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101 MB launcher???? really??

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Smoking Blunts
ZC Omega
#41 - 2013-05-27 22:06:49 UTC
CCP Atropos wrote:
Smoking Blunts wrote:
CCP Atropos wrote:

So, as I said, one of the runtimes is pending removal and fixing of anything referencing it, then there is the fact that you've got a large cache, something that you can clear out if you wish, and then thirdly its built on Python, and Python is a weighty environment unfortunately. Considering the EVE Client is somewhere around 11 or 12 GB in size, 100MB is nothing Blink

If the people wanting optional hi-res texture packs get their way, it will become an even smaller piece of the total download.



the 11-12gb is on my hard drive. the 90-100mb he is talking about is sat in my processes column and im expected to leave it there if I need to swap to an alt

the client only takes 600-800mb to run ffs

He mentions the installer, which is only ever run once.That won't be in memory whilst you're running the game.


you have to leave it open to be able to swap to an alt effectively under this new system, and in that case it just sits there sucking up ram needlessly.

its not like there is a log off button that restarts the launcher to allow you to close it every time between same account alts

OMG when can i get a pic here
David Laurentson
Laurentson INC
#42 - 2013-05-27 22:43:26 UTC
Smoking Blunts wrote:
CCP Atropos wrote:
Smoking Blunts wrote:
CCP Atropos wrote:

So, as I said, one of the runtimes is pending removal and fixing of anything referencing it, then there is the fact that you've got a large cache, something that you can clear out if you wish, and then thirdly its built on Python, and Python is a weighty environment unfortunately. Considering the EVE Client is somewhere around 11 or 12 GB in size, 100MB is nothing Blink

If the people wanting optional hi-res texture packs get their way, it will become an even smaller piece of the total download.



the 11-12gb is on my hard drive. the 90-100mb he is talking about is sat in my processes column and im expected to leave it there if I need to swap to an alt

the client only takes 600-800mb to run ffs

He mentions the installer, which is only ever run once.That won't be in memory whilst you're running the game.


you have to leave it open to be able to swap to an alt effectively under this new system, and in that case it just sits there sucking up ram needlessly.

its not like there is a log off button that restarts the launcher to allow you to close it every time between same account alts


The installer is not the launcher, mind. Atropos is quite correct in saying that the 100megs the installer takes up should not be staying around in RAM each up space.

That said, my launcher (started up hours ago, used to trigger a few clients and then forgotten) is using 156,384Kb of RAM right now, which is actually more than 100mb.
Exiting, waiting for the space to uncommit and restarting it pulls one up at 122mb. Each client I start then causes the launcher to take up an extra 3,000kb or so: the second client I openned also spawns a 9,000kb Launcher.exe process.

Closing the clients causes the launcher process to grow slightly more. v0v
Closing the launcher does shut down both the launcher.exe processes (at least, it did for me just now).

It doesn't seem unreasonable to me, but I have many, many rams.


An additional note on the logoff button: clicking 'restart' after safely logging off just closes the client now. Probably also intentional, though it should maybe give focus to the launcher or something?
Mire Stoude
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#43 - 2013-05-27 23:41:47 UTC
Jocca Quinn wrote:
CCP Atropos wrote:


100MB is nothing Blink



When you are stuck with a very poor internet connection (barely over dial up speeds) every 5 mb is painful.

Ugh


Dude... come'on.
Vertisce Soritenshi
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#44 - 2013-05-28 05:17:56 UTC
I wonder...could there be anything dumber to complain about on the forums?

I will keep looking and will post an update to this thread when I find it.

Bounties for all! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2279821#post2279821
Mark Androcius
#45 - 2013-05-28 06:51:13 UTC
Let me be clear here.

I am not at all worried about 100-ish MB's of ram being used, since i have 2 decks of 16 GB.
However, the mentality of "ahhh, what's a few MB's here and there" leads to disastrous problems over the long term.

https://androcius.wordpress.com
Tiven loves Tansien
Doomheim
#46 - 2013-05-28 07:46:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Tiven loves Tansien
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:
I wonder...could there be anything dumber to complain about on the forums?

I will keep looking and will post an update to this thread when I find it.


If you cant say something smart when you feel the urge to attack someone's opinion, better stay silent.

You are a baboon.
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2013-05-28 12:15:54 UTC
Tiven loves Tansien wrote:
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:
I wonder...could there be anything dumber to complain about on the forums?

I will keep looking and will post an update to this thread when I find it.


If you cant say something smart when you feel the urge to attack someone's opinion, better stay silent.

You are a baboon.

it wasn't so difficult to find Lol

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Master SpaceNinja
V0LTA
OnlyFleets.
#48 - 2013-05-28 13:03:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Master SpaceNinja
Quick! Someone get in touch with hard disk manufacturers and warn them of this imminent threat!

Jesus Christ, get a grip.
Cindy Marco
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#49 - 2013-05-28 14:12:00 UTC
The size of the launcher does not concern me.

The fact that it STILL doesn't work for some people does.
iskflakes
#50 - 2013-05-28 14:20:59 UTC
CCP Atropos wrote:
Three? There should be only two, and one of those is soon to be removed.


I am very pleased to hear this. For reference, the three copies of the runtime I found were in:

  • /launcher/Microsoft.VC90.CRT
  • /launcher/appdata/EVE_Online_Launcher-2.1.539169.win32/Microsoft.VC90.CRT
  • /launcher/appdata/EVE_Online_Launcher-2.1.539169.win32 (just sitting in the folder)


CCP Atropos wrote:
That updater.exe is the installer you used to install the Launcher. It contains the zipped install package, so you can just delete it.


Good to know, if it's not necessary maybe it could just delete itself?

CCP Atropos wrote:
100MB is nothing Blink


Yes, the disk space is nothing -- but most of that has to be loaded into RAM. That kills startup times and makes the new shiny launcher, which is actually a very nice piece of work, feel sluggish and bloated. Additionally some people are leaving their launchers open in the background to enable faster character switching, so it's killing their EVE memory usage too.

I like the new launcher though, despite its huge size and the launch issues. Keep up the good work.

-
Vertisce Soritenshi
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#51 - 2013-05-28 14:26:30 UTC
Tiven loves Tansien wrote:
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:
I wonder...could there be anything dumber to complain about on the forums?

I will keep looking and will post an update to this thread when I find it.


If you cant say something smart when you feel the urge to attack someone's opinion, better stay silent.

You are a baboon.

I don't need to say anything "smart" to get my point across. Especially to baboons like yourself.

I still haven't found anything dumber to complain about but what I did find is that the launcher for EVE isn't all that large by comparison.

My launcher for Tera Online is almost 200mb but as pointed out earlier in this thread, it can vary depending on what is being used at the time.

The launcher for Star Trek Online is just over 200mb.

The SOE launcher is at 250mb.

Finally the launcher for AION reached 275mb.

I would say CCP is doing a damned fine job so far.

Bounties for all! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2279821#post2279821
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#52 - 2013-05-28 14:36:22 UTC
GreenSeed wrote:
Tiven loves Tansien wrote:
Inefficient and dirty coding.



considering chrome eats 90mb+ with one tab open, and the launcher is a browser and has 2 "tabs" open, one for main screen and another for the log in box AND its also a torrent client (24mb on utorrent with all torrents stopped.) and an installer/patcher. i would say 90mb for the launcher process is damn fine.

that is, comparing what the launcher does to two individual programs considered to be the best optimized programs on their categories.



No one in their sane mind would say that chrome is optimized. All current mainstream browsers are incredbly resource hungry. I already made browsers for embedded systems that used lass than 800 K !

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
De'Veldrin
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#53 - 2013-05-28 16:13:14 UTC
Honestly, I can't say I even notice the launcher when I leave it open. It doesn't seem to impact performance, so what's the issue?

In the interest of full disclosure I have a six core processor and 16GB of RAM. Frankly, I'll notice the high texture pack as more of an impact, because I'll probably have to upgrade my video card to something that won't melt on contact with it. (Yes yes, I know the plan is to make it optional).

De'Veldrin's Corollary (to Malcanis' Law): Any idea that seeks to limit the ability of a large nullsec bloc to do something in the name of allowing more small groups into sov null will inevitably make it that much harder for small groups to enter sov null.
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#54 - 2013-05-28 17:58:31 UTC
Tiven loves Tansien wrote:
Inefficient and dirty coding.



Dirty CCP programmers. Dirty. Dirty. P

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Adela Talvanen
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#55 - 2013-05-28 18:10:32 UTC
Just checked mine, and its 2,708 Kb. Shocked
Adela Talvanen
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#56 - 2013-05-28 18:10:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Adela Talvanen
Deleted
Mark Androcius
#57 - 2013-05-29 07:47:43 UTC
De'Veldrin wrote:
Honestly, I can't say I even notice the launcher when I leave it open. It doesn't seem to impact performance, so what's the issue?

In the interest of full disclosure I have a six core processor and 16GB of RAM. Frankly, I'll notice the high texture pack as more of an impact, because I'll probably have to upgrade my video card to something that won't melt on contact with it. (Yes yes, I know the plan is to make it optional).


There is no real time issue at all.
However, as a programmer, the one thin that kills your program in the long run, is the, "we have more than enough ram to spare" mentality.

Seeing as most companies ( Even Google and such ) have this mentality ( look at browsers these days, omg 900 mb of ram just for your browser is just about a rule ), eventually, it will hurt performance.


The fact that you HAVE 16GB of ram ( i do too ) does not mean you should USE it all.
The less ram you use, the better the performance, no matter how much ram you have.

https://androcius.wordpress.com
Sturmwolke
#58 - 2013-05-29 08:37:05 UTC
Mark Androcius wrote:

There is no real time issue at all.
However, as a programmer, the one thin that kills your program in the long run, is the, "we have more than enough ram to spare" mentality.

Seeing as most companies ( Even Google and such ) have this mentality ( look at browsers these days, omg 900 mb of ram just for your browser is just about a rule ), eventually, it will hurt performance.


The fact that you HAVE 16GB of ram ( i do too ) does not mean you should USE it all.
The less ram you use, the better the performance, no matter how much ram you have.

Post of the day.

Yes, I've ran out of words to argue this bloat.
Common sense seems to have fled the room.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#59 - 2013-05-29 08:47:08 UTC
GreenSeed wrote:
Tiven loves Tansien wrote:
Inefficient and dirty coding.



considering chrome eats 90mb+ with one tab open, and the launcher is a browser and has 2 "tabs" open, one for main screen and another for the log in box AND its also a torrent client (24mb on utorrent with all torrents stopped.) and an installer/patcher. i would say 90mb for the launcher process is damn fine.

that is, comparing what the launcher does to two individual programs considered to be the best optimized programs on their categories.


Bolded what should never put in a launcher - updater.

EvE even got its own browser space inside the client (character selection screen, to the right), this putting heavy weight start up time, code and memory footprint before the game even started is just BAD.

If I had an employee doing this, I'd make him go study a couple of tutorials about how to write proper light weight patchers.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#60 - 2013-05-29 08:52:30 UTC
CCP Atropos wrote:
Considering the EVE Client is somewhere around 11 or 12 GB in size, 100MB is nothing Blink

If the people wanting optional hi-res texture packs get their way, it will become an even smaller piece of the total download.


There are people who pay dearly for what they download.

The recent graphics mini patch (492MB) costed me 10 euros.
100 MB costed me 2 euros.

Now I finally got the flat cable internet in my new home but there are many who don't have an option and have to dearly pay for every bit of bloatware they have to download.

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