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Returning character -- L4 Ships these days?
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Khinad Akashi
Virtual Light Systems
#1 - 2013-05-08 17:13:38 UTC
Returning after over 2 years away from EVE, slowly getting reacclimated to everything. My old main has ~40msp and I found myself sitting in a fit HAM legion upon login, and I have a few fit BS's still in hanger (a geddon, domi, abbadon). I was thinking about running L4s for a while to rebuild isk reserves...what's the state of L4s? So many ship changes, trying to parse though the notes now...but I figured it would be easier just to ask :)

L4's -- still viable (hisec) income? Still around 10m+/hr with a decent boat? I sit in .5 space for the mission hub
Any specific loads these days still viable - like a sentry domi or?
Any point in keeping the legion?

Thanks!
Havoc Zealot
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2013-05-08 17:24:19 UTC
Any marauder works well but in one word I would say, Macherial.
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#3 - 2013-05-08 17:28:10 UTC
10m/hour is a very conservative estimate. chances are, you will net somewhere between 30 and 50 if you know how to convert LP.
as for ships: all three are solid lvl4 ships if you run against the respective faction.
- the armageddon will be turned into a missile ship when odyssey hits but it will also become more expensive to build so you should hold onto it for a while.
- the dominix will lose its hybrid damage bonus for another drone bonus. sentries are now regularly switched on by rats, so you may want a remote repair module. also look into the new microjumpdrive.
- the abaddon right now has pretty severe cap problems. they will get addressed though as large laser turrets get a buff in odyssey. there will be a slight nerf to the ship's resistance bonus but it will still be a good mission ship.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Khinad Akashi
Virtual Light Systems
#4 - 2013-05-08 17:34:44 UTC
Havoc Zealot wrote:
Any marauder works well but in one word I would say, Macherial.



Only have about 2b sitting on the toon, not sure I want to blow it all on a mach right out of the box ;) Good to know they've become common though...damn things were insane expensive last time I was on.

Wish the HAM legion was useful, but it looks like it's more of an incursion ship now. Those sound interesting, but I'd have to hook up with a good incursion corp to make it all worth it. I may, but for now I just want to ease into the world of pew pew...and build up enough money to have some fun in nul later.
Khinad Akashi
Virtual Light Systems
#5 - 2013-05-08 17:35:56 UTC
Daniel Plain wrote:
10m/hour is a very conservative estimate. chances are, you will net somewhere between 30 and 50 if you know how to convert LP.
as for ships: all three are solid lvl4 ships if you run against the respective faction.
- the armageddon will be turned into a missile ship when odyssey hits but it will also become more expensive to build so you should hold onto it for a while.
- the dominix will lose its hybrid damage bonus for another drone bonus. sentries are now regularly switched on by rats, so you may want a remote repair module. also look into the new microjumpdrive.
- the abaddon right now has pretty severe cap problems. they will get addressed though as large laser turrets get a buff in odyssey. there will be a slight nerf to the ship's resistance bonus but it will still be a good mission ship.



Ah, very good to know. Reading up on the drone changes now -- I always used the domi as a RR+Sentry layout (afking essentially) so the changes may work out. The others I'll mothball for a while. Checking into LP conversion rates for the area now to see if it's worth sitting here or move. Believe the rats were Angels, hence the use of my Legion last time
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#6 - 2013-05-08 17:48:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Daniel Plain
if you have a 2bil budget and good projectile skills, machariel and vargur are top choices. they melt angels like ants and are more agile than the average battleship.
if you don't have T2 large projectiles, cruise missiles might be an option, they are also about to get a ~30% dps buff, so a navy raven or a typhoon may be a good idea.

edit: the HAM legion will deal OK with angels but only because of its resistance profile. a tengu is still a better HAM ship and still not the best mission ship by far.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Khinad Akashi
Virtual Light Systems
#7 - 2013-05-08 18:10:45 UTC
Daniel Plain wrote:
if you have a 2bil budget and good projectile skills, machariel and vargur are top choices. they melt angels like ants and are more agile than the average battleship.
if you don't have T2 large projectiles, cruise missiles might be an option, they are also about to get a ~30% dps buff, so a navy raven or a typhoon may be a good idea.

edit: the HAM legion will deal OK with angels but only because of its resistance profile. a tengu is still a better HAM ship and still not the best mission ship by far.



My T2 skills for guns suck for the most part, but missile/torp/cruise are all L5. I'll mess around with some simple fits to see what I can do these days with all the changes. A rattlesnake looks pretty sexy too :)
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-05-08 19:19:30 UTC
If you have tech 2 sentries I would highly recommend the dominix. Extremely cheap compared to most "go to" missioning boats and extraordinarily effective now with the MJD module

Art of Explosions
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#9 - 2013-05-08 19:53:23 UTC
Khinad Akashi wrote:
Returning after over 2 years away from EVE, slowly getting reacclimated to everything. My old main has ~40msp and I found myself sitting in a fit HAM legion upon login, and I have a few fit BS's still in hanger (a geddon, domi, abbadon). I was thinking about running L4s for a while to rebuild isk reserves...what's the state of L4s? So many ship changes, trying to parse though the notes now...but I figured it would be easier just to ask :)

L4's -- still viable (hisec) income? Still around 10m+/hr with a decent boat? I sit in .5 space for the mission hub
Any specific loads these days still viable - like a sentry domi or?
Any point in keeping the legion?

Thanks!


The Domi will be your best bet out of what you listed IMHO. A lot better than 10 mil an hour, 50 mil with one account isn't hard to get. If you can afford a navy domi even better. Machariel is my favorite, navi domi my 2nd. There are new drone modules, and the hybrids got rebalanced.

I wouldnt keep the Legion for level 4's, but I would certainly keep it. T3's are still great multipurpose ships.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#10 - 2013-05-08 22:32:52 UTC
Khinad Akashi wrote:
Daniel Plain wrote:
if you have a 2bil budget and good projectile skills, machariel and vargur are top choices. they melt angels like ants and are more agile than the average battleship.
if you don't have T2 large projectiles, cruise missiles might be an option, they are also about to get a ~30% dps buff, so a navy raven or a typhoon may be a good idea.

edit: the HAM legion will deal OK with angels but only because of its resistance profile. a tengu is still a better HAM ship and still not the best mission ship by far.



My T2 skills for guns suck for the most part, but missile/torp/cruise are all L5. I'll mess around with some simple fits to see what I can do these days with all the changes. A rattlesnake looks pretty sexy too :)


You don't need T2 guns to make a mach work. Meta 4's work pretty damn well. having both Bs to 4 and all gunnery skills to 4 is the place to start for the mach. A T2 fit shield tank that is cap stable running a 100mn ab is perfect, for me anyway. X-l SB for pulsing when needed. I hardly ever need the light drones I carry. 4 gyro's and 3 TYE's in the lows.. and you all set.. for way less than 2 bil..
RS with T2 sentries and some torps makes for a very fun ship to fly. Fit active tank with 3 x drone damage rigs and 3 bcs's. When you happy with its performance can replace some tank with omni's and you will need drone links in the highs as the drones will be your long range weapons.
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#11 - 2013-05-09 00:22:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Cipher Jones
Cage Man wrote:
Khinad Akashi wrote:
Daniel Plain wrote:
if you have a 2bil budget and good projectile skills, machariel and vargur are top choices. they melt angels like ants and are more agile than the average battleship.
if you don't have T2 large projectiles, cruise missiles might be an option, they are also about to get a ~30% dps buff, so a navy raven or a typhoon may be a good idea.

edit: the HAM legion will deal OK with angels but only because of its resistance profile. a tengu is still a better HAM ship and still not the best mission ship by far.



My T2 skills for guns suck for the most part, but missile/torp/cruise are all L5. I'll mess around with some simple fits to see what I can do these days with all the changes. A rattlesnake looks pretty sexy too :)


You don't need T2 guns to make a mach work. Meta 4's work pretty damn well. having both Bs to 4 and all gunnery skills to 4 is the place to start for the mach. A T2 fit shield tank that is cap stable running a 100mn ab is perfect, for me anyway. X-l SB for pulsing when needed. I hardly ever need the light drones I carry. 4 gyro's and 3 TYE's in the lows.. and you all set.. for way less than 2 bil..
RS with T2 sentries and some torps makes for a very fun ship to fly. Fit active tank with 3 x drone damage rigs and 3 bcs's. When you happy with its performance can replace some tank with omni's and you will need drone links in the highs as the drones will be your long range weapons.


I had the republic fleet bling fit for incursions on the mach, sold it for t1. Remember for missions, you have to be able to kill things in one less volley to decrease your mission time and increase your isk/hour. For example 950 DPS in a mach will finish missions at the same pace as 1150. I find that sentries make the difference. I run wardens most of the time, everything but sanshas. They are sudering and that big, also long range. So when rats are in the range where your guns are half assing, they are hitting full damage. whrn your wardens are half assing (due to close range), the guns are slamming full force gibson.

Cap stable isn't needed by a long shot, however get as much cap and tank as you can at first. You dont want to lose your hull.
I only have 3:20 of cap with no MWD, like 50 seconds with MWD. I only run an AB or MWD on missions where it makes a difference, and most missions where it makes a difference are low isk/hr and i decline.

Oh yeah, the ammo has to be fleet though if not using t2 guns.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
B0XzZ
Pulse Heavy Industries
#12 - 2013-05-09 01:24:10 UTC
A Navy Geddon with pulses is a solid lvl 4 runner. Of course against Therm/EM weak factions/

Tengu is just win in PVE though if you want diversity.
Marc Callan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2013-05-09 02:11:43 UTC
Actually, the 'Geddon is about to become a drone battleship, with either guns or missiles as secondary armament. It'll be basically something like a cross between a Dominix and a Bhaalgorn (its other bonus will be to neut/NOS range). With sentries, long-range NOS to help fuel the tank, and your choice of high-slot weapons, the Armageddon could be a beautiful mission boat come June.

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." - Kurt Vonnegurt
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2013-05-09 18:49:34 UTC
Marc Callan wrote:
Actually, the 'Geddon is about to become a drone battleship, with either guns or missiles as secondary armament. It'll be basically something like a cross between a Dominix and a Bhaalgorn (its other bonus will be to neut/NOS range). With sentries, long-range NOS to help fuel the tank, and your choice of high-slot weapons, the Armageddon could be a beautiful mission boat come June.


domi with 2 free no-stacking penalty omnis will be king imo :p

Art of Explosions
Dato Koppla
Spaghetti Militia
#15 - 2013-05-09 23:11:51 UTC
NOS doesn't work properly on NPCs and even if it did it would only work when your cap is lower than theirs which won't be often. NOS are generally broken on everything above the frigate level.

Domis are going to be insanely good mission runners post patch (they already are but are very skill intensive, the patch will ease it up a little as you only need drone skills primarily). Out of the ships OP listed I'd go with Domi, Geddon has wasted bonus and Baddon is locked into certain damage type, HAM legion severely lacks range.
sabre906
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2013-05-10 00:38:04 UTC
Dato Koppla wrote:
NOS doesn't work properly on NPCs and even if it did it would only work when your cap is lower than theirs which won't be often. NOS are generally broken on everything above the frigate level.

Domis are going to be insanely good mission runners post patch (they already are but are very skill intensive, the patch will ease it up a little as you only need drone skills primarily). Out of the ships OP listed I'd go with Domi, Geddon has wasted bonus and Baddon is locked into certain damage type, HAM legion severely lacks range.


Rats have unlimited cap. Nos will always work.
Osiris Andras
Intergalactic Space Maoris
#17 - 2013-05-10 04:50:38 UTC
sabre906 wrote:
Dato Koppla wrote:
NOS doesn't work properly on NPCs and even if it did it would only work when your cap is lower than theirs which won't be often. NOS are generally broken on everything above the frigate level.

Domis are going to be insanely good mission runners post patch (they already are but are very skill intensive, the patch will ease it up a little as you only need drone skills primarily). Out of the ships OP listed I'd go with Domi, Geddon has wasted bonus and Baddon is locked into certain damage type, HAM legion severely lacks range.


Rats have unlimited cap. Nos will always work.


Really?

If OP had good laser skills I'd have suggested a NApoc. Can't really offer advice on missile-based hulls