Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Reads like tears to me.

Notice how 90% of the people bitching about 0.0 being stagnant don't actually live here.

We are involved in two major conflicts just now, almost all of the non-renter alliances in null are involved in at least one. How is that stagnant?

This is because there is nothing worth doing in most nullsec systems, so why would people spend time there?

Neither do I but in hisec you have level 4 missions in pretty much every system, which have no limit to how many people can run them at once and which have a higher income than all but the high end anomalies, which can only be found in some systems in null, and which have much lower risk than ratting in 0.0. At the end of the day if they want people to live in these systems CCP need to make it worth their while to do so and that means either buffing low end anomalies or making at least some of the high end ones spawn in every system.

Every nullsec system needs to have a higher income potential for at least one or two pilots than any number of people can have in any given highsec system otherwise people will continue to not live there regardless of what else you do.

E or nerf highsec L4s but I don't think anyone really wants that.

No, I've never ratted in null and never heard of a foresaken hub.

Dude, I was ratting in Fountain when your alliance was still in the TESTagram.

What do you think upgrading a -0.01 will get?

I am on the same Jabber as Cameron, there are plenty of pings about ops. Even ops where other members of the CFC show up to help out. Example,

http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_related&kll_id=17851199

My alliance is sandwiched between two entities that are engaged in low grade hostile actions.

So this idea that null is blue from starting at one point and going 360 degrees is still blue is nonsense.

Now one reason you don't see more sov wars is that grinding sov structures is...well grinding....on the player. After awhile the thought of logging in to shoot another Ihub is worse than going to work. At least in the latter case I get a paycheck. Once an alliance has thrown in the towel on defending their space all that is left are boring as **** structure shoots.

Edit:



Because most systems suck in terms of resources that can be extracted and turned into isk by players.

we have discussed till now that aside for high end anomalies there is nothing that keep a decent amount of peoples inside low true sec sys and the thing that keep so many peoples in high sec are missions, to me is pretty clear that to encourage those capsulers to move in null it require implementing missions pve in null.
Catch peoples is harder in missions? Maybe but if the number of peoples rise the chances to catch someone rise as well.

maybe this is why many scream to nerf l4 in high sec, intested of nerfing them and inventing new and rarely appreciated (and used) method to farm isk in null creating lvl4 specifacally designed for that zone maybe the way to go.

The way I see it the reason for that is that more or less all unused systems are currently de facto "owned" of one of the larger nullsec entities. Sure they don't use it, but if someone (say a corp or small alliance) were to settle down there they have two options;
1) Pay the large entity rent for space they aren't using anyway and couldn't care less about.
2) Not pay rent and get roflstomped whenever the "owning" entity gets bored for whatever reason.

If you don't like paying rent for what is essentially a deserted wasteland (and who does?) none of the options are very exciting.

There are already seconds of null with mission running. Granted I have no idea how much it is utilized and can be a pain to get the standings to get started with the reasonable level missions.

One of the main reasons null sec systems are empty is because there are no stations in them, and even some of the systems with stations are fairly useless stations. Without the ability to refine or reprocess then a system looses a lot of its value for anyone mining or grinding rats. The lack of a market for most goods (especially meta drops since in any given area everyone has access to the same drops) means any secondary forms of income like loot and salvage and even exploration are of limited value.
It is also a very long and dangerous trip to get any of that to a real market. The overhead time it takes to turn said goods into isk can be quite long.

The biggest issue I see with null space is a chicken and egg sort of situation.

There isn't enough industry in null to live in null without occasionally heading to empire.
It is a PITA to move large amounts of goods, especially ships.
BPOs, especially researched are too valuable to be in null.
The limited number of stations and how spread out they are means that much more time and risk to get research/copy/inventing BP, the refined minerals, and the manufacturing slots all together to make something.
There isn't enough demand in any given region of null for someone to make the huge array of products that someone might want to buy.
So since everyone has to go to empire to get goods anyway there isn't a lot of market for goods to be sold in null.
The risk aversion for a lot of people in null isn't the isk it is the time.
And if you do produce something your possible market is a fraction of what it would be in Empire, you can only sell to your alliance and their allies, no one else can possibly get to your goods, but in empire you can sell to 99% of the playerbase.

Many alliances get around parts of this with reimbursement programs but those are almost always for very specific ships and often only for alliance PvP outings. There is a good chance any given player (especially fairly new) can't fly (or at least well) the ships the alliance wants everyone to use. Also most of those are for BCs and below, if you wanted to do lvl 4 missions or the high end anoms you pretty much need a BS and probably not one in the PvP fit that might be available for the reimbursement program.
Then on top of that the all might killboard seems to be the fixation of so many alliances, so if you are out taking risks to make money and do loose the ship not only are you out the isk for the ship, the time it takes to replace it, you're also getting yelled at by the killboard police because you are making the alliance look bad by dieing .

I have no idea what the solutions might be. I think having more fully equipped stations would help some aspects of it, but not everything. The cloaky haulers ease the pain of some moving but they are limited in use (many can't even move a cruiser, too small for raw minerals for manufacturing), they are also not that quick to train into and all of the larger haulers are too vulnerable or extremely expensive.

The thing I miss about empire the most when in null isn't the safety, it is the convenience.