ISK from the economy.
Darvaleth Sigma
Imperial Security Hegemony
#124 - 2013-05-31 13:08:45 UTC
Everyone, bounty this idiot into oblivion.

Give a man a match and you warm him for a day.

Set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life!

Haulie Berry
#125 - 2013-05-31 13:13:56 UTC
Ultim8Evil wrote:
All the cost of a 2nd account, without the flexibility.

Someone convince me otherwise What?


If you are not bright enough to figure out what this is useful for on your own, convincing you is probably a hopeless endeavor. I'll break out my crayons and give it a go, anyway.

Suppose I need a skilled alt for something. It needs some quantity of training, but doesn't need to be trained in perpetuity. I also don't ever need it logged in concurrently with my main. A market alt, maybe.

I could put it on a new account, yes.

This will cost me a plex per month until the end of time/I quit/I abandon the second account, or until I spend a couple more plex to move the character onto my primary account.

Alternatively, I could just dual train my account for however long it will take to get the alt the SPs required, and then go back to spending a single plex per month in perpetuity.

So, no, not all the cost of a second account because at some point, you stop paying for it.
Thorleifer
Yeti Cave
#126 - 2013-05-31 13:36:56 UTC
CCP Guard wrote:
Our dastardly plot has been unearthed, we stand unveiled! TO THE CORPORATE JET!!...oh wait, we can't afford it now that our machinations are foiled.

Grrrrr!!!


In seriousness though, this is just an option to what you can already do and it can even save you money in certain situations. So flexibility is all it is really Smile


wait so you can have 2 accounts and train 2 toons or have 1 account and buy plex to dual train on 1 account, which means you can't have both on at the same time. I am unclear how this could ever possibly save you money, unless plex prices drop which I somehow doubt they do anytime soon.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#127 - 2013-05-31 13:40:07 UTC
Thorleifer wrote:
CCP Guard wrote:
Our dastardly plot has been unearthed, we stand unveiled! TO THE CORPORATE JET!!...oh wait, we can't afford it now that our machinations are foiled.

Grrrrr!!!


In seriousness though, this is just an option to what you can already do and it can even save you money in certain situations. So flexibility is all it is really Smile


wait so you can have 2 accounts and train 2 toons or have 1 account and buy plex to dual train on 1 account, which means you can't have both on at the same time. I am unclear how this could ever possibly save you money, unless plex prices drop which I somehow doubt they do anytime soon.


I feel that you deserve some congratulations on managing to remain unclear, despite there being at least 3 short, clear explainations of what the use of this option is on every page of this thread, and likewise in every other thread on the same subject.

Such vigilantly defended ignorance in the face of repeated attempts to inform you surely deserves some kind of reward or recognition. Who's the CEO of your corp? I will gladly sponsor an appropriately titled medal in your honour.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

None ofthe Above
#128 - 2013-05-31 13:45:35 UTC
Ultim8Evil wrote:
All the cost of a 2nd account, without the flexibility.

Someone convince me otherwise What?


Look -- you can still do second(+) accounts, that's the right move for when you want two or more skilling characters that can log in at the same time.

If you want an alt though that just needs a minimal set of skills and doesn't need to be logged with your main to be effective, this is cheaper since they remain available even after you stop paying for the skills. Plex for second char training for a while, do a short skill plan, and you have a helper char that you never have to pay for again as long as the main on that account remains paid for.

Great for PI and Trade alts. Maybe even cynos (if you cyno for others as opposed to for you main). I am sure people will find many other uses for this as well.

If this isn't what you need, that's fine! Don't use it.

The only end-game content in EVE Online is the crap that makes you rage quit.

marVLs
#129 - 2013-05-31 13:51:54 UTC
What an awesome feature, now i can get lvl5 my PI chars (month of skilling per char) without wasting time on main. Thank You CCP Cool

But how is this feature choosing second char to be trained? It's the one on which i will log on and start skilling after activating dual training?
Kyt Thrace
Lightspeed Enterprises
Goonswarm Federation
#130 - 2013-05-31 13:57:20 UTC
Ultim8Evil wrote:
All the cost of a 2nd account, without the flexibility.

Someone convince me otherwise What?


If you have an account that has a character in a Super Cap on it you are training. This Super cap character is stuck in this ship & only logs on when the Bat phone rings.

You can now train the other two slots on this account for characters that can be used on a daily basis. I.e ratter, miner, PI, pvper, afk cloaky to camp red systems, trader, incursion runner, neut freighter, Faction Warfare, & many other alts.

I will be taking advantage of this new feature. It saves me from training an alt on an extra account, just to spend two Plexes to transfer it to another account.

R.I.P. Vile Rat

Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#131 - 2013-05-31 13:57:26 UTC
Ok, lemme get this straight. CCP charges for a feature you don't have to use? Right? And this is for a feature that has never existed, fee or free? Right? And CCP didn't take something away from you to charge you for it, right?

Right.

That's not greed sugarteets. It's creative thinking and what's known as "value added service".

Don't ban me, bro!

Zak Breen
Breen Enterprises
#132 - 2013-05-31 14:12:13 UTC
Well, they are a company after all, and most companies do stupid stuff in the name of profits. Like forcing us to buy another account if we want to train more than 1 character (rendering the other 2 characters on an account near useless).

And so it goes.

Maturity, one discovers, has everything to do with the acceptance of not knowing. http://www.di.fm/spacemusic

Onomerous
Caldari Black Hand
Caldari Tactical Operations Command
#133 - 2013-05-31 15:49:28 UTC
Ultim8Evil wrote:
All the cost of a 2nd account, without the flexibility.

Someone convince me otherwise What?


Train up 2 PI alts for me then transfer them to your main account. How much did that cost?

Now plex and train those 2 PI alts on your main account. How much did that cost you?
Aeana K
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#134 - 2013-05-31 16:14:32 UTC
SDS Recruitment wrote:


This is nothing more than a blatent market attempt to get more money

Shame on you

SHAME ON YOU


I dont think so, but let's say your argument stands. why is that a shame?

That's why they are working for, to make money. That's why all of us working for.

I want them to make A LOT of money. They deserve it, to keep this excellent game running.

I have writen down that the game is cheep (especially for such a quality). You can find the 15$ for the monthly subscription in coins dropped in the streets in a few evening walkings.

And please, dont say them greed. Many ppl work for that project. Servers cost a lot. Much money in additional services, like adverts etc.

Multiply now the population with the monthly subscription and you will see that they are not rich.

I wish they were. I hope they will be. All of them. They deserve it.
Xolve
State War Academy
Caldari State
#135 - 2013-05-31 17:15:09 UTC
I'm actually excited for this.

As it stand right now, it costs 2 PLEX to transfer a character to a different account, there are plenty of useful things you can train a dedicated alt to do in just about 60 days.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#136 - 2013-05-31 17:17:42 UTC
Aeana K wrote:


This is nothing more than a blatent market attempt to get more money

Shame on you

SHAME ON YOU



Yup shame on a commerical business for making money.

I bet you write to TV stations and say shame on them for forwarding the careers of celebrities you don't like too, right?

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann

Raven Smog
New Eden Big Lotto
#137 - 2013-06-07 21:20:45 UTC
Personally I see it as a waste of a plex why not just use a second account. you still are training 2 guys with the added benefit of being abole to log both guys in at once.

I think it would be more useful to be able to train to skills at a time on one character for a plex

but just for a alt well i will stick with a second account so i can play both guys at once.
Capt Tenguru10
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#138 - 2013-06-07 21:30:54 UTC
You want to know why this isn't a rip off as you call it? Simple.. For some players who can't or don't want to have a second acct to pay for they can train a alt. and not have to worry about the second subscription fee, hence not having to worry about losing that alt to not paying for it. This is actually pure genius on the part of ccp

http://i.imgur.com/EYX5Zi7.gif

Doddy
Excidium.
#139 - 2013-06-07 21:37:14 UTC
How do ccp make more money from people using 2 plex on one account than on two accounts?

I wish it had been available back when i was doing my cyno and market alts, i had to make and run new accounts to train them then transfer them onto my permanent accounts spare slots. If this dual training thing had been around then i would have saved probably around £100 over a year.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#140 - 2013-06-07 21:42:12 UTC
Doddy wrote:
How do ccp make more money from people using 2 plex on one account than on two accounts?
Through people who don't want a second account because it costs too much, but who might want to toss a PLEX or two on an alt every now and then.

One or two every now and then > none, ever.