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incursions are slowly killing off LP store profits

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Tenris Anis
Schattenengel Clan
#181 - 2011-11-03 18:15:28 UTC
Cyniac wrote:


LP value is overall decreasing - yes there are still some good items out there but not many and not as good as they used to be.


Which was clear from the moment agent changes were announced. More LP means less ISK per LP. I am actually surprised that it is still very easy to get more than 3k isk per LP. Many players just seem not to care what they buy with their LP and so we have still not a very equal distribution of lp value.

Remove insurance.
Spineker
#182 - 2011-11-03 18:41:19 UTC
3k/LP and it is easy... in what faction. Not Caldari
Spineker
#183 - 2011-11-03 18:41:57 UTC
I don't care so much about LP make World Collide Respawn after it is cleared.
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#184 - 2011-11-05 10:16:20 UTC
Incursions are a broken ISK flood of biblical proportions. Sure, it gets people out of noobcorps and into playing as part of a small gang with RR/logi's, whatever. I think this is a good thing, but it isn't going to make carebears PVP - if you lay the game to accumulate 0's and 1's of in-game currency, you aren't going to suddenly realise you have 30 billion ISk and start losing ships in lowsec.

Sure, incursions got neckbearded cheetos-ihaling sweaty basement dwelling geeks to drop noobcorp and install TS3 or vent and get social interaction (with other guys; its a start, and each to his own) but this has only been achieved with poorly concieved and unbalanced mechanics. The ISK rewards per site are fine - its the ease with which one gains said rewards and the frequency with which one can gain these sites which is emphatically not. IMO, ofc.

Secondly, Incursions are elitist, so if you don't have 3 FN magstabs on your shield vindi, you will be holding back your Incursion fleet by 0.2% on their DPS, and you will get dropped in favor of a guy who can make your fleet mates that fraction more ISK. Persist, you get blacklisted. Fun, huh?

Incursion bears can farm sites 23.5/7 and they do. They have stopped attacking the Sansha supercarriers in order to prolong their orgy of onanistic ISK vacuuming - because 1 hour transit to the next Incursion will lose them 100M ISk or whatever. Great.

They farm Nation Command outposts and Override Transfer Arrays. They turn a site over in 5 minutes if they suck. 3 minutes if they don't. They leave the higher end, more dangerous sites.

There is no ship size lockouts on Incursion sites. You can, if you figure out how to make it work, blitz anything in any ship. Meanwhile, low-end exploration plexes you can't take BS's into some.

The sansha rats warp out once the objective is complete. This leads to a blitzable OTA in 3 minutes and results in logi-supported DPS BS fleets just popping the BS rats. Can we have this feature in Level 4 Blockade plox? I want to blitz 12K LP Blockades but if I mess my spawns I die in a fire.

All the rewards are cash, delivered hot into your hand while in space. In missions you have to dock up, talk to some numpty avaturd, click a few buttons, get cookie. Can we please make incursions run on a similar line? Just making people dock after each site will reduce the ISK faucet considerabbly.

The sites respawn basically instantly. I find it mysterious that CCP nerfed Sanctum respawn rates, triggering a cascade of delicious tears from nullbears as 25% of their ISK flow turned off, yet you have insta-respawn OTA and NCO in hisec. I await the even bigger deluge of delicious tears from CCP making OTA's respawn only after 5 minutes.

On that note, can we have instant respawning wormhole sites please? Sure, some people can farm C4's in carriers with a few alts, and pull in 2.5B a month, but that's the absolute upper limit for one whole month, because the combat anoms don't respawn instantly. Until they do, these people are wasting their time and should SD their carriers. Also, the risk they take is insane compared to "oh noes my logi disconnected, i might die if he doesn't log back in immediately AND if the other 2 logi's ALSO disconnect!" (this is in no way a comment on game stability, btw).

~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
Mfume Apocal
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#185 - 2011-11-05 10:37:39 UTC
lol nice aspergers
Ammzi
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#186 - 2011-11-05 11:03:00 UTC
Trinkets friend wrote:
Incursions are a broken ISK flood of biblical proportions. Sure, it gets people out of noobcorps and into playing as part of a small gang with RR/logi's, whatever. I think this is a good thing, but it isn't going to make carebears PVP - if you lay the game to accumulate 0's and 1's of in-game currency, you aren't going to suddenly realise you have 30 billion ISk and start losing ships in lowsec.

Sure, incursions got neckbearded cheetos-ihaling sweaty basement dwelling geeks to drop noobcorp and install TS3 or vent and get social interaction (with other guys; its a start, and each to his own) but this has only been achieved with poorly concieved and unbalanced mechanics. The ISK rewards per site are fine - its the ease with which one gains said rewards and the frequency with which one can gain these sites which is emphatically not. IMO, ofc.


Incursion bears can farm sites 23.5/7 and they do. They have stopped attacking the Sansha supercarriers in order to prolong their orgy of onanistic ISK vacuuming - because 1 hour transit to the next Incursion will lose them 100M ISk or whatever. Great.


There is no ship size lockouts on Incursion sites. You can, if you figure out how to make it work, blitz anything in any ship. Meanwhile, low-end exploration plexes you can't take BS's into some.

All the rewards are cash, delivered hot into your hand while in space. In missions you have to dock up, talk to some numpty avaturd, click a few buttons, get cookie. Can we please make incursions run on a similar line? Just making people dock after each site will reduce the ISK faucet considerabbly.

The sites respawn basically instantly. I find it mysterious that CCP nerfed Sanctum respawn rates, triggering a cascade of delicious tears from nullbears as 25% of their ISK flow turned off, yet you have insta-respawn OTA and NCO in hisec. I await the even bigger deluge of delicious tears from CCP making OTA's respawn only after 5 minutes.

On that note, can we have instant respawning wormhole sites please? Sure, some people can farm C4's in carriers with a few alts, and pull in 2.5B a month, but that's the absolute upper limit for one whole month, because the combat anoms don't respawn instantly. Until they do, these people are wasting their time and should SD their carriers. Also, the risk they take is insane compared to "oh noes my logi disconnected, i might die if he doesn't log back in immediately AND if the other 2 logi's ALSO disconnect!" (this is in no way a comment on game stability, btw).



Bittervet is bitter! Here have some sugar.

Trinkets friend wrote:

Secondly, Incursions are elitist, so if you don't have 3 FN magstabs on your shield vindi, you will be holding back your Incursion fleet by 0.2% on their DPS, and you will get dropped in favor of a guy who can make your fleet mates that fraction more ISK. Persist, you get blacklisted. Fun, huh?


Awww, no one wanted your drake into fleet so you come here to QQ about it?
Making a generalization of a thousands large player group shows the intelligence about your post (near the bottom).


Trinkets friend wrote:

They farm Nation Command outposts and Override Transfer Arrays. They turn a site over in 5 minutes if they suck. 3 minutes if they don't. They leave the higher end, more dangerous sites.


Some people prefer vanguards and some prefer assaults and headquarters.
I did a few headquarters yesterday and I know 40'ish people did the same What?

Trinkets friend wrote:

The sansha rats warp out once the objective is complete. This leads to a blitzable OTA in 3 minutes and results in logi-supported DPS BS fleets just popping the BS rats. Can we have this feature in Level 4 Blockade plox? I want to blitz 12K LP Blockades but if I mess my spawns I die in a fire.


Oh right ... cause you can't screw up triggers in an incursion and die horribly, right?

You need to get off your spiky chair and take a sit on a pillow or something cause you're so butthurt I can almost feel your pain over here.

Trinkets friend wrote:

The sites respawn basically instantly. I find it mysterious that CCP nerfed Sanctum respawn rates, triggering a cascade of delicious tears from nullbears as 25% of their ISK flow turned off, yet you have insta-respawn OTA and NCO in hisec. I await the even bigger deluge of delicious tears from CCP making OTA's respawn only after 5 minutes.


Did you hear about this mystical phenomena called, nullsec incursions? Which every nullbear except goons seems to have forgot about.

The only thing that is wrong about incursions right now is influence gain and the popularity of the different tier sites.
End of discussion.
Kara Books
Deal with IT.
#187 - 2011-11-05 11:40:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Kara Books
Goose99 wrote:
Verity Sovereign wrote:
The biggest risk with high sec incursions is playing with people in the fleet you don't know.

There are many greifers that go to incursions, use the public incursion channel to invite them, and then get their fleet killed intentionally.
Or, they use the public incursion channel to try and get an invite.
*but they first have an alt/friend get aggro on them
*then they cap chain with the fleet and have the aggro spread.
*Then they bring in their gank squad.

or....

The logi's just suck

I once had my nightmare get down to 43% hull, despite having all my resists over 76% and 3 logi, because the logi were slow/didn't prioritize repairs/ had their head up their asses.

So.... incursions do carry risk, in that you will easily die if your other fleet members aren't competent, and they require the use of mechanics that can spread aggro*

*I think this mechanic needs to be fixed, a warning should pop up when you send cap/shield to someone who has an aggro timer, just like when you send to someone who is wardec'd.


I'm less worried about what it does to LP store profits, than what its doing to the value of ISK - massive inflation methinks


If you compare the isk faucet from handful of vg systems in at most 3 highsec constellations, to amount of sanctum rat bounty and lvl4 mission rat bounty paid out in eve, it's actually insignificant.

LP, Concord or converted faction, carry trade in price, and is thus an isk sink. This was the reason why CCP nerfed Sanctums so hard, but not lvl4s at the same time. Sanctums are large faucets of liquid isk, with no isk sink attached.

They shouldn't nerf Concord LP or convert it to faction at partial loss, as loss of LP is essentially loss of isk sink. Instead, give Concord shop more desirable items, but at even higher isk sink. The current 250 mil isk trade ins per item are good, but more is always better. The real problem is item offered simply suck, and are not worth it. So the potential isk sink remains in ppl's wallet and unused. Make them good enough, and ppl will pay even 1 bil trade ins.


Now lets include some one who knows how to work with dynamic numbers, because the OP is fail in my OP for the following reasons.

---------------REAL NUMBERS SPOILER:

So we have 106.7M isk per hour SINK Times 0.67 =70M per hour
and a total of 115.5M per hour Times 0.5 = 57m per hour---------------

I used to grind level 4 missions (mainly for standing to get jump clones).
I was pulling in about 10-40K LP/100-400M per day on my own, alone and very bored from grinding level 4 missions.

Right now Im grinding Incursions sites, Not alone and pulling in roughly 10-40K Concord LP per day and I try my hardest to make 400M per day, if I have a whole day.

Lets compare the amount of ISK I was sinking into the economy as a level 4 mission runner to what I do now, run incursion vanguard systems.

in about 8 hours of level 4's I would get a few decent item drops, maybe worth, 50M isk (not a sink and not a faucet)
I would pull in maybe 35 million ISK in bounty's per hour, and about that much in bounty rewards, for a total of 70 million ISK per hour faucet.
I would salvage about 35 million per hour in, well salvage, the kind you use to make rigs out of (not a faucet and not a sink)
I would gather as much as I could stuff into my ship, sometimes making a trip back and from station for a 2nd picking of loot drops for later reprocessing.
the LP, I try to turn it into 1200 ISK per LP or more, so I guess my avarage per hour for LP would be something like 3000?
so, 3000X1200=3.6M worth of LP

so at my very best, I would make 50+70+35+3+3.6 million ISK per hour grinding level 4 missions.
70 million ISK faucet
and a grand total of 161.6 million per hour running 2 characters at the same time.

Running Vanguard sites, at my best I have run 11 missions per hour, with the pro's, so that's, 9.7M times 11 is 106.7M isk per hour, running 1 character and 1000 LP times 11 is 11K LP per hour, lets give it a value of 800ISK per LP for a total of 8.8 million ISK.

So we have 106.7M isk per hour SINK
and a total of 115.5M per hour.

The verdict:

For every single LP I make, I have to spend about that much ISK to get the item, so all we have to do is subtract the LP amount from the 2 totals

70M minus 3.6M = 66.4m per hour
115.5M minus 8.8M = 106.7m per hour

But in reality, here is there truth.

I can ALWAYS GO and do level 4 missions any time I want to play alone.
I have trouble finding fleets that do more then 5 runs per hour avarage.
I get very borred playing alone, I go take breaks, go pvp, chat... just to stop grinding level 4's
I can go on coms, post killmails hear interesting stories meet people from diferent parts of the world, sometimes they dont even speak your language but you find ways to communicate.

The REAL numbers look more along the lines of

I run at about 2/3 speed doing level 4's because they are just borring OK?
I have trouble finding good fleets half the time, so just divide that 115.5M in half, because thats how it is OK?


REAL NUMBERS SPOILER:

So we have 106.7M isk per hour SINK Times 0.67 =70M per hour
and a total of 115.5M per hour Times 0.5 = 57m per hour
Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
#188 - 2011-11-05 18:38:12 UTC
Trinkets friend wrote:


Sure, incursions got neckbearded cheetos-ihaling sweaty basement dwelling geeks to drop noobcorp and install TS3 or vent and get social interaction (with other guys; its a start, and each to his own) but this has only been achieved with poorly concieved and unbalanced mechanics. The ISK rewards per site are fine - its the ease with which one gains said rewards and the frequency with which one can gain these sites which is emphatically not. IMO, ofc.

Secondly, Incursions are elitist, so if you don't have 3 FN magstabs on your shield vindi, you will be holding back your Incursion fleet by 0.2% on their DPS, and you will get dropped in favor of a guy who can make your fleet mates that fraction more ISK. Persist, you get blacklisted. Fun, huh?

Your first and second point contradict each other, for 2 reasons:
1)If it were so easy, and the sites were pulling in isk so quickly, then there would be no elitism, because the exact fit you bring would not matter so much.

2)If you've got a faction fit pirate BS, you'd be pulling in 60mil/hour running lvl 4s. Moving up to 100mil/hour by fleeting up with other people isn't that big of a problem.
Trinkets friend wrote:

Incursion bears can farm sites 23.5/7 and they do. They have stopped attacking the Sansha supercarriers in order to prolong their orgy of onanistic ISK vacuuming - because 1 hour transit to the next Incursion will lose them 100M ISk or whatever. Great.
They stopped killing the sansha MS because doing so at the first possible moment lead to incursions only being runnable a few hours a week. Not online when that incursion spawned at noon today? Try again in a few days. Isk issues aside, that sucks.
Not only that, but you've got literally HUNDREDS, if not thousands, of players cooperating in order to increase the isk they make as a group. Nullsec groups that do that get high end moons and sov space, the balance is there.


Trinkets friend wrote:

The sansha rats warp out once the objective is complete. This leads to a blitzable OTA in 3 minutes and results in logi-supported DPS BS fleets just popping the BS rats. Can we have this feature in Level 4 Blockade plox? I want to blitz 12K LP Blockades but if I mess my spawns I die in a fire.
If you mess up the triggers in an OTA you whelp a fleet costing more than a super carrier. Also isn't the blockade already blitzible?
Trinkets friend wrote:

All the rewards are cash, delivered hot into your hand while in space. In missions you have to dock up, talk to some numpty avaturd, click a few buttons, get cookie. Can we please make incursions run on a similar line? Just making people dock after each site will reduce the ISK faucet considerabbly.

The sites respawn basically instantly. I find it mysterious that CCP nerfed Sanctum respawn rates, triggering a cascade of delicious tears from nullbears as 25% of their ISK flow turned off, yet you have insta-respawn OTA and NCO in hisec. I await the even bigger deluge of delicious tears from CCP making OTA's respawn only after 5 minutes.

You do know that there are incursions in nullsec, and that said incursions pay out a whopping 40% more isk and LP than the ones in highsec, right? It's literally the most well balanced pay scale in the game.
Widemouth Deepthroat
Pink Sockers
#189 - 2011-11-05 20:22:10 UTC
Kara Books wrote:
Goose99 wrote:
Verity Sovereign wrote:
The biggest risk with high sec incursions is playing with people in the fleet you don't know.

There are many greifers that go to incursions, use the public incursion channel to invite them, and then get their fleet killed intentionally.
Or, they use the public incursion channel to try and get an invite.
*but they first have an alt/friend get aggro on them
*then they cap chain with the fleet and have the aggro spread.
*Then they bring in their gank squad.

or....

The logi's just suck

I once had my nightmare get down to 43% hull, despite having all my resists over 76% and 3 logi, because the logi were slow/didn't prioritize repairs/ had their head up their asses.

So.... incursions do carry risk, in that you will easily die if your other fleet members aren't competent, and they require the use of mechanics that can spread aggro*

*I think this mechanic needs to be fixed, a warning should pop up when you send cap/shield to someone who has an aggro timer, just like when you send to someone who is wardec'd.


I'm less worried about what it does to LP store profits, than what its doing to the value of ISK - massive inflation methinks


If you compare the isk faucet from handful of vg systems in at most 3 highsec constellations, to amount of sanctum rat bounty and lvl4 mission rat bounty paid out in eve, it's actually insignificant.

LP, Concord or converted faction, carry trade in price, and is thus an isk sink. This was the reason why CCP nerfed Sanctums so hard, but not lvl4s at the same time. Sanctums are large faucets of liquid isk, with no isk sink attached.

They shouldn't nerf Concord LP or convert it to faction at partial loss, as loss of LP is essentially loss of isk sink. Instead, give Concord shop more desirable items, but at even higher isk sink. The current 250 mil isk trade ins per item are good, but more is always better. The real problem is item offered simply suck, and are not worth it. So the potential isk sink remains in ppl's wallet and unused. Make them good enough, and ppl will pay even 1 bil trade ins.


Now lets include some one who knows how to work with dynamic numbers, because the OP is fail in my OP for the following reasons.

---------------REAL NUMBERS SPOILER:

So we have 106.7M isk per hour SINK Times 0.67 =70M per hour
and a total of 115.5M per hour Times 0.5 = 57m per hour---------------

I used to grind level 4 missions (mainly for standing to get jump clones).
I was pulling in about 10-40K LP/100-400M per day on my own, alone and very bored from grinding level 4 missions.

Right now Im grinding Incursions sites, Not alone and pulling in roughly 10-40K Concord LP per day and I try my hardest to make 400M per day, if I have a whole day.

Lets compare the amount of ISK I was sinking into the economy as a level 4 mission runner to what I do now, run incursion vanguard systems.

in about 8 hours of level 4's I would get a few decent item drops, maybe worth, 50M isk (not a sink and not a faucet)
I would pull in maybe 35 million ISK in bounty's per hour, and about that much in bounty rewards, for a total of 70 million ISK per hour faucet.
I would salvage about 35 million per hour in, well salvage, the kind you use to make rigs out of (not a faucet and not a sink)
I would gather as much as I could stuff into my ship, sometimes making a trip back and from station for a 2nd picking of loot drops for later reprocessing.
the LP, I try to turn it into 1200 ISK per LP or more, so I guess my avarage per hour for LP would be something like 3000?
so, 3000X1200=3.6M worth of LP

so at my very best, I would make 50+70+35+3+3.6 million ISK per hour grinding level 4 missions.
70 million ISK faucet
and a grand total of 161.6 million per hour running 2 characters at the same time.

Running Vanguard sites, at my best I have run 11 missions per hour, with the pro's, so that's, 9.7M times 11 is 106.7M isk per hour, running 1 character and 1000 LP times 11 is 11K LP per hour, lets give it a value of 800ISK per LP for a total of 8.8 million ISK.

So we have 106.7M isk per hour SINK
and a total of 115.5M per hour.

The verdict:
dribble...dribble


Nobody wants PVE balanced around people with down syndrome because that means anyone with a brain will make 10x as much.



Kara Books
Deal with IT.
#190 - 2011-11-05 21:41:17 UTC
Widemouth Deepthroat wrote:
Kara Books wrote:
Goose99 wrote:
Verity Sovereign wrote:
The biggest risk with high sec incursions is playing with people in the fleet you don't know.

There are many greifers that go to incursions, use the public incursion channel to invite them, and then get their fleet killed intentionally.
Or, they use the public incursion channel to try and get an invite.
*but they first have an alt/friend get aggro on them
*then they cap chain with the fleet and have the aggro spread.
*Then they bring in their gank squad.

or....

The logi's just suck

I once had my nightmare get down to 43% hull, despite having all my resists over 76% and 3 logi, because the logi were slow/didn't prioritize repairs/ had their head up their asses.

So.... incursions do carry risk, in that you will easily die if your other fleet members aren't competent, and they require the use of mechanics that can spread aggro*

*I think this mechanic needs to be fixed, a warning should pop up when you send cap/shield to someone who has an aggro timer, just like when you send to someone who is wardec'd.


I'm less worried about what it does to LP store profits, than what its doing to the value of ISK - massive inflation methinks


If you compare the isk faucet from handful of vg systems in at most 3 highsec constellations, to amount of sanctum rat bounty and lvl4 mission rat bounty paid out in eve, it's actually insignificant.

LP, Concord or converted faction, carry trade in price, and is thus an isk sink. This was the reason why CCP nerfed Sanctums so hard, but not lvl4s at the same time. Sanctums are large faucets of liquid isk, with no isk sink attached.

They shouldn't nerf Concord LP or convert it to faction at partial loss, as loss of LP is essentially loss of isk sink. Instead, give Concord shop more desirable items, but at even higher isk sink. The current 250 mil isk trade ins per item are good, but more is always better. The real problem is item offered simply suck, and are not worth it. So the potential isk sink remains in ppl's wallet and unused. Make them good enough, and ppl will pay even 1 bil trade ins.


Now lets include some one who knows how to work with dynamic numbers, because the OP is fail in my OP for the following reasons.

---------------REAL NUMBERS SPOILER:

So we have 106.7M isk per hour SINK Times 0.67 =70M per hour
and a total of 115.5M per hour Times 0.5 = 57m per hour---------------

I used to grind level 4 missions (mainly for standing to get jump clones).
I was pulling in about 10-40K LP/100-400M per day on my own, alone and very bored from grinding level 4 missions.

Right now Im grinding Incursions sites, Not alone and pulling in roughly 10-40K Concord LP per day and I try my hardest to make 400M per day, if I have a whole day.

Lets compare the amount of ISK I was sinking into the economy as a level 4 mission runner to what I do now, run incursion vanguard systems.

in about 8 hours of level 4's I would get a few decent item drops, maybe worth, 50M isk (not a sink and not a faucet)
I would pull in maybe 35 million ISK in bounty's per hour, and about that much in bounty rewards, for a total of 70 million ISK per hour faucet.
I would salvage about 35 million per hour in, well salvage, the kind you use to make rigs out of (not a faucet and not a sink)
I would gather as much as I could stuff into my ship, sometimes making a trip back and from station for a 2nd picking of loot drops for later reprocessing.
the LP, I try to turn it into 1200 ISK per LP or more, so I guess my avarage per hour for LP would be something like 3000?
so, 3000X1200=3.6M worth of LP

so at my very best, I would make 50+70+35+3+3.6 million ISK per hour grinding level 4 missions.
70 million ISK faucet
and a grand total of 161.6 million per hour running 2 characters at the same time.

Running Vanguard sites, at my best I have run 11 missions per hour, with the pro's, so that's, 9.7M times 11 is 106.7M isk per hour, running 1 character and 1000 LP times 11 is 11K LP per hour, lets give it a value of 800ISK per LP for a total of 8.8 million ISK.

So we have 106.7M isk per hour SINK
and a total of 115.5M per hour.

The verdict:
dribble...dribble


Nobody wants PVE balanced around people with down syndrome because that means anyone with a brain will make 10x as much.





Your lack of TEXTWALL is appalling...
Cypher Decypher
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#191 - 2011-11-05 22:37:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Cypher Decypher
There are certain Incursion-focussed players (read: FC's) who individually own 6-9 BILLION UNSPENT Concord LP

Something wrong there, in my book.

I think Loyalty Points should have a finite lifespan. It would certainly make them more realistic.
mingetek
Brainless in Space
#192 - 2011-11-05 22:50:04 UTC
Trinkets friend yes you are right everyone runs only vanguards etc... and does not take it further.

yet everyone i know has a **** stack high of lp for concord. 1+m lp each. care to explain?
..
JackStraw56
Run Like an Antelope
#193 - 2011-11-05 23:08:11 UTC
Cypher Decypher wrote:
There are certain Incursion-focussed players (read: FC's) who individually own 6-9 BILLION UNSPENT Concord LP

That is quite literally impossible. I think you mean million, not billion.
mingetek
Brainless in Space
#194 - 2011-11-05 23:18:03 UTC
JackStraw56 wrote:
Cypher Decypher wrote:
There are certain Incursion-focussed players (read: FC's) who individually own 6-9 BILLION UNSPENT Concord LP

That is quite literally impossible. I think you mean million, not billion.



lets see...

360k lp will make you 1b isk..so they would need no more than 4.5m lp after exchange to make that easily.
..
Eru GoEller
State War Academy
Caldari State
#195 - 2011-11-05 23:43:32 UTC
Cypher Decypher wrote:
There are certain Incursion-focussed players (read: FC's) who individually own 6-9 BILLION UNSPENT Concord LP

Something wrong there, in my book.

I think Loyalty Points should have a finite lifespan. It would certainly make them more realistic.


Good luck to get support for a motion to have a best-before-date on LP's, i believe there's some major LP's to be had by doing lvl 5's. Guess they doesn't add up to the numbers, where some may have 1M+ or in the extreme 1B+ of Concord LP's which is doubtful in itself, although i'm seing well over 50K for lvl5's.
For you mean all LP's should have a best-before-date, don't you?


mingetek wrote:
Trinkets friend yes you are right everyone runs only vanguards etc... and does not take it further.

yet everyone i know has a **** stack high of lp for concord. 1+m lp each. care to explain?


First Concord LPs was destroying the LP stores all over in EVE by being convertable, now Concord LP that is unspent is a problem??
In what way are this a problem, where players don't spend what they have collected?.
And should they spend them in any other LP store then Concord, they are destroying the LP store all over again.
mingetek
Brainless in Space
#196 - 2011-11-05 23:57:03 UTC
Eru GoEller wrote:
Cypher Decypher wrote:
There are certain Incursion-focussed players (read: FC's) who individually own 6-9 BILLION UNSPENT Concord LP

Something wrong there, in my book.

I think Loyalty Points should have a finite lifespan. It would certainly make them more realistic.


Good luck to get support for a motion to have a best-before-date on LP's, i believe there's some major LP's to be had by doing lvl 5's. Guess they doesn't add up to the numbers, where some may have 1M+ or in the extreme 1B+ of Concord LP's which is doubtful in itself, although i'm seing well over 50K for lvl5's.
For you mean all LP's should have a best-before-date, don't you?


mingetek wrote:
Trinkets friend yes you are right everyone runs only vanguards etc... and does not take it further.

yet everyone i know has a **** stack high of lp for concord. 1+m lp each. care to explain?


First Concord LPs was destroying the LP stores all over in EVE by being convertable, now Concord LP that is unspent is a problem??
In what way are this a problem, where players don't spend what they have collected?.
And should they spend them in any other LP store then Concord, they are destroying the LP store all over again.





wtf you talkign about 50k lp for a lvl 5? ou might wanna check up on that. I can bet around 100k lp a lvl 5 mission.. yet their stores are really raped due to how many lp you can make in a day.
..
Eru GoEller
State War Academy
Caldari State
#197 - 2011-11-06 00:02:39 UTC
mingetek wrote:
Eru GoEller wrote:
Cypher Decypher wrote:
There are certain Incursion-focussed players (read: FC's) who individually own 6-9 BILLION UNSPENT Concord LP

Something wrong there, in my book.

I think Loyalty Points should have a finite lifespan. It would certainly make them more realistic.


Good luck to get support for a motion to have a best-before-date on LP's, i believe there's some major LP's to be had by doing lvl 5's. Guess they doesn't add up to the numbers, where some may have 1M+ or in the extreme 1B+ of Concord LP's which is doubtful in itself, although i'm seing well over 50K for lvl5's.
For you mean all LP's should have a best-before-date, don't you?


mingetek wrote:
Trinkets friend yes you are right everyone runs only vanguards etc... and does not take it further.

yet everyone i know has a **** stack high of lp for concord. 1+m lp each. care to explain?


First Concord LPs was destroying the LP stores all over in EVE by being convertable, now Concord LP that is unspent is a problem??
In what way are this a problem, where players don't spend what they have collected?.
And should they spend them in any other LP store then Concord, they are destroying the LP store all over again.





wtf you talkign about 50k lp for a lvl 5? ou might wanna check up on that. I can bet around 100k lp a lvl 5 mission.. yet their stores are really raped due to how many lp you can make in a day.


By whom, Incursioners converting their Concord LP's at 80%, or by lvl 5 mission runners that rake in 100K per mission?
JitaJane
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#198 - 2011-11-06 00:14:52 UTC
Tenris Anis wrote:
JitaJane wrote:

My best flips are around 6KI/LP honorable internet spaceship pilot. how are you?


Only ~3000 isk / LP with my current agent, switching soon to about 4.5k ... I guess I am on the losing side as well :D

It is worthwhile to just pop through stations and jot down LP store prices. It is also worthwhile to have 5+ faction standings. 6 is a high and the market won't bear over-exploiting it. 3-4 is a good average. Thing is you need to diversify or markets crash on high end items. And as I said to begin with, incursions have raised demand for some shinnies. Leave their channel open and notice which bits are chronically on the fits....

90% of of the time my posts are about something I actually find interesting and want to learn more about. Do not be alarmed.

Jinn Rho
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#199 - 2011-11-06 02:46:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Jinn Rho
JitaJane wrote:
Tenris Anis wrote:
JitaJane wrote:

My best flips are around 6KI/LP honorable internet spaceship pilot. how are you?


Only ~3000 isk / LP with my current agent, switching soon to about 4.5k ... I guess I am on the losing side as well :D

It is worthwhile to just pop through stations and jot down LP store prices. It is also worthwhile to have 5+ faction standings. 6 is a high and the market won't bear over-exploiting it. 3-4 is a good average. Thing is you need to diversify or markets crash on high end items. And as I said to begin with, incursions have raised demand for some shinnies. Leave their channel open and notice which bits are chronically on the fits....


Honestly, JitaJane is one of the few pilots on this complaint forum who is actually making something useful outta this whole discussion. Instead of moaning and moaning, she is actually thinking outside the box and making a huge profit off us incursioners. That's what intelligent people do.

Yes dedicated incursioners make a lot of LP, but dedicated missioners make more LP per hour. On top of that, concord LP payouts are made only when the incursion mothership is killed, more or less a week due to the BTL/TDF agreement.
Furthermore, incursions dont yield corp/faction standings.

When you boil it all down, incursioners make more raw isk. But missioners can equally profit, if not more, from selling tags and/or selling faction mods via LP store.

As someone stated earlier, one can ALWAYS run lvl4s at their leisure, whereas HS incursioners have to deal with heavy competition for that paycheck, especially true if there is only one HS incursion at the moment.



Open your eyes and think outside the box.
As Snoop Dogg once said, "Drop it like it's hot."
Spineker
#200 - 2011-11-06 03:07:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Spineker
Need to stop Incursion respawn or be fair to the rest of the players in the game.


Also end LP exchange whoever came up with that was high or drunk.