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News - Heth does not attend CEP meeting; Provist leadership vanishes

Author
Makoto Priano
Kirkinen-Arataka Transhuman Zenith Consulting Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#41 - 2013-05-29 23:40:46 UTC
Hm. That would be a twist perfectly suited to low-budget Gallente daytime holos.

Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries: exploring the edge of the known, advancing the state of the art. Would you like to know more?

Arkady Vachon
The Gold Angels
Sixth Empire
#42 - 2013-05-29 23:49:30 UTC
Makoto Priano wrote:
Hm. That would be a twist perfectly suited to low-budget Gallente daytime holos.


Still, watching Caldari holochannels is like watching the paint on a ship's hull peel, all one big infomercial, product placement, and State programming.

Of course, Amarr programming is no better, unless you're really into this God thing, otherwise it will put you to sleep.

About the only holos worth watching are probably Minmatar.

Nothing Personal - Just Business...

Chaos Creates Content

Edwin Sterrick
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#43 - 2013-05-30 00:00:24 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
CITIZENS, Please remain calm. Do not follow ideas of deluded gallentean scum.
Everything is fine.
Tibus Heth-haan is still our Executor and the head of the State.


Not for long, spirits willing.
Svetlana Scarlet
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#44 - 2013-05-30 00:07:26 UTC
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
Brandi Wiseman wrote:
My appeal for calm has apparently fallen on deaf ears.


Remaining calm is exactly what the Provist want. For everyone to sit still and totally not attempt to challenge their power when they are leaderless and very weak. That way, they will have enough time to restore control by either getting Heth back or putting someone new in charge.

Quiet. We resolve our issues in our way. Your supposed Deteis blood does not make you Caldari, as remarks like this one indicate; mind your own business. We do not burn traitors alive for the perverse enjoyment of the mob in the State. We deal with them as a surgeon deals with an infected limb; removed, disposed of, and replaced with a suitably healthy substitute. There is no fanfare, no violence necessary.

Kindly butt out. Again...this is the lesson the Caldari and others have been trying to teach the Gallente for hundreds of years. It is unfortunate that you are extremely slow learners.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#45 - 2013-05-30 01:30:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Herzog Wolfhammer
Being docked next door to the CEP HQ in New Caldari is making him nervous.

I might just start killing convoys in case he's on one of them.

If Heth disappears, the first place I would look is under Mentas Blaque's bed.


As for a Caldari civil war, unless we see large numbers remain as Heth loyalists and try to take over each corporation, then the structure of the Caldari state is not centralized enough to require war. Heth is nearly powerless.

But... there's always a but....


that he's keeping his big fat melon down and the provists have slithered under the furniture means they are up to something. I would suspect something along the lines of a coup to establish a hard-liner Caldari faction and they will look on any Caldari entities not aligned with them as traitorous to their cause. Such a mindset would not be beyond lashing out at the very people they claimed to be for.


I will remain parked in the region in the meantime. As for meddling in state affairs: I'm doing it because I can, and Heth and the provists are beyond state affairs. These are monsters.

And in the end, I am merely practicing for when these same days that Heth is seeing come to Mentas Blaque.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#46 - 2013-05-30 01:43:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Fredfredbug4
Svetlana Scarlet wrote:

Quiet. We resolve our issues in our way. Your supposed Deteis blood does not make you Caldari, as remarks like this one indicate; mind your own business.


Caldari Nationalism: "Leave us alone and mind your own business. Just keep in mind that we will have our leaders loudly comment on your affairs as much as possible while condemning you in some fashion."

Breaking News!: Heth and several megacorps express outrage over handbags in the Federation! Declares them to be covert! weapons designed to kill Caldari puppies! In other news, President Roden has revealed himself to be a giant soul eating serpent!

Everyone is a bit of a hypocrite as of late, some more than others of course.

Svetlana Scarlet wrote:
We do not burn traitors alive for the perverse enjoyment of the mob in the State. We deal with them as a surgeon deals with an infected limb; removed, disposed of, and replaced with a suitably healthy substitute. There is no fanfare, no violence necessary.


Ignorance is bliss, how I wish to have your innocence.

Do you really think that Heth can simply be removed and tossed aside somewhere? You've seen the ways he tries to maintain his power, by butchering the defenseless.

Feel free to politely ask him and his thugs to step down of course. Do see how that works out.

Your country has no precedent or guidelines for a peaceful change of power on this scale and you certainly aren't going to come up with an effective one before **** hits the fan. Bracing for impact is about the best you can do at this point.

SvetlanaKindly wrote:
butt out. Again...this is the lesson the Caldari and others have been trying to teach the Gallente for hundreds of years. It is unfortunate that you are extremely slow learners.


Slow but steady wins the race ;)

Plus, I'm pretty sure everyone is having trouble learning lately. Has CONCORD ever explained why all of our learning skills suddenly disappeared from the training logs several years ago?

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!

James Syagrius
Luminaire Sovereign Solutions
#47 - 2013-05-30 02:36:00 UTC
I will make no other comment regarding this situation but I would again caution my.... friends in the State not to underestimate Executor Heth.
Aquila Shadow
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#48 - 2013-05-30 03:49:19 UTC
Your all reading far to much into this. Heth simply has the cold and couldn't make it into work, he has been working to hard lately so I formally invite him round to my quarters for a nice cup of tea.

                                              "Let Vigilance Be Your Sword"

Edwin Sterrick
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#49 - 2013-05-30 03:57:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Edwin Sterrick
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
Do you really think that Heth can simply be removed and tossed aside somewhere?


Well... yes.

The CEP gave Heth his authority, and the CEP can take it away. What's Heth going to do about it? His power was built on a reputation as a Caldari patriot and hero, and now that's all fallen to ashes around him. Who'd fight for him? The Liberals never liked him in the first place. The Practicals know he plans to take away their power. And now that we know what happened at Caldari Prime, even the Patriots are abandoning him. Heth butchers the defenseless because he can't butcher anyone else.

I suppose there may end up being some violence by the time this is all over, if the Provists decide not to face their fall with dignity, but somehow I doubt they'll last long against the combined might of the State.
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#50 - 2013-05-30 05:28:28 UTC
Makoto Priano wrote:
Hm. That would be a twist perfectly suited to low-budget Gallente daytime holos.


Only because a certain Mega had to sell off their Media assets to pay their debts and can no longer fund their own.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.

Kyoko Sakoda
Achura-Waschi Exchange
Monyusaiya Industry Trade Group
#51 - 2013-05-30 05:37:13 UTC
The Chief Executive Panel will have to deal with this in their own way. We all have our own preferences, but none of us are in charge, and argumentation is largely pointless. Violent civil unrest is not in the State's best interest during a time of political uncertainty and tense foreign relations.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#52 - 2013-05-30 07:21:48 UTC
Edwin Sterrick wrote:
The CEP gave Heth his authority, and the CEP can take it away. What's Heth going to do about it? His power was built on a reputation as a Caldari patriot and hero

And the generous financial intervention of a mysterious benefactor whose identity to this day remains entirely unknown, through which he was able to secure ownership of Caldari Constructions and the Kaalakiota Corporation. That benefactor, I would wager, is still out there, and most likely doesn't want his investment washed down the drain.

A person or organisation powerful enough to buy Kaalakiota out from under Hatakaan Oritsu's nose strikes me as overwhelmingly dangerous, especially if they've got something to lose.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Mirala Nodoka
SilfMeg Mining and Transportation Co
#53 - 2013-05-30 07:41:34 UTC
This is an interesting observation, Andreus Ixiris. And it is a very important thing you point out to us.
I have to think this over...
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#54 - 2013-05-30 08:03:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Andreus Ixiris
One should also consider that the Templis Dragonaurs terrorist group, membership of whom is grossly illegal in all CONCORD signatory nations, have been spotted openly running errands for Heth. Whether or not they remain his allies after learning what he attempted to do to Caldari Prime, their presence is an extreme danger that shouldn't be underestimated.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Lyris Nairn
Perkone
Caldari State
#55 - 2013-05-30 08:04:06 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Edwin Sterrick wrote:
The CEP gave Heth his authority, and the CEP can take it away. What's Heth going to do about it? His power was built on a reputation as a Caldari patriot and hero

And the generous financial intervention of a mysterious benefactor whose identity to this day remains entirely unknown, through which he was able to secure ownership of Caldari Constructions and the Kaalakiota Corporation. That benefactor, I would wager, is still out there, and most likely doesn't want his investment washed down the drain.

A person or organisation powerful enough to buy Kaalakiota out from under Hatakaan Oritsu's nose strikes me as overwhelmingly dangerous, especially if they've got something to lose.

Wealth is not the only currency.

Sky Captain of Your Heart

Reddit: lyris_nairn Skype: lyris.nairn Twitter: @lyris_nairn

Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#56 - 2013-05-30 09:52:08 UTC
it is, however, one of the more important ones when it comes to influencing interstellar events and people's lives by the million.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Lucas Raholan
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
#57 - 2013-05-30 10:52:23 UTC
No amount of money is going to save Heth from the approaching storm, he is backed into a corner and everyone knows it

Shitposts so bad CONCORD gave me a 50 billion ISK bounty

Svetlana Scarlet
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#58 - 2013-05-30 17:05:33 UTC
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
Caldari Nationalism: "Leave us alone and mind your own business. Just keep in mind that we will have our leaders loudly comment on your affairs as much as possible while condemning you in some fashion."

You will note that I have never supported the CPD and its ridiculous warmongering, and aside from Tibus Heth, few of the State's leaders have expressed opinions on the internal affairs of the Federation. It is only when your meddling government tries to extend its reach into our borders -- or others' -- that we become incensed. Do not project your own faults upon us. I will grant you that Tibus Heth is doing as you suggest, but then that is the root of the enmity many of us in the Caldari capsuleer community have with him.

Fredfredbug4 wrote:
Do you really think that Heth can simply be removed and tossed aside somewhere? You've seen the ways he tries to maintain his power, by butchering the defenseless.

Feel free to politely ask him and his thugs to step down of course. Do see how that works out.

Your country has no precedent or guidelines for a peaceful change of power on this scale and you certainly aren't going to come up with an effective one before **** hits the fan. Bracing for impact is about the best you can do at this point.

Perhaps you have never heard of the Morning of Reasoning. This is hardly unprecedented in the Caldari State. And if you think Heth cannot simply be removed and tossed away...there are eight other military forces in the State with strength equal to the Home Guard, and the CPD is a bunch of ill-mannered thugs, not a professional military force. Anyone who doubts that only needs to see their pathetic performance on Caldari Prime. The economic strength of Kaalakiota has been shot.

There are men and women at the top of the Kaalakiota hierarchy who know what will happen if they resist the judgement of the CEP. We do not forget the lessons of the past. I doubt the board of Kaalakiota will risk extreme sanction for to save face for a man who has destroyed their corporation, and risks destroying the State with his madness.

This is the difference between the Federation in the State. You think the mob should dictate the direction of the state. We believe that those who have proven themselves most able should dictate the will of the state. This is the reason why Tibus Heth has never been good for the Caldari -- we are not Gallente. We will never be. And now we must ensure that those within the State who want to see us be are destroyed.
Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#59 - 2013-05-30 19:12:55 UTC
Svetlana Scarlet wrote:

You will note that I have never supported the CPD and its ridiculous warmongering, and aside from Tibus Heth, few of the State's leaders have expressed opinions on the internal affairs of the Federation. It is only when your meddling government tries to extend its reach into our borders -- or others' -- that we become incensed. Do not project your own faults upon us. I will grant you that Tibus Heth is doing as you suggest, but then that is the root of the enmity many of us in the Caldari capsuleer community have with him.


Indeed you have never supported the Provist. You don't have to be a support of the Patriot Bloc or Provist to be a Nationalist. You do know what nationalism is right? You can be a practical or even a Liberal and still be a nationalist.

Regardless, I am not projecting our faults unto you. The Federation feels that others can say what they will about us. An ancient philosopher from before we even made it to the stars once said, "I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it". Of course, the State has no concept of this principle, which is why you seem to have trouble understanding that it's perfectly fine for outsiders to comment on the affairs within your nation.

But, I digress, if anything you are projecting your faults onto the Provist, a very childish "but they do it more!".

Svetlana Scarlet wrote:

Perhaps you have never heard of the Morning of Reasoning. This is hardly unprecedented in the Caldari State. And if you think Heth cannot simply be removed and tossed away...there are eight other military forces in the State with strength equal to the Home Guard, and the CPD is a bunch of ill-mannered thugs, not a professional military force. Anyone who doubts that only needs to see their pathetic performance on Caldari Prime. The economic strength of Kaalakiota has been shot.


The Morning of Reasoning was more focused on power of the Megacorps. This is different. A single individual has never served as the de-facto ruler of the State, at least with as much power as Heth. Things are much easier when power has been distributed across megacorps with millions of people in them. One man? Now things are a little more difficult.

Svetlana Scarlet wrote:
There are men and women at the top of the Kaalakiota hierarchy who know what will happen if they resist the judgement of the CEP. We do not forget the lessons of the past. I doubt the board of Kaalakiota will risk extreme sanction for to save face for a man who has destroyed their corporation, and risks destroying the State with his madness.


Here is where Caldari ideals begin to conflict with each other. You all believe in serving the greater good. Wonderful! You all support aggresive competition! Wonderful! Yet how can the greater good be served when everyone is trying to get ahead of each other? What I'm trying to explain here is that Kaalakiota can use this as an opportunity to try and get ahead. If they back the Provist and Heth and turn out successful, they would have possibly pounded their opposition to a pulp, if not eliminated it all together.

Svetlana Scarlet wrote:

This is the difference between the Federation in the State. You think the mob should dictate the direction of the state. We believe that those who have proven themselves most able should dictate the will of the state. This is the reason why Tibus Heth has never been good for the Caldari -- we are not Gallente. We will never be. And now we must ensure that those within the State who want to see us be are destroyed.


Interesting. You say a mob shouldn't dictate the direction of the State, yet that's all we see. Violent mobs, riots if you will are responsible for why Heth is currently cowering somewhere. Do you think he would be hiding were it not for these disgruntled masses ready to take his head? Throughout the entire history of the State you have tried to purge Gallente ideals, yet you have failed. We made it to the stars together, working side by side. Our roots are nearly identical. The Federation has never shaken the influence the Caldari have had on us, and the State never will regarding us, no matter how hard they tried.

Hell, the concept of the mega-corporation, one of the most signature traits of the State, came from us.

As for chosing based on merit, if that were the case, Heth would have never come into power.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!

Svetlana Scarlet
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#60 - 2013-05-30 19:44:28 UTC
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
Indeed you have never supported the Provist. You don't have to be a support of the Patriot Bloc or Provist to be a Nationalist. You do know what nationalism is right? You can be a practical or even a Liberal and still be a nationalist.

Regardless, I am not projecting our faults unto you. The Federation feels that others can say what they will about us. An ancient philosopher from before we even made it to the stars once said, "I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it". Of course, the State has no concept of this principle, which is why you seem to have trouble understanding that it's perfectly fine for outsiders to comment on the affairs within your nation.

But, I digress, if anything you are projecting your faults onto the Provist, a very childish "but they do it more!".

I have never told the Federation how to conduct its internal affairs -- few of us, aside from the Provists, care what the Federation does within its borders. You are perfectly within your rights to continue indulging in your worst excesses, keeping millions of people on the public dole, and whatever other wrongheaded policies you so choose. When you tell those of us in the State -- or the Empire, or the Republic for that matter, how to conduct our internal affairs, then you overstep your bounds. If you think I am projecting "my faults" onto the Provists, you are not listening...which is not particularly unprecedented for the Gallente.

Fredfredbug4 wrote:
The Morning of Reasoning was more focused on power of the Megacorps. This is different. A single individual has never served as the de-facto ruler of the State, at least with as much power as Heth. Things are much easier when power has been distributed across megacorps with millions of people in them. One man? Now things are a little more difficult.

The Meetings of Reasoning are a long tradition in Caldari culture; they were not a one-time event. You clearly know nothing of our history, you make no sense -- do you think Heth has power only because his force of personality? No one is afraid of one man, and one man is nothing to the Caldari.

Fredfredbug4 wrote:
Here is where Caldari ideals begin to conflict with each other. You all believe in serving the greater good. Wonderful! You all support aggresive competition! Wonderful! Yet how can the greater good be served when everyone is trying to get ahead of each other? What I'm trying to explain here is that Kaalakiota can use this as an opportunity to try and get ahead. If they back the Provist and Heth and turn out successful, they would have possibly pounded their opposition to a pulp, if not eliminated it all together.

If you think Kaalakiota can come out ahead in this matter by supporting Heth and his bootlickers, you are more delusional than Heth is. They are drowning in debt and outnumbered seven to one, and Heth's strange sway over the Navy seems to be at an end. If Kaalakiota goes against the will of the CEP, it will be the end of them -- they will be destroyed like the unionists were after the Morning of Reasoning or like Seaguard Financial when it threatened Caldari Funds Unlimited. If you do not understand how competition can lead to a greater whole, perhaps you can get someone with a basic degree in biology to teach you about the survival of the fittest.

Fredfredbug4 wrote:
Interesting. You say a mob shouldn't dictate the direction of the State, yet that's all we see. Violent mobs, riots if you will are responsible for why Heth is currently cowering somewhere. Do you think he would be hiding were it not for these disgruntled masses ready to take his head? Throughout the entire history of the State you have tried to purge Gallente ideals, yet you have failed. We made it to the stars together, working side by side. Our roots are nearly identical. The Federation has never shaken the influence the Caldari have had on us, and the State never will regarding us, no matter how hard they tried.

Hell, the concept of the mega-corporation, one of the most signature traits of the State, came from us.

The cowardice of the CEP in letting the mob dictate the ascent of Heth is what brought us to this point. Their cowardice now in not taking action sooner is what continues our troubles. It must be ended immediately if we are to return to our place of strength.

As far as your claims that "our roots are nearly identical," this is Gallente arrogance at its finest. Our roots are nothing like yours. We were born on a world that by its very nature tried to destroy us. We survived. Your people tried to destroy our culture and make us into pale imitations of your decadence -- we made a terrible sacrifice to ensure that we would survive as a people, not under the heel of Gallente imperialism. When you ask why we have such enmity for your Federation, this is why -- you think nothing of the accomplishments of others and only compare them to what you consider "progress." Toleration for the choices of others is unthinkable for the Gallente.

If you think the megacorporation in its current form comes from the Gallente...you are also mistaken. Perkone, among others, dates from before the Gallente came to Caldari Prime. We are not some sort of backwater primitives, like you have convinced yourselves we and the Intaki were before you "found" us.

Fredfredbug4 wrote:
As for chosing based on merit, if that were the case, Heth would have never come into power.


However...at least on this point, we can agree. It is time for us to cauterize this wound and discard the infected flesh, and return to the ways that made the Caldari State what it once was.