These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

30 days dual character training - now on Singularity

First post First post
Author
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#161 - 2013-05-10 18:11:10 UTC
Allus Nova wrote:
If it costs a FULL plex for training on your second character, what benefit is there to doing this? Just open another account (which you can regularly get for like 5 dollars, maybe less) and you can use them simultaneously.

This is stupid, there should be some benefit to this, perhaps 45 days of training for an alt.


i have 4 accounts, i don't want a 5th personally. because the same pattern will emerge, I'll start training on that 5th acount, then something will change or come up and I'll want to do 6 things at once instead of 5, and will need a 6th account to train that new alt.

This way, CCP gets more money from me than I would have paid had I had to get a 5th account, and I get to expand what I'm doing without a fuss. if they do this I can finally get around to training that wormhole alt i always wanted but got side tracked because I want to train cynos and carriers on all 4 accounts.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#162 - 2013-05-10 18:13:14 UTC
Allus Nova wrote:
If it costs a FULL plex for training on your second character, what benefit is there to doing this?
Convenience.
Zaxix
State War Academy
Caldari State
#163 - 2013-05-10 18:13:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Zaxix
LethalGeek wrote:
Sure. Then a year later I go dang I want this character to also do this instead of doing the New Account Transfer Dance all over again I just slap a plex on the alt and take care of it.

Listen to mr I have to plan everything perfectly to have maximum fun over here.

I enjoy planning. Ask your FC's and cap pilots if they do a lot of in depth planning. Or your alliance leadership or your coalition leadership. Reading some of the stuff about major alliances/coalitions, it's clear they plan things more than a year in advance. Same with the market gurus and speculators. This isn't difficult to figure out or plan. It's pretty basic. Setup as many low skill, passive ISK streams as you can to reduce your ISK expenditures. Simple. As I said before, there's nothing bad about the change, but nothing that great either. Though, it's nice to have options, I agree.
Haulie Berry wrote:
Zaxix wrote:
Or you could, you know, take the first week of that 12 months to train PI alts on that second account, and at the end of 12 months you'll have covered a significant portion of the cost of the 12 months.


This works, if we completely ignore the effort of actually doing PI. I'm not magically generating more money by virtue of the fact that I have some PI characters now. Now I have to set up planets, manage them, and haul the **** they produce. If I wanted to do any of that, I would already be doing it on the characters I have.

Fair enough. There are other options, but I totally see where you're coming from. In my particular setup, the goal was to cash out the account with the sale of the third character. Since my main money making activity was hauling, I didn't use PI, I used freighter alts. Being a Frog director made the whole thing very easy for me. *shrug*

Bokononist

 

Kadl
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#164 - 2013-05-10 18:16:24 UTC
Wonderful! Now I might actually get some training. Big smile
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#165 - 2013-05-10 18:17:42 UTC
Steve Ronuken wrote:


Malcanis wrote:
Dez Affinity wrote:
Anyone posting against this is an idiot.




"Grrr CCP! STOP GIVING ME OPTIONS!!!!"



What are you doing talking to the community?

Didn't you know, that white badge means you're supposed to shut up and be invisible?! Blink
Malcanis shut up and be invisible? That will be the day. A very bad day. Blink
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#166 - 2013-05-10 18:19:47 UTC
Allus Nova wrote:
If it costs a FULL plex for training on your second character, what benefit is there to doing this? Just open another account (which you can regularly get for like 5 dollars, maybe less) and you can use them simultaneously.

This is stupid, there should be some benefit to this, perhaps 45 days of training for an alt.

The benefit is specific purpose alt training becomes convenient and doesn't disrupt training of your main. It's also better for alt training at times, since training it on another account requires either continued payments on that account or paying a character transfer fee. More importantly it's not supposed to replace making alt accounts. It's just an alternative way to train alts.
Gordwin Sendare
House Lannister
#167 - 2013-05-10 18:27:56 UTC
The amount of Republicans playing this game never ceases to amaze me.
stoicfaux
#168 - 2013-05-10 18:29:44 UTC
THIS. WILL. DESTROY. EVE!

...because it will make the sub numbers appear to go down (i.e. a sudden and dramatic increase in churn.)

and then the web-o-sphere will hear about the sub numbers going down but won't report on why, and then the financial types will jump on the "omg-subs-are-down-sell-sell-don't-invest" bandwagon, which could impact WoD and Dust by proximity, which means layoffs for CCP which means Eve dies for realsies.

/it's_been_a_great_10_years

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.

Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#169 - 2013-05-10 18:30:26 UTC
Gordwin Sendare wrote:
The amount of Republicans playing this game never ceases to amaze me.



How does it amaze you the we play this game?
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#170 - 2013-05-10 18:30:38 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Allus Nova wrote:
If it costs a FULL plex for training on your second character, what benefit is there to doing this?
Convenience.


It saves you the character transfer cost once the second character's training plan is complete.

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.

Kyt Thrace
Lightspeed Enterprises
Goonswarm Federation
#171 - 2013-05-10 18:31:43 UTC
Love this feature,Big smile

I have wasted so many plexes transferring a character off my main character's account for a couple months to another account to train something that I decided that the alt needed. Then I use plex to transfer back to my main account so I can let the second account stop. Just because I didnt want to stop training my main account.

I really do not want to know how many plexes from transfer fees that I could have saved over the years if this was an option from the beginning.

Another account that I have has the following toons:

Aeon pilot
Ice Miner only
Jump Freighter Pilot

I just stopped training on my Aeon pilot, so I could finish getting my JF pilot into a carrier too. I didn't want to transfer my JF pilot to another account just to end up transferring her back due to the 4 plexes it would cost me. I decided to stop training Aeon pilot for a few months to train JF pilot, but if this patch goes through I can start Aeon pilot back up again.Big smile

Also this would allow me to expand my ice miner into T2 crystals for ore, which she cant use even T1 crystals atm.

This feature is LONG OVERDUE.

R.I.P. Vile Rat

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#172 - 2013-05-10 18:32:33 UTC
CCP RubberBAND wrote:
Hey all,

RubberBAND here from the team implementing this feature. First apologies that you have not seen a Dev Blog about this. We had planned for one to go just prior to Fanfest, but that plan fell through. We hope to have a Dev Blog out sometime soon, but we don't have an ETA for you all yet.

To answer some of the questions in this thread, we are very interested in feedback regarding this feature and how useful you may find it. As most have figured out, this is a short term option for people who want to train an alt on their account without having to maintain two (or more) accounts.

If you are training two characters and the dual character in training runs out, the character with fewest skill points is assumed to be the alt and will be paused, while your character with more skill points will continue training.

Anyway expect more information soon, till then keep this thread rolling.




Here's feedback:

It's a good idea, because it allows flexibility and further options. I can't think of a reason not to like having extra choices in account handling, except to repeat some of the dogmatic concepts regarding the use of alts. But that's rigid thinking.

I think the option will be more popular with veteran players who have learned since starting how the total amount of SP does not determine outcome and this would let a 3-slot account allow for specialization of same-account alts and overall, more fun or objectives without the management of 2 accounts and later movement of characters.

Hopefully this will eventually lead to the end of the limit of 3 characters per account. Of course having seen a lot of savantry, bronyism, and obsessive compulsive disorder/aspergers on the web, some arbitrary limit of characters per account would be necessary lest an entire new server farm be needed for that 1000 players who just have to have 500 alts each, a limit of 3 characters seems a bit small. But then, I'm not in charge of the infrastructure so I don't know.

Overall, being able to train same-account alts while seemingly pointless to the chorus of the dogmatics, merely represents an option that is simply more flexibility and I applaud it.

So far I have yet to see any other game as flexible as this and have yet to see any other MMO producer to be as responding as CCP.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Midge Mo'yb
State War Academy
Caldari State
#173 - 2013-05-10 18:33:21 UTC
the plex for the alt should be worth more time since you dont really gain the benefits of an alt account
Danni stark
#174 - 2013-05-10 18:35:22 UTC
Midge Mo'yb wrote:
the plex for the alt should be worth more time since you dont really gain the benefits of an alt account


not really.

here's how it works, you trade the ability to log in to both characters at once, for the ability to log in to the second character any time you want even after you've stopped plexing it.

it's a bit of a trade-off really. a character you can't use while another character is online, but one that doesn't require it's own subscription if it's not training anything.

after my initial skepticism i've realised it's actually a really nifty idea.
Azami Nevinyrall
172.0.0.1
#175 - 2013-05-10 18:35:57 UTC
CCP RubberBAND wrote:
Hey all,

RubberBAND here from the team implementing this feature. First apologies that you have not seen a Dev Blog about this. We had planned for one to go just prior to Fanfest, but that plan fell through. We hope to have a Dev Blog out sometime soon, but we don't have an ETA for you all yet.

To answer some of the questions in this thread, we are very interested in feedback regarding this feature and how useful you may find it. As most have figured out, this is a short term option for people who want to train an alt on their account without having to maintain two (or more) accounts.

If you are training two characters and the dual character in training runs out, the character with fewest skill points is assumed to be the alt and will be paused, while your character with more skill points will continue training.

Anyway expect more information soon, till then keep this thread rolling.

I *REALLY* like this idea, now expand it by having the character selection in the login part and the ability to launch multiple clients from the one account. This will go along way and I'm willing to bet A LOT of people will enjoy this.

The downside? Expect people to migrate to fewer accounts (Thus making everyone's life easier.) And show fewer subs, so people will bash the tinfoil hats claiming "EVE IS DYING" As numbers will show fewer active accounts but (slightly) more cash coming in.

...

stoicfaux
#176 - 2013-05-10 18:39:07 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:
THIS. WILL. DESTROY. EVE!

...because it will make the sub numbers appear to go down (i.e. a sudden and dramatic increase in churn.)

and then the web-o-sphere will hear about the sub numbers going down but won't report on why, and then the financial types will jump on the "omg-subs-are-down-sell-sell-don't-invest" bandwagon, which could impact WoD and Dust by proximity, which means layoffs for CCP which means Eve dies for realsies.

/it's_been_a_great_10_years

Seriously, has anyone run this past the high level business types at CCP?

If it this feature reduces sub counts then advertisers and investors would conclude that there are fewer players than expected, which implies that Eve has a smaller marketshare which makes Eve even more of a niche game which makes CCP/Eve a riskier venture to invest in.

Even worse, the increase in PLEX sales could turn Eve that much more of a cash cow, and business folks milk cash cows, they don't invest in them nor do they take risks with them.

Seriously, this could backfire on CCP.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.

Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#177 - 2013-05-10 18:47:21 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:
stoicfaux wrote:
THIS. WILL. DESTROY. EVE!

...because it will make the sub numbers appear to go down (i.e. a sudden and dramatic increase in churn.)

and then the web-o-sphere will hear about the sub numbers going down but won't report on why, and then the financial types will jump on the "omg-subs-are-down-sell-sell-don't-invest" bandwagon, which could impact WoD and Dust by proximity, which means layoffs for CCP which means Eve dies for realsies.

/it's_been_a_great_10_years

Seriously, has anyone run this past the high level business types at CCP?

If it this feature reduces sub counts then advertisers and investors would conclude that there are fewer players than expected, which implies that Eve has a smaller marketshare which makes Eve even more of a niche game which makes CCP/Eve a riskier venture to invest in.

Even worse, the increase in PLEX sales could turn Eve that much more of a cash cow, and business folks milk cash cows, they don't invest in them nor do they take risks with them.

Seriously, this could backfire on CCP.



The key word is IF it reduced sub counts.

Sure, wanting to train more than one char is a reason to get alt accounts, but it's not a reason to KEEP them. mayb players like me get hooked on things like dual boxing pvp and pve content for instance.

And, the way to counter the potential "shock" of losing subs if for ccp to simply let people know that "hey, yea we lost subs, but we've increase revenue, we dind't lose people we just gave people a way to do things with fewer accounts".

Then add in the militant "I will only ever have one EVE account" players (I know some) who might now buy plex to train up an alt on their one account. That extra revenue ccp would not have otherwise had.

I don't have a crystal ball, but CCP needs money (its a business) and this is , it seems to me, a way to do with while giving palyer a realyl valuable new tool.
LethalGeek
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#178 - 2013-05-10 18:48:31 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:
Seriously, has anyone run this past the high level business types at CCP?

If it this feature reduces sub counts then advertisers and investors would conclude that there are fewer players than expected, which implies that Eve has a smaller marketshare which makes Eve even more of a niche game which makes CCP/Eve a riskier venture to invest in.

Even worse, the increase in PLEX sales could turn Eve that much more of a cash cow, and business folks milk cash cows, they don't invest in them nor do they take risks with them.

Seriously, this could backfire on CCP.


This has been a nice reminder why I don't read these forums too often. Jeez this post is terrible.
Princess Missie
TxivYawg
#179 - 2013-05-10 18:50:46 UTC
why would you want a cyno alt on your main account?

isn't the norm for your main to be your capital/blops pilot?

no use unless you already have a second account unless you wanna train scam/ low sp trade alts

may be useful for character traders who do turn arounds over time instead of quick resales so that they can keep multiple characters training over one account



Kyt Thrace
Lightspeed Enterprises
Goonswarm Federation
#180 - 2013-05-10 18:52:52 UTC
The only downside I can see for CCP is that they do lose out on some transfer plexes/fees that some of us have spent way too much on over the years moving alts back & forth to different accounts to train.

I know I could be > 20 bil isk richer if this feature was in place years ago.

R.I.P. Vile Rat