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Feedback Request: Radial Menu

First post
Author
Mizhir
Devara Biotech
#81 - 2013-05-10 11:08:49 UTC
Will it be possible to have the option to make it appear on rightclick instead of the old rightclick menu?

❤️️💛💚💙💜

CCP Masheen
C C P
C C P Alliance
#82 - 2013-05-10 11:16:19 UTC
Mizhir wrote:
Will it be possible to have the option to make it appear on rightclick instead of the old rightclick menu?


The right-click menu can accommodate thousands of combinations of options but the Radial menu cannot.

tl:dr No

- EVE Online Quality Assurance -

Rammix
TheMurk
#83 - 2013-05-10 11:17:45 UTC
Mizhir wrote:
Will it be possible to have the option to make it appear on rightclick instead of the old rightclick menu?

I think it's too difficult to fully replace right-click menu with a radial one, maybe even impossible (remember named bookmarks, fleet commands etc etc etc). It would need a 3d holographic sphere managed telepathically, lol. Lol

OpenSUSE Leap 42.1, wine >1.9

Covert cyno in highsec: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=296129&find=unread

CCP Masheen
C C P
C C P Alliance
#84 - 2013-05-10 11:19:15 UTC
Shade Millith wrote:

I guess I'm just irritated (Really, really irritated. Day was already bad when I found out the Radial Menu change, making it go from bad to horrid) that I'm going to have to go back to basics once more, and relearn my muscle memory.

Is it possible to allow customization at all? I know you did that with the Neocom. For me, a strong Radial Menu would be the old one, with the current layout just flat out annoying. Just having 'Look At' underneath a submenu is bad enough.

If you want to make a stronger tool for pilots, allowing them to set what icons they need and where those icons are would be a good step forward.


Creating the interface to customize menu locations is not a small task and we don't have time to do that for Odyssey.

- EVE Online Quality Assurance -

Mizhir
Devara Biotech
#85 - 2013-05-10 11:21:11 UTC
CCP Masheen wrote:
Mizhir wrote:
Will it be possible to have the option to make it appear on rightclick instead of the old rightclick menu?


The right-click menu can accommodate thousands of combinations of options but the Radial menu cannot.

tl:dr No


So what about adding the option to move the old rightclick to another key?

❤️️💛💚💙💜

CCP Masheen
C C P
C C P Alliance
#86 - 2013-05-10 11:27:52 UTC
Mizhir wrote:
CCP Masheen wrote:
Mizhir wrote:
Will it be possible to have the option to make it appear on rightclick instead of the old rightclick menu?


The right-click menu can accommodate thousands of combinations of options but the Radial menu cannot.

tl:dr No


So what about adding the option to move the old rightclick to another key?


The Radial menu is an alternative to way to access options commonly used in space-flight but it does not replace the right-click menu (same relationship as keyboard shortcuts). Right-click menus are used all over the EVE client especially in inventory management and it would be a bad idea to mess with that paradigm.

- EVE Online Quality Assurance -

Tanaka Aiko
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#87 - 2013-05-10 11:36:00 UTC
Terrorfrodo wrote:
I'm one of those who never used the old menu, I am not even sure how it was opened as this only happened to me by accident and it appeared useless Lol So I think your rationale is sound.

Same here, I was like "what old radial menu is he talking about?" during 30sec before remembing this old thing that sometimes happened, and which had an "eject from ship" button that you may push sometimes by mistake...

Anyway, there may have some things to polish here, but I know something ; yesterday on TQ, while I was on fleet, I tried a few time to use the radial menu on the overview or on items on space... which of course didn't existed. But that means I prefer this new things as the right clic or the selected item box. So this new radial menu is better that the current UI.
Rammix
TheMurk
#88 - 2013-05-10 11:51:32 UTC
Mizhir wrote:
CCP Masheen wrote:
Mizhir wrote:
Will it be possible to have the option to make it appear on rightclick instead of the old rightclick menu?


The right-click menu can accommodate thousands of combinations of options but the Radial menu cannot.

tl:dr No


So what about adding the option to move the old rightclick to another key?

Still have a mouse with only 2 buttons, eh? Blink
Right click is allright, the best place for contextual menu.

OpenSUSE Leap 42.1, wine >1.9

Covert cyno in highsec: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=296129&find=unread

xttz
GSF Logistics and Posting Reserves
Goonswarm Federation
#89 - 2013-05-10 11:57:16 UTC
CCP Masheen wrote:
Shade Millith wrote:

I guess I'm just irritated (Really, really irritated. Day was already bad when I found out the Radial Menu change, making it go from bad to horrid) that I'm going to have to go back to basics once more, and relearn my muscle memory.

Is it possible to allow customization at all? I know you did that with the Neocom. For me, a strong Radial Menu would be the old one, with the current layout just flat out annoying. Just having 'Look At' underneath a submenu is bad enough.

If you want to make a stronger tool for pilots, allowing them to set what icons they need and where those icons are would be a good step forward.


Creating the interface to customize menu locations is not a small task and we don't have time to do that for Odyssey.


Well how about just reverting the button positions back to normal instead of moving them for no reason?

http://i.imgur.com/nDNGaUu.png
CCP Masheen
C C P
C C P Alliance
#90 - 2013-05-10 13:16:29 UTC
xttz wrote:


Well how about just reverting the button positions back to normal instead of moving them for no reason?

http://i.imgur.com/nDNGaUu.png


The options were not moved, this is an all new menu. The options in new Radial menu and their location has been carefully considered and prototyped with various versions. This is not something that had been done on the old menu.

We are considering swapping the location of a couple of options based on community feedback, but these changes fit within the design guidelines of the new menu. Reverting to the old layout would not.

A DevBlog from our UI Designer CCP Sharq will be published shortly which outlines the rationale behind the menu and its layout. Hopefully this addresses your concerns.

- EVE Online Quality Assurance -

Anthar Thebess
#91 - 2013-05-10 13:17:32 UTC
Please make on titans JUMP TO first option to appear and you have to change to BRIDGE TO on this menu.

This will make many people happy :D
Sir Marksalot
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#92 - 2013-05-10 14:00:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Sir Marksalot
CCP Masheen wrote:
Mizhir wrote:
Will it be possible to have the option to make it appear on rightclick instead of the old rightclick menu?


The right-click menu can accommodate thousands of combinations of options but the Radial menu cannot.

tl:dr No




Thank christ. Losing the right click menu for some stupid radial thing with 1/10th the functionality would suck so bad.

On a related note; I forgot the radial menu even existed. I literally had to log in and fiddle with the client a bit to figure out how it worked.
I'm not the only one either
(8:49:17 AM) Sir_Marksalot: I forgot the radial menu existed, holy ****
(8:49:28 AM) Sir_Marksalot: I dont think I've seen it in years
(8:50:15 AM) abdulaz: There is one now?
(8:50:19 AM) abdulaz: I did not even know
(8:50:27 AM) abdulaz: how do you get it to show?


e: To be actually constructive here, I like the fact that there isn't a shitload of empty space to misclick on. And I couldn't care less about button order changing because I don't know what the current order is anyways. (seriously I think I last saw this in 2009)
Migui X'hyrrn
No More Dramas Only Llamas
#93 - 2013-05-10 14:30:10 UTC
If you need to use the rightclick in your overview you are doing it wrong.

Also, if you are targeting outside your overview, you are doing it wrong.
Smoking Blunts
ZC Omega
#94 - 2013-05-10 14:42:49 UTC
Rammix wrote:
The scan button is ok, objections about it sound stupid to me. You just click this button then move your mouse slightly to the left and click once more. If you don't use scanning window often then one additional and totally easy click can not be a problem. If you actively use scanning window you just have it open constantly. I see no problem at all.




adding an extra step into things you currently do with 1 click is an issue.

I open and close this window many times across many account daily, if im not using it there are better things to be on my screen, but if I want the scan I want it when I press the button. the short cut still works alt d, guess that's going to be the faster option now.

OMG when can i get a pic here

AutumnWind1983
Reboot Required
#95 - 2013-05-10 14:55:26 UTC
CCP Masheen wrote:
We're the same team that redesigned the targeting brackets


Is your team ready to admit that circles are terrible UI design yet? Its very straining on logi to see who's being hit because the rings in each circle blend together (is that fresh armor damage or just no shields) and its not easy to rapidly scan 10 locked targets in a horizontal fashion. It'd be a vast improvement if you iterated back to horizontal bars.

James Arget for CSM 8! http://csm.fcftw.org

CCP Fear
C C P
C C P Alliance
#96 - 2013-05-10 15:09:10 UTC
AutumnWind1983 wrote:
CCP Masheen wrote:
We're the same team that redesigned the targeting brackets


Is your team ready to admit that circles are terrible UI design yet? Its very straining on logi to see who's being hit because the rings in each circle blend together (is that fresh armor damage or just no shields) and its not easy to rapidly scan 10 locked targets in a horizontal fashion. It'd be a vast improvement if you iterated back to horizontal bars.


No.
AutumnWind1983
Reboot Required
#97 - 2013-05-10 15:33:48 UTC
CCP Fear wrote:
AutumnWind1983 wrote:
CCP Masheen wrote:
We're the same team that redesigned the targeting brackets


Is your team ready to admit that circles are terrible UI design yet? Its very straining on logi to see who's being hit because the rings in each circle blend together (is that fresh armor damage or just no shields) and its not easy to rapidly scan 10 locked targets in a horizontal fashion. It'd be a vast improvement if you iterated back to horizontal bars.


No.


Then I'd request that you spend more time using your UI while flying logi.

James Arget for CSM 8! http://csm.fcftw.org

Darius Shakor
Second Shakor Clan
#98 - 2013-05-10 15:35:46 UTC
CCP Masheen wrote:
Mizhir wrote:
Will it be possible to have the option to make it appear on rightclick instead of the old rightclick menu?


The right-click menu can accommodate thousands of combinations of options but the Radial menu cannot.

tl:dr No


Then how about giving us the option back to map it tom middle mouse click?

Darius Shakor - Kacha

Vandeamon Writing Project - EVE Works

Naren Vintas
Some Assembly Required.
#99 - 2013-05-10 16:06:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Naren Vintas
CCP Masheen wrote:
Shade Millith wrote:

I guess I'm just irritated (Really, really irritated. Day was already bad when I found out the Radial Menu change, making it go from bad to horrid) that I'm going to have to go back to basics once more, and relearn my muscle memory.

Is it possible to allow customization at all? I know you did that with the Neocom. For me, a strong Radial Menu would be the old one, with the current layout just flat out annoying. Just having 'Look At' underneath a submenu is bad enough.

If you want to make a stronger tool for pilots, allowing them to set what icons they need and where those icons are would be a good step forward.


Creating the interface to customize menu locations is not a small task and we don't have time to do that for Odyssey.


This is hardly a reason not to do something. Please. remember: We don't have to have that right away for Odyssey. Give us working Radial Menu now, but continue tweaking it as you go. I would love the option to personally customize buttons of Radial Menu, but I don't need to have it right away. Please do keep that in mind.



Anyhoo. More on Radial Menus.

1. Position of buttons on radial menus indeed seems to be mentioned a lot. I shall, however, be honest with you. I am astonished to know, that someone out there actually uses the current radial menu at all. Comparing the new and old button positions, I must say, that I, personally, prefer the new button layout, because it just feels more natural. But that is just personal opinion, and at that, not a one I can explain too well.

2. Method of bringing up the Radial Menu also seems to be a commonly discussed topic. To which, I see a possible solution, and one that sounds relatively easy to implement.
Simply speaking, give us three ways of bringing up the Radial Menu, of which all three can be toggled on and off from the Main Menu. The methods would be (two of which already implemented, just summarizing here):


  • Click'n'Delay - Simply speaking, exactly as it is now. You click it now, and after 0.25 seconds the Radial Menu pops out. Of course, the Delay should be adjustable.
  • Instant Action Key (modifier) - Something that also is already implemented, however not very well. Right now when you press the defined key AND click on an object, the menu pops out. This I imagine could be of use only if people either set long delay to Click'n'Delay, or turned it of at all.
  • (suggestion) Instant Action Key, Pop Up - Meaning that you only have to press that single key once, and the Radial Menu pops up. No additional clicking, no more delays. Just that.


Personally, I believe, that allowing us those three ways of accessing the Radial Menu would be enough, and giving us ability to enable and disable those methods at will, will make everyone happy. Yes, if someone wish it, let them disable Radial Menu at all. It is their choice.
Zerb Arus
WormSpaceWormS
#100 - 2013-05-10 16:07:43 UTC
Regarding the mouse-slowdown.
It doesnt slow down the mouse it delays (lags) the mouse.
Im running at ~60fps sometimes a little below with interval one.

ati 5770 (passive)
q9550s (passive)
8 gig ram
win 8
2560x1440 (fixed window)

I hope that helps.