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No podding, more PvP

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Lady Areola Fappington
#81 - 2013-05-25 21:23:20 UTC
I had this discussion in NPC corp chat a few days ago. It went something like this:

"I'll be ready to PVP in two more years, I don't have the SP." "If you can fit a scram and guns, you can PVP"
"OK, well, I've got expensive implants in my head." "Jumpclone out of them into a blank pod."
"I don't have time to grind standings to 8 for a JC" "Use EACS, it's free."
"If I Jumpclone, I'll lose training time!" "No more than two hours, no biggy."
"Well, if I PVP, I can't maintain my ISK income." "It's what ISK is for, to go blow stuff up"

And so on, and on, and on. My spouse is heavily anti PVP, and in his words "I hate the adrenaline rush."

Sadly, these anti-PVP types are the same ones joining our game, and demanding changes under the guise of "It's a sandbox I can do whatever I want!"

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide
Skeln Thargensen
Doomheim
#82 - 2013-05-25 21:29:22 UTC
basically don't feel the need to defend your carebearing with ridiculous reasons because a bunch of fanboys goad you on the forums about it.

forums.  serious business.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#83 - 2013-05-25 21:34:21 UTC
That's funny, I PVP in a 2.5 billion isk implant set all the time.
Cannibal Kane
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#84 - 2013-05-25 21:42:58 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
That's funny, I PVP in a 2.5 billion isk implant set all the time.


aaii...

I don't understand what the issue here is. If you get podded.. buy more implants and have it.

"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#85 - 2013-05-25 22:26:13 UTC
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
My spouse is heavily anti PVP

You must be very forgiving.

Vimsy Vortis wrote:
That's funny, I PVP in a 2.5 billion isk implant set all the time.

Most of my clones, aside from a backup cyno clone I use for myself or other people in emergencies, have some combination of pirate/FW implants. I don't go for full high-grade sets all the time, but the average is probably around 600-700 million. When I'm active I spend about half my time in wormholes. It's pretty intense, and even though I don't really want to die and lose the implants, the benefits are just too good.

I really wish I could have more jump clones. It would be nice to have one of each major set types, including the ECCM ones.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Nexus Day
Lustrevik Trade and Travel Bureau
#86 - 2013-05-25 22:38:19 UTC
Wow, amazing how many people know what I think when I ask a question. At no point have I stated an opinion on the matter.

But I will say there really is no amount of risk in EvE that you can't buy your way out of.
Haulie Berry
#87 - 2013-05-25 22:53:04 UTC
Nexus Day wrote:
Wow, amazing how many people know what I think when I ask a question. At no point have I stated an opinion on the matter.

But I will say there really is no amount of risk in EvE that you can't buy your way out of.


The good ole, "My badpost was just an innocent question, honest guys!" Roll

This thread has been done a hundred times before, which is why everyone knows exactly where it's going.

Nobody who actually WANTS to PvP is deterred by their implants. A few people who don't want to PvP will use their implants as an excuse, but anyone who actually WANTS to PvP will utilize some combination of jump clones and cheaper implants to set their risk to a level they deem acceptable, and then they'll go PvP.

Garresh
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#88 - 2013-05-25 22:56:53 UTC
Nope. Unless you've got a set podding is just an annoyance. Nothing more.

This Space Intentionally Left Blank
Adunh Slavy
#89 - 2013-05-25 22:57:11 UTC
Haulie Berry wrote:
but anyone who actually WANTS to PvP will utilize some combination of jump clones and cheaper implants to set their risk to a level they deem acceptable, and then they'll go PvP.



Not when your clone costs, with out implants, 10-20 times the cost of fun time roam ship, no.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#90 - 2013-05-25 23:02:15 UTC
Literally 1bn isk medical clone.

Oh god.
Haulie Berry
#91 - 2013-05-25 23:08:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Haulie Berry
Adunh Slavy wrote:
Haulie Berry wrote:
but anyone who actually WANTS to PvP will utilize some combination of jump clones and cheaper implants to set their risk to a level they deem acceptable, and then they'll go PvP.



Not when your clone costs, with out implants, 10-20 times the cost of fun time roam ship, no.


You sound poor and/or full of ****.

Eve just had its 10th birthday, fun with numbers.

10*365*24*2700 = 236 million SPs - a long way from the threshold for a 264 million SP clone.

So, worst case scenario, your med clone is costing you 90 million isk.

So, at the OUTSIDE, you're talking 10x a reasonably fit frigate, worst case scenario. You're not going to approach 20x unless you're doing a hilarious **** fit.

As a late 2005 character, your med clones do not cost that much. Lol
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#92 - 2013-05-25 23:18:31 UTC
Learning boosters instead of learning implants.

Hardwired skills are good as they are.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Lipbite
Express Hauler
#93 - 2013-05-25 23:20:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Lipbite
Ships are cheap, implants set cost hundred(s) millions and billions + to create clone one have to either farm reputation or perform some hassle with corporations. This (huge) barrier is actually protection for "hardcore PvPers" from overwhelming amount of new wannabe PvPers. No wonder "hardcore PvPers" will do whatever it takes to keep status quo including false logic "less barriers won't change anything, carebears won't become PvPers anyway". Won't happen any soon.

Also CCP is too busy with creating yet another lackluster mehspansion and too afraid to introduce anything radical (like implants insurance or immortal pods) after Monoclegeddon. Won't happen.
Nexus Day
Lustrevik Trade and Travel Bureau
#94 - 2013-05-25 23:30:42 UTC
So a little background.

I love PvP, just haven't seen much in this game. The "PvP" in this game reminds me much of the Pre-1.4 Warhammer "PvP'. I was one of the people who pushed for the 1.4 PvP changes. Why? To take the PvE out of PvP.

Grab a handfull of kill mails and tell me what you see. 10 v 1. 50 Mill SP w/T2's blowing up someone with 1 Mill SP. Or the famous fleet actions that just scream anonymous PvP where 10% of the people do 90% of the fighting.

So please do not get on a high horse about EvE PvP. I guarantee if CCP made the fights fairer all these PvPers would quit saying "they ruined mah game" just like what happened in Warhammer.

But back on topic. My question had no motive but to promote discussion. I would like for more people to PvP, but having played PvP games I understand there are psychological barriers to entry. I was wondering if implant costs is one of them.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#95 - 2013-05-25 23:38:15 UTC
Adunh Slavy wrote:
Haulie Berry wrote:
but anyone who actually WANTS to PvP will utilize some combination of jump clones and cheaper implants to set their risk to a level they deem acceptable, and then they'll go PvP.



Not when your clone costs, with out implants, 10-20 times the cost of fun time roam ship, no.


Don't die in a bubble then.
Zimmy Zeta
Perkone
Caldari State
#96 - 2013-05-26 00:22:26 UTC
Reducing the risk would not work to increase pvp for various reasons that have been pointed out already.
So the other route would be to increase the possible profit from pvp to set some kind of positive motivation (c+ instead of c- in BT terms).
That almost everyone now has a bounty on his head was a step in the right direction, but in the future CCP should find a way to further increase the possible profit of killing other players to make pvp eventually an activity that pays for itself instead of requiring a carebear alt who pays for your losses.

I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it. Yes, I do feel bad about it.
Danni stark
#97 - 2013-05-26 00:27:15 UTC
would i be far more reckless if i knew it wasn't going to cost me training time? absolutely.
would that be a good thing? debatable.
would i pvp more if i didn't have to worry about learning implants? i'd like to think i would, but i'm not sure it'd make that much difference.

Ice Mining Skill Plan.
Adunh Slavy
#98 - 2013-05-26 01:15:30 UTC
Haulie Berry wrote:


You sound poor and/or full of ****.



I have an aversion to waste, get over it.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Adunh Slavy
#99 - 2013-05-26 01:16:00 UTC
baltec1 wrote:


Don't die in a bubble then.


Aren't you cute

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Haulie Berry
#100 - 2013-05-26 02:13:34 UTC
Nexus Day wrote:
So a little background.

I love PvP, just haven't seen much in this game. The "PvP" in this game reminds me much of the Pre-1.4 Warhammer "PvP'. I was one of the people who pushed for the 1.4 PvP changes. Why? To take the PvE out of PvP.

Grab a handfull of kill mails and tell me what you see. 10 v 1. 50 Mill SP w/T2's blowing up someone with 1 Mill SP. Or the famous fleet actions that just scream anonymous PvP where 10% of the people do 90% of the fighting.

So please do not get on a high horse about EvE PvP. I guarantee if CCP made the fights fairer all these PvPers would quit saying "they ruined mah game" just like what happened in Warhammer.

But back on topic. My question had no motive but to promote discussion. I would like for more people to PvP, but having played PvP games I understand there are psychological barriers to entry. I was wondering if implant costs is one of them.



All I heard was, "I don't really know anything about PvP in Eve, but I'm not about to let my unmitigated ignorance get in the way of a perfectly good **** post."