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Going Low/null

Author
Nometh Xergent
#1 - 2013-05-06 08:21:12 UTC
Hello. I have a simple question, i have just started some lowsec exploration and roaming with friends.
And i see alot of Cynabals often and some random ships who don't get *aggro* by other platers randomly.
It seems to me, the higher wealthier ships you fly, the safer you are for bringing attraction but still "scare" people off".
But i dont know.

Question:
- To witch point does people stop attacking your ship while roaming in low/null?

“I’ve always loathed the necessity of sleep. Like death, it puts even the most powerful men on their backs.”

Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#2 - 2013-05-06 08:50:19 UTC
Doesn't really work like that. Individuals in low may not choose to engage a solowtfpwnboat but gangs certainly will. There are dead titans on killboards in lowsec.

Depending on what part of the process you are in, you can be fairly tricky to find (require combat probing), as an explorer, hence you might get periods of being left alone if you are not in a public sig.

different TZs have different populations, ie both different people, and different numbers, and that means a system that is quiet for you in your TZ might be rather messy for me in my TZ too.
Nometh Xergent
#3 - 2013-05-06 09:17:33 UTC
Allright. So i mean.. If i want to roam around some in solo (not pvp:ing) But exploring low
Where's/how's a good way to start?

“I’ve always loathed the necessity of sleep. Like death, it puts even the most powerful men on their backs.”

Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#4 - 2013-05-06 09:29:50 UTC
There is no such thing as "too big/shiny to engage", in fact it is just an opposite: bling gets ganked because it is worth the effort, cheap stuff mostly when they are targets of opportunity (like t1 BC sitting at top belt like a moron with probes out).

Good start is basically nearest lowsec gate but don't be sto0pid like most of fails, use map statistics (number of jumps/pilots in space/pilots docked/ships exploded/pods exploded, etc) and evaluate if traffic is low enough for you to jump in. And/or use cheap frigs to scout other side of gate. Or ask your corpies for intel and/or assist if you are in player corp.

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Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#5 - 2013-05-06 13:18:39 UTC
Nometh Xergent wrote:
Allright. So i mean.. If i want to roam around some in solo (not pvp:ing) But exploring low
Where's/how's a good way to start?


covops with covops cloak if you want to look behind the camp at all the empty systems - covops that is just flying around, and only drops probes from a safespot is unlikely to ever die.

To be honest, frigates usually make it through small camps, and mwd/cloak trick will often get a bigger ship through - though I hate trying to use it from australia.


Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#6 - 2013-05-06 19:41:05 UTC
Pirates will generally shoot anything including shuttles and noob ships. Most faction warriors will only shoot apposing factions. If there is a group of you get one to scout and do the scanning in something cloacky, T3 work nicely as they can be setup to be immune to bubbles.
Pilgrim also works nicely as a scout and can with its drones can contribute to dps a little. Let the scout do all the hacking etc. The rest whatever you prepared to loose :). Cruisers are nice as they are fairly quick to warp.
Depending on how many of you there are.. you could go pvp fit with 2 T1 logi, that way you can do sites and do pvp if needed.
Keenky
Royal Amarr Expeditions
#7 - 2013-05-07 08:50:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Keenky
Nometh Xergent wrote:

Question:
- To witch point does people stop attacking your ship while roaming in low/null?


At the point when they would risk to lose a battle. In the common terms that means if your numbers are bigger then theirs.

Size of ship or value doesn't matter much. A few frigs can take out everything below titan and mother ship. So flying e.g. a dreadnought with max skills wont let you much chance versus 10 frigs. Even if they cant take the dreadnought out by DPS, they are able to pin him down until something or enough show up to take him out. If you dont have the support of many other players you are being outnumbered, ganked and killed.

Flying big ships don't gives you any protection. If you want to avoid being ganked in low or null the only valid way is to be well informed, quick, and careful. In low it is "relatively" save, as long as you mind that somebody showing up in local might be especially after you (over 90% - nobody but explorers and pewpew guys are in low). If somebody already is in system when you enter, don't start with combat sites. Radars and mags will despawn if somebody tries to wait for you there. Combat sites are the usually point where gankers wait for you cloaked, especially those sites where the rats scram and web.

In null its more difficult. In the main playing times you will find a blobbed gate about every 6-10 gates, as the gates don't have any protection there and warping can be easily blocked. Mind that you fly into a prepared trap at ANY gate. So only fly around at times when the most kiddy gankers are in bed. Then you only have the really dangerous multiple PC/Account blobgankers about every 10th-20th gate. Those are fewer, but more dangerous since the use tactics that wouldn't leave you any chance to escape.

Avoid being attacked? No chance cause everybody in low or null is there just for one reason: pewpew. Or tough enough to go exploring there.

If i may suggest:
-) go and scout the systems during those times, when nearly nobody is there: Right after downtime, and times when you notice few players online - i use an own scripted alarm when users drop below a certain number.
-) set around ALL gates in the systems you are traveling through frequently safe spots and multiple 500km off-grid points of every gate. Never warp directly to any point, that any other player also might have. Once you have multiple random safe spots central in system and at least 2 safe spots at any gate (each of them 500 - 1000km) off the grid of the gate, you have built your base for exploration. That is of course in all the systems you are planning to explore. It is a lot of work, but this will help you to avoid losing ships.
-) If you are in lowsec and want to use stations, mind that all stations are 100% full of station gankers. They wait for you when you leave station and then you are done. EXCEPT you have a safe spot in exactly that direction you are facing when you leave the station and can warp to blindly something between 500 and 5000 km randomly, never the same distance, else they will learn and wait for you there).
-) The more you know about the systems you are about to explore and about the pewpew mouthbreathers that fly around there, the better for you. Always intel and recon with EVERY possible option - or you are an easy to calculate and easy to find victim.
-) Mind that especially the border lines from low to null are under heavy encampment at ANY time as well as the next few systems (3-5) around the border lines. The mostly harmless low toons of the PVP gimps are on the lowsec side near gate to nullsec cloaked and deliver every desired information about you, that you are not hiding. Entering then the nullsec will end up in a bunch of those mouthbreathers after you and the usual tactics like bubbles 100km behind gate (just to win a few seconds in which your ship needs to turn towards) and often enough stasis elements and tons of drones to decloak you. No safespots set = low chance for you to escape.
-) Also dont fly always the same paths. Change them. If you fly into a certain system and come back like every third day you start to be an easy to calculate target. Dont make yourself an easy target. Change your habbits, safespots and times and so on. Dont fly 3 jumps to there and back the same way. If you have found pretties dont take the way through gates back. Mark every WH you find and safe the loc so you dont need to scan for one when you need one. The best way to low/null is through a WH you found in highsec. But mind that you dont have safe spots then while traveling. This bears some risk.

And most important:
YOU WILL LOSE SHIPS. You cant exclude that.
BE A PRO IN AVOIDING MOANING MOUTHBREATHING PVPers. Never fight back. Be quick, informed and alerted at any time.
KNOW AGRO MECHANICS. KNOW THE EXPLOITS TO LURE YOU INTO COMBAT. It is an art to avoid PVP when everybody else around you just wants to kill you.
Dyphorus
Inritus Astrum
#8 - 2013-05-07 17:02:13 UTC
Nometh Xergent wrote:

Question:
- To witch point does people stop attacking your ship while roaming in low/null?



If you're there, someone will shoot you. Some people like to hunt specifically for shiney KMs. Others like easy fights. The rest will shoot anything that moves Big smile
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2013-05-07 17:06:44 UTC
make an alt and put it in the same corp as you, give it a cloak and a noobship and sit it in wherever you are. Everyone will think it's a falcon alt and anything less than 3 people won't bother with you.
sabre906
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2013-05-07 19:54:00 UTC
Cynnabals have that gtfo speed. Ppl weren't "scared off" by it, they just don't want to bother wasting their time.
Sven Viko VIkolander
In space we are briefly free
#11 - 2013-05-07 19:55:45 UTC
The simple rule is: the less time you spend on gates, the less often you will die. Virtually all low-sec pvp outside of FW and fleet engagements happens on gates, and if you die as in low sec as an explorer it will usually be on a gate. Stations, too, can be dangerous spots, but less so than gates and easier to avoid (unless you are in special stations or there are instant lockers waiting for you). For everywhere else (e.g. in mission rooms and plexes or safe spots) you have d-scan.
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2013-05-07 20:13:55 UTC
I took a quick glance at the thread and I think one thing that is left worth adding is a suggestion to use any mapping site/tool you prefer to do "API scouting" for low activity systems/constellations. It doesn't guarantee anything of course, but it can sometimes answer the "where to start" question in case you don't have scout alts/friends available.
Turelus
Utassi Security
#13 - 2013-05-08 17:58:07 UTC
Most of the other answers here have been pretty good and there isn't much I can say to expand on them but I will add a little plug for my coalition as it might interest you.

If you're interested in exploring a little deeper and into NullSec, Providence (region) might work well for you.
The alliances there all hold the space under NRDS (Not Red Don't Shoot) meaning as long as you're not aggressive to other players you're welcome to to rat/explore/mine all you like.

You can find some more information here: http://www.cva-eve.org/index.php?page=faq
You're also welcome to join The Fourth District's public channel and speak to someone there, our channel name is 4THCOM

Turelus CEO Utassi Security

Keenky
Royal Amarr Expeditions
#14 - 2013-05-09 15:15:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Keenky
Turelus wrote:
Most of the other answers here have been pretty good and there isn't much I can say to expand on them but I will add a little plug for my coalition as it might interest you.

If you're interested in exploring a little deeper and into NullSec, Providence (region) might work well for you.
The alliances there all hold the space under NRDS (Not Red Don't Shoot) meaning as long as you're not aggressive to other players you're welcome to to rat/explore/mine all you like.

You can find some more information here: http://www.cva-eve.org/index.php?page=faq
You're also welcome to join The Fourth District's public channel and speak to someone there, our channel name is 4THCOM


Sorry to say so: But in low and null there is never ever somebody trustworthy enough that he doesnt attack you. Never. The first step on the path to lose your ship and prey in bay is to "believe" that somebody will not attack securely.

In fact one of the most basic tricks starts with a simple "o/" in local.

a.) players wants to calm you, win your trust and then kills you on the very first possibility.
b.) he tries to show, that he is just another harmless player and lures into a dialogue. Just to cost you time. While that his buddies in his fleet/corp prepare a trap especially for you.

DONT TRUST ANYONE.

A toon with high sec status, who is friendly and non agressive and in low or null, is only a bait to lure you into a trusting state or a trap. The chance that he is really that much of a beginenr and just appears in the same system in which you are exploring, is lower than to crash 10 times in a sequence with a plane and survive each time. It is ZERO.

Just mind, that everybody in low and null sec is there for PvP.
Ships are expensive. For you and for your oponent.
So you dont risk much at all as a PVPer. Only battle when you are absolutely sure to win.
Means: you have to have enough support in background, in the ideal situation the support is not visible to your opponent.

Explorers barely fly in fleets. No player will wait the long time until you have found something valuable. So Explorers and Miners are the most interesting targets for small gangs. As they know where you are going to (signatures) they recon all possible signatures in an area of space, sometimes they do that in ongoing process while they control, if in the systems they have marked for hunting, is an explorer. Summary: you are an easy to calcluate target, with not much of support, fly expensive ships, mostly not fitted for PvP and they can easily find out where you are flying to (signatures with highest value first, to be the fastest).

PvPers are professionals in HUNTING YOU.
Explorers must be professionals in avoiding PVP.

There is no other option.
Lands Alot
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#15 - 2013-05-14 09:43:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Lands Alot
Turelus wrote:
Most of the other answers here have been pretty good and there isn't much I can say to expand on them but I will add a little plug for my coalition as it might interest you.

If you're interested in exploring a little deeper and into NullSec, Providence (region) might work well for you.
The alliances there all hold the space under NRDS (Not Red Don't Shoot) meaning as long as you're not aggressive to other players you're welcome to to rat/explore/mine all you like.

You can find some more information here: http://www.cva-eve.org/index.php?page=faq
You're also welcome to join The Fourth District's public channel and speak to someone there, our channel name is 4THCOM



I like what you have to say here, but the 4THCOM channel that I tried to join this morning required an invite.

Nvm, worked fine, Its the Intel channel that was invite only, as should be expected.
Turelus
Utassi Security
#16 - 2013-05-14 20:31:04 UTC
Keenky wrote:

Sorry to say so: But in low and null there is never ever somebody trustworthy enough that he doesnt attack you. Never. The first step on the path to lose your ship and prey in bay is to "believe" that somebody will not attack securely.


You might want to have a closer look into Providence and the links I put forward. NRDS is upheld in Providence and it has been a successful endeavour that allows players who want to use NullSec space the chance to do so without being forced to fight if they don't want to. I can't say the space (Providence) is 100% safe as there are hostile entities which roam it and attack people. The holding alliances and the Providence Coalition strictly follow NRDS though and will not kill neutrals who do not appear on the KOS listings.

The Fourth District also holds Anti-Pirate policies meaning we don't attacks neutrals in LowSec either. There are still entities out there who are not pirates wanting to get on every killmail possible.

I'll make this my last post as I have somewhat taken this thread off topic.
To the OP I am glad that you found Providence to your liking and even more happy to see you're now a member of 4TH. Smile

Turelus CEO Utassi Security