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New Freighter

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Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#21 - 2013-05-07 10:30:14 UTC
Paikis wrote:
You do realise that a Jump Freighter is 6-7billion ISK right?


You do realise that they're not that much now?

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Alphaphi
KASK Heavy logistics
#22 - 2013-05-07 10:58:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Alphaphi
Fluffi Flaffi wrote:
Alphaphi wrote:
i know why people are refering to the orca when people say they want a small freighter, becuase the orca has the cargo to fill the gap between industrials and Freighters and benefit from the same aligntime and warp speed like industrials compared to the very slow freighters. On the other side it costs half a freighter


corrected for you.
And this is why Orca is more effecient, because I can travel 3-4 times the same way like a freighter can do and therefore haul easily 300k m3 at the same time, even when I can't afford a freighter skill and costwise!
.


hmmm... are you trying to say that the orca is on par with a industrial in speeds?
let me see

Orca, all skills at 5, with nomads and evasive manoeuvring implant:

Speed 62m/sec, 25.7 sec align.
max cargo achievable in a single cargohold: 92714 and then comes the 40k maintenance bay.
you know, this means that you can't haul anything larger than 92k. while your total carry space may be 130k
which means if you want to use it as a commercial freighter to bring any money back, you're forced to pick courier contracts below 92k and small contracts will earn you crap.
so please enlighten me how you ''easily can haul 300k at the same time'' in a single orca.


my beloved fenrir, with nomads and evasive manoeuvring implant:

speed 125m/sec, 24sec align.

so don't come here and say that the orca has the same effing align speed as a ordinary industrial or in any way are 4-5x faster than a freighter, if you want to reduce the aligns peed below a fenrirs, you have to fit nanos or inertias which reduces your cargo, which instantaneously negates everything you did to make it a ''gap closer''
as well a orca costs 650-700mil a pop, while a fenrir costs 1,2bil a pop so the gap is not that big, when you actually fly effectively around in any of those ships.


the orca is not a effective ''gap'' as the actual cost gap between the skillbook and the actual ship are far from huge.
there's also the fact that the orca needs a different skillbook
you get inferior align, speeds and cargo (and your beloved high-cargo is split up in different bays) in the orca.
frankly you are paying

The wish for a ''medium freighter'' doesn't purely come from greed and prices and the wish to move more stuff.
it's a wish because WE WANT TO MOVE ITEMS THATS LARGER.

i am not coming to ask anything to be easier, because i already have a orca, freighter and rorqual.
as a pilot that owns a orca, fenrir and rorqual, and use all of those ships often, i can say that it would benefit the game to have a ''medium freighter'' that have slightly better agility, better warp speed and less tank at the exchange of 500k cargo, so we would be stuck with 300-350.

we sometimes have to move some stuff fairly quick, but it's more than 92k in volume (or very few items at high volume), and yet still below the half of a normal freighters, the only solution is to use a freighter.

a medium freighter would have the job of moving high volume items that doesn't fit in a orca quicker, faster than a freighter.
the freighter would still have it's role to haul massive amounts, or very large items.


The orcas original role was to be a command ship boosting a fleet and hauling ore back to station, NOT being a ''mini freighter'' (albeit not being that good at it in the first place).
Fluffi Flaffi
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#23 - 2013-05-07 11:28:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Fluffi Flaffi
First the most important info to your try of arguments: LOL

Alphaphi wrote:


1) hmmm... are you trying to say that the orca is on par with a industrial in speeds?

2) max cargo achievable in a single cargohold: 92714 and then comes the 40k maintenance bay.
you know, this means that you can't haul anything larger than 92k. while your total carry space may be 130k
which means if you want to use it as a commercial freighter to bring any money back, you're forced to pick courier contracts below 92k and small contracts will earn you crap.

3) so please enlighten me how you ''easily can haul 300k at the same time'' in a single orca.

4) as well a orca costs 650-700mil a pop, while a fenrir costs 1,2bil a pop so the gap is not that big, when you actually fly effectively around in any of those ships.

5) I am not coming to ask anything to be easier

6) we sometimes have to move some stuff fairly quick, but it's more than 92k in volume (or very few items at high volume), and yet still below the half of a normal freighters, the only solution is to use a freighter.



1) My orca warps at 2.7 AU (nearly industrial) and has an align time of 10 seconds. That's much closer to T1 industrials then to Freighters. If you don't know how to do this --> wtf are you doing in the courier business?

2) Courier contracts is a small part of Eve. To small to count and if you have one contract of 120k then try to find some others, so the travel is worth the effort. You said you don't want it easier? Oh yes you do. That's the only reason why you are asking for a new ship! The only reason! Despite Courier Contracts, what is bigger than 92k m3? Ships you say? Oh wait, Orca has a ship hangar, which allows him to carre ships up to Battlecruiser Class. Idea

3) Read and understand. Don't try to look silly, when you are not silly. "At the same time when you fly the same amount with a freighter". This means I have 300k m3 of xyz. you can go 1x with a freighter or ship 3x 100k with the orca.

4) You are a genius! comparing 2012 sales price of the orca with the current buy price of the Fenrir Roll and believing everybody would just take your information as true. cost price Orca = 550M ISK rounded up! cost price Fenrir 1.1B ISK rounded up. That's exactly half at the moment. Don't try to make a fool of us! Evil

5) Please see point 2! That's the only point and reason why you post here. Otherwise you would work with the instruments you already have! Don't try to make a fool of us! Evil

6) and where is the problem? In earlier times when I started with Eve I couldn't solo Level 4s. The only solution was to ask corpmates? You know what. Sometimes I can't win against a fleet of 20 people in lowsec hunting me. The only solution is to run and hide if I don't want to loose my ship! That's the game!

Alphaphi wrote:
The orcas original role was to be a command ship boosting a fleet and hauling ore back to station, NOT being a ''mini freighter'' (albeit not being that good at it in the first place).


This is is primary role, not the original role! Full Stop.

But you gave me another idea: Hey CCP, sometimes I carry little stuff in my combat frigate but have to change the fitting for cargo expanders. I don't want to refit every time. I can not afford a Crane and T1 industrials are too slow. Please give give me a hauling frigate. I need this for sure! NOW. But please don't think I want this game easier! No, no nono!!!

That makes sense in some way, doesn't it? But is it reasonable? NO.

Even though my name could imply this, but EVE is not a Fluffy world.
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#24 - 2013-05-07 11:37:01 UTC
Andrew Tsero wrote:
Being that I haul anything anywhere We could really use a smaller straight freighter in the 300,000 m3 class. it would be between the DST/BR t2 ships and the 700,000 m3 freighters we have now. I really believe it would be an improvement to the Industry of hauling freight.
I don't want a 300,000 m3 freighter... I want one that is modular. Start at 100,000 m3 and allow fittings to expand it to 700,000 m3 or make it a heavy tanked 100,000 m3 based on the players needs at the time. Give the players the opportunity to choose what they want... and to screw it up.
Fluffi Flaffi
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#25 - 2013-05-07 11:43:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Fluffi Flaffi
Bi-Mi Lansatha wrote:
Andrew Tsero wrote:
Being that I haul anything anywhere We could really use a smaller straight freighter in the 300,000 m3 class. it would be between the DST/BR t2 ships and the 700,000 m3 freighters we have now. I really believe it would be an improvement to the Industry of hauling freight.
I don't want a 300,000 m3 freighter... I want one that is modular. Start at 100,000 m3 and allow fittings to expand it to 700,000 m3 or make it a heavy tanked 100,000 m3 based on the players needs at the time. Give the players the opportunity to choose what they want... and to screw it up.


CCP, please also add following modules:

- a 1000m3 drone bay and bandwith of 125.
- 15 Turret slots for Large weapons, so I can "counter the rats" or 30 launcher slots because missiles are weaker than guns at the moment according to the forum.
- Please also add jump drive without fuel cost, because I don't have money for fuel. It will destroy my margin completely.
- please add 500% to Shield Boost Amount per skill level
- Please allow Covert Ops Cloaking Device with Covert Ops Cyno, which can be used in HiSec so I could be protected when attacked while haven 50 Billion of ISK in my cargohold
- Align time of a shuttle and speed of an interceptor is self explaining

Did I forget anything?

This post could contain sarcasm, but I'm not quite sure.


BTW: The Orca is modular in a way you are asking.
Tank vs. cargohold
Speed vs. Cargohold

But it does not has the bandwith what you are asking. Your request would make freighters obsolete by the way.
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#26 - 2013-05-07 12:17:06 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Paikis wrote:
You do realise that a Jump Freighter is 6-7billion ISK right?


You do realise that they're not that much now?


Anshar - 6.4b
Rhea - 6.3b
Nomad - 6.2b
Ark - 6.3b

Now, I do in fact own a Jump Freighter, an Anshar to be precise. I use it a fair bit, but I use it for the jump drive. If I was looking for a faster freighter in High Sec, I would not be willing to drop 6.4b on the hull.

I see no reason why Light Freighters can't be added. They don't even need a new ship model (although it would be cool), just use the existing models.

Give them half the cargo bay, twice the speed, half the align time and maybe 60% of the tank and call it done.
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#27 - 2013-05-07 12:25:04 UTC
The last time I saw this topic, by far the best suggestion was to double or triple the capacity for the DST's. that would fill the gap very well.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

Fluffi Flaffi
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#28 - 2013-05-07 12:43:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Fluffi Flaffi
FT Diomedes wrote:
The last time I saw this topic, by far the best suggestion was to double or triple the capacity for the DST's. that would fill the gap very well.


I like it and I would support this idea as well, because at the moments DST are mainly useless for their cost compared to alternativities! Additional cargo space is not big enough and preinstalled "Warp Core Stabs" can't protect you well enough.
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2013-05-07 12:46:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Bi-Mi Lansatha
Fluffi Flaffi wrote:
...stuff... bizarre stuff actually.

...But it does not has the bandwith what you are asking. Your request would make freighters obsolete by the way.
I don't recall asking for a bandwidth.

CCP seems to want to change T1s to give players choices... large cargo, tanked or speed (?). Why is it good for T1s but not freighters?
Chi'Nane T'Kal
Interminatus
#30 - 2013-05-07 12:50:32 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
Paikis wrote:
You do realise that a Jump Freighter is 6-7billion ISK right?


It's not that bad if you look at how amazing they are.

-Liang


Only if you have use for the jump drive.
If you don't, they are just expensive undersized freighters.


The OP's request was most likely for something less expensive - and supposedly more agile - than freighters, to fill the really big hole there is between the largest industrials (44k m^3) and freighters.
Chi'Nane T'Kal
Interminatus
#31 - 2013-05-07 12:55:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Chi'Nane T'Kal
Malcanis wrote:
Paikis wrote:
You do realise that a Jump Freighter is 6-7billion ISK right?


You do realise that they're not that much now?


Should have read the thread to the end. Prices have been given above and they're ALL within that range.
Alphaphi
KASK Heavy logistics
#32 - 2013-05-07 13:03:00 UTC
Fluffi Flaffi wrote:
First the most important info to your try of arguments: LOL

Alphaphi wrote:


1) hmmm... are you trying to say that the orca is on par with a industrial in speeds?

2) max cargo achievable in a single cargohold: 92714 and then comes the 40k maintenance bay.
you know, this means that you can't haul anything larger than 92k. while your total carry space may be 130k
which means if you want to use it as a commercial freighter to bring any money back, you're forced to pick courier contracts below 92k and small contracts will earn you crap.

3) so please enlighten me how you ''easily can haul 300k at the same time'' in a single orca.

4) as well a orca costs 650-700mil a pop, while a fenrir costs 1,2bil a pop so the gap is not that big, when you actually fly effectively around in any of those ships.

5) I am not coming to ask anything to be easier

6) we sometimes have to move some stuff fairly quick, but it's more than 92k in volume (or very few items at high volume), and yet still below the half of a normal freighters, the only solution is to use a freighter.



1) My orca warps at 2.7 AU (nearly industrial) and has an align time of 10 seconds. That's much closer to T1 industrials then to Freighters. If you don't know how to do this --> wtf are you doing in the courier business?

2) Courier contracts is a small part of Eve. To small to count and if you have one contract of 120k then try to find some others, so the travel is worth the effort. You said you don't want it easier? Oh yes you do. That's the only reason why you are asking for a new ship! The only reason! Despite Courier Contracts, what is bigger than 92k m3? Ships you say? Oh wait, Orca has a ship hangar, which allows him to carre ships up to Battlecruiser Class. Idea

3) Read and understand. Don't try to look silly, when you are not silly. "At the same time when you fly the same amount with a freighter". This means I have 300k m3 of xyz. you can go 1x with a freighter or ship 3x 100k with the orca.

4) You are a genius! comparing 2012 sales price of the orca with the current buy price of the Fenrir Roll and believing everybody would just take your information as true. cost price Orca = 550M ISK rounded up! cost price Fenrir 1.1B ISK rounded up. That's exactly half at the moment. Don't try to make a fool of us! Evil

5) Please see point 2! That's the only point and reason why you post here. Otherwise you would work with the instruments you already have! Don't try to make a fool of us! Evil

6) and where is the problem? In earlier times when I started with Eve I couldn't solo Level 4s. The only solution was to ask corpmates? You know what. Sometimes I can't win against a fleet of 20 people in lowsec hunting me. The only solution is to run and hide if I don't want to loose my ship! That's the game!

Alphaphi wrote:
The orcas original role was to be a command ship boosting a fleet and hauling ore back to station, NOT being a ''mini freighter'' (albeit not being that good at it in the first place).


This is is primary role, not the original role! Full Stop.

Even though my name could imply this, but EVE is not a Fluffy world.


1. i never mentioned anything about warp speed, at all. but please enlighten me how you reach a alignspeed on 10 seconds, because a orca with 2x inertia stabs, nomad implants and evasive manoeuvring hardwire have 17 seconds of align on paper (25 without inertia stabs).

2. do i want to make it easier for ME? no not at all, i have my freighter, but i can see the point of having a proper stepping stone for other players.

3.
Quote:
because I can travel 3-4 times the same way like a freighter can do and therefore haul easily 300k m3 at the same time
i read it, and i comprehended and understood, unless ''at the same time'' suddenly means moving items over several runs.

4. i took those prices DIRECTLY FROM EVE-CENTRAL which is the current prices, actually i was a bit wrong, fenrirs sell for 1.3bil. the cheapest orca are set at 510mil which is A SINGLE orca, and the rest sell for a MINIMUM of 638mil (ok so it's pretty much the double dependant on which of the prices you base the statement on).

5. i work with the instruments i have, but again i have been at ''stepping stone'' point as well, and a orca just doesn't cut it when you have to move, lets say for example more than a single packaged battleship, or if you are in to production as well, your whole production run(s). i don't personally need it anymore, but there's a lot of people out there who does.


about the orcas role:
i say ORIGINAL ROLE even though i know it's a boosting ship by heart and description, i still see it being used more as a ''mini freighter''. there's probably 5-10 orcas being used as a freighter per orca used as a booster.

Quote:
But you gave me another idea: Hey CCP, sometimes I carry little stuff in my combat frigate but have to change the fitting for cargo expanders. I don't want to refit every time. I can not afford a Crane and T1 industrials are too slow. Please give give me a hauling frigate. I need this for sure! NOW. But please don't think I want this game easier! No, no nono!!!


you're just being silly now.
my point is that the orca, a ship not designed to do freighting, but boosting and hauling ore from a belt to station are outperforming the ships specifically designed for this.
which is why there is either a need for a ''stepping stone'' for actual industrial ships on par with the orca in price but specialised for the purpose or a change to the orca
Fluffi Flaffi
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#33 - 2013-05-07 13:51:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Fluffi Flaffi
Alphaphi wrote:
Quote:
But you gave me another idea: Hey CCP, sometimes I carry little stuff in my combat frigate but have to change the fitting for cargo expanders. I don't want to refit every time. I can not afford a Crane and T1 industrials are too slow. Please give give me a hauling frigate. I need this for sure! NOW. But please don't think I want this game easier! No, no nono!!!


you're just being silly now.


Sarcastic OK, but I was not silly at that moment!

And now please answer one question, which I find quite good to counter as an example for all your Assumptions and opinions, which are still wrong from my point of view, doesn't matter what you write.

Alphaphi wrote:
my point is that the orca, a ship not designed to do freighting, but boosting and hauling ore from a belt to station are outperforming the ships specifically designed for this.
which is why there is either a need for a ''stepping stone'' for actual industrial ships on par with the orca in price but specialised for the purpose or a change to the orca


If the ship was not designed o do freighting? Why did CCP gave them a big cargo hangar of above 90k m3? Why not just a 40k Corporate Hangar, an 90k Ore Hangar (dep. on skill level) and a 2k cargo hangar? This would have made btw. anything much more easier for the job of being a mining director? Blink

Why did CCP made the Corporate Hangar unscannable? To protect the ore? HAHA Lol They changed this now in favour of Blockade Runners to give them a usage next to low-sec travelling. But why did they so when they designed the Orca?

Why can you tank an Orca higher than a freighter? To protect ore worth a 20 or 30M ISK? HAHA. Lol

For sure there is a need for a "stepping stone" from people like you, who would like to have it easier. I would buy me such a ship as well. No doubt! But is there really a need overall? No. Freighting system is working very well at the moment. Nothing needs to be changed. Your proposal will just make it easier without any positive effects on the gameplay overall (at least I can not see one).

The next step would be to ask for a Superfreighter wich 2.000.000m3 and then for one with 5.000.000m3. You will call me silly now again maybe, but for me this would make the things a lot easier. Don't need my 2 hauling alts to move my stuff from and to the trade hub in several runs. I would just need 1 alt in a ship with 5.000.000m3 and I am for sure not the only one and price wouldn't be an issue!

I don't care if you tried to manipulate us and therefore doesn't mention warpspeed, but you have to face the fact, that the Orca warps more than 3times faster than a Freighter!
quoOoup
#34 - 2013-05-07 13:54:56 UTC  |  Edited by: quoOoup
There is no reason and no use for a new 'smaller' Freighter. Just don't get out of patience! This is how the game works.

1. First of all - for me - the Orca is a 'smaller' Freighter. Referring the 'Skill Changes', the Orca will be very easy to learn: Skill Changes Orca

2. Easily, you will reach 260k eHP. That's much more than a Freighter and makes the Orca not really worth for a gank in HighSec - ofc depending on what you're hauling ...

[Orca, Buffer | HighSec]
Damage Control II
Reinforced Bulkheads II

Prototype 100MN Microwarpdrive I
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
EM Ward Field II

[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]

Large Core Defense Field Extender I
Large Core Defense Field Extender I
Large Ancillary Current Router I

EM: 75.9% - 273,642 eHP
TH: 63.8% - 244,357 eHP
KN: 72.8% - 260,710 eHP
EX: 77.4% - 269,456 eHP

3. Without 'expanding cargo'-modules/rigs you will haul up to 37,500m³ (Orca) + 40,000m³ (fleet) + 400,000m³ (ships) + 50,000m³ (ORE). Even with expanding modules/rigs you will haul with a ~90k eHP tank and haul up to 90,000m³ (Orca). It depends on you. The best way for the most of you, would be a reasonable compromise between the fitting i posted and some 'expanding'-modules/rigs.

4. The 'Prototype 100MN Microwarpdrive I' is an musthave-item. In order to bring this on your ship, you will have to fit the 'Large Ancillary Current Router I'. The MWD allows a constant 10sec delay for warping - after gatejumps. For stations, either you use 'dockspots' or you will have to break your Orca under 25% max. velocity followed by initiate the warp with a single MWD-cycle.

5. Don't forget the shipbay. You are able to bring fittet and rigged ships into it!

Well, the only drawback: your cargohold is split into 4 parts. That could be dramatic - depending on what you are doing. But for operations an Orca doesn't fit, CCP was smart enough to give us the JF/Freighter. Shocked
Really, I don't see a need of a 'smaller' Freighter.
I use the Orca for my HighSec-Char to haul my Mission-Running-Stuff ... that's all. And the Orca is just a perfect boat.
Fluffi Flaffi
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#35 - 2013-05-07 14:02:11 UTC
quoOoup wrote:
4. The 'Prototype 100MN Microwarpdrive I' is an musthave-item. In order to bring this on your ship, you will have to fit the 'Large Ancillary Current Router I'. The MWD allows a constant 10sec delay for warping - after gatejumps. For stations, either you use 'dockspots' or you will have to break your Orca under 25% max. velocity followed by initiate the warp with a single MWD-cycle.


Oh no, don't tell this? Now Alphaphi knows it and his world view may crash and he realises he was so wrong all the time. P
Fluffi Flaffi
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#36 - 2013-05-07 14:12:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Fluffi Flaffi
Chi'Nane T'Kal wrote:
The OP's request was most likely for something less expensive - and supposedly more agile - than freighters, to fill the really big hole there is between the largest industrials (44k m^3) and freighters.



Sorry, but there is no BIG hole.

Industrials ~40km3
Orca ~130km3
Freighter 756k-980km3

The Difference between Freighter and Orca is big if you just see the m3, but how often does this make a difference. If you start hauling bigger stuff like 100k you don't stop there. In general it will continiously increase. Starting my production career I used Orca, but very soon I needed a freighter and very soon again I had the need for a separate freighter alt.

If you are in the courier business you may face of course from time to time packages between 130k and 756k, but seen overall this is a total minority! How much of you really use courier services for such sizes and how much hawl that stuff by themselves? ;)
Alphaphi
KASK Heavy logistics
#37 - 2013-05-07 14:14:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Alphaphi
Fluffi Flaffi wrote:
Alphaphi wrote:
Quote:
But you gave me another idea: Hey CCP, sometimes I carry little stuff in my combat frigate but have to change the fitting for cargo expanders. I don't want to refit every time. I can not afford a Crane and T1 industrials are too slow. Please give give me a hauling frigate. I need this for sure! NOW. But please don't think I want this game easier! No, no nono!!!


you're just being silly now.


Sarcastic OK, but I was not silly at that moment!

And now please answer one question, which I find quite good to counter as an example for all your Assumptions and opinions, which are still wrong from my point of view, doesn't matter what you write.

Alphaphi wrote:
my point is that the orca, a ship not designed to do freighting, but boosting and hauling ore from a belt to station are outperforming the ships specifically designed for this.
which is why there is either a need for a ''stepping stone'' for actual industrial ships on par with the orca in price but specialised for the purpose or a change to the orca


If the ship was not designed o do freighting? Why did CCP gave them a big cargo hangar of above 90k m3? Why not just a 40k Corporate Hangar, an 90k Ore Hangar (dep. on skill level) and a 2k cargo hangar? This would have made btw. anything much more easier for the job of being a mining director? Blink

Why did CCP made the Corporate Hangar unscannable? To protect the ore? HAHA Lol They changed this now in favour of Blockade Runners to give them a usage next to low-sec travelling. But why did they so when they designed the Orca?

Why can you tank an Orca higher than a freighter? To protect ore worth a 20 or 30M ISK? HAHA. Lol

For sure there is a need for a "stepping stone" from people like you, who would like to have it easier. I would buy me such a ship as well. No doubt! But is there really a need overall? No. Freighting system is working very well at the moment. Nothing needs to be changed. Your proposal will just make it easier without any positive effects on the gameplay overall (at least I can not see one).

The next step would be to ask for a Superfreighter wich 2.000.000m3 and then for one with 5.000.000m3. You will call me silly now again maybe, but for me this would make the things a lot easier. Don't need my 2 hauling alts to move my stuff from and to the trade hub in several runs. I would just need 1 alt in a ship with 5.000.000m3 and I am for sure not the only one and price wouldn't be an issue!


they gave the orca a large cargohold in conjunction with the fleet refitting feature, it's meant as a mobile base/hauler/booster, so the thought was that the orca would carry all extra gear, crystals etc. for the whole fleet.

the corp hangar on the other hand, without certainty was like that because it acted like a corporation hangar equivalent to the one we have in the station.
the changes made to the orca turned it in to a FLEET hangar, and moving that ability, as you said, to the blockade runners in favor for those!

''make it easier for people like me'' what do you mean exactly? ''people like me'' that have a freighter, that have a orca and for that sake larger ships that actually doesn't need that stepping stone?
yes, the freighting system works fine, but there's still a gap which pretty much ''forces'' you to train a ship of a other class/role (imagine being forced to train in to a guardian in order to fly a Hictor, a ship with a whole other design in mind) in order to get something better that's ''in between''. as someone proposed, remaking the deep space transports would actually work fairly well, especially because the role they have now, are in no way being pulled off correct.


i wouldn't argue for a bigger ship.
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#38 - 2013-05-07 14:21:24 UTC
Boosting the DST seems good to me. If it will happen is a different story though :)
Fluffi Flaffi
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#39 - 2013-05-07 14:42:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Fluffi Flaffi
Alphaphi wrote:
Fluffi Flaffi wrote:
If the ship was not designed o do freighting? Why did CCP gave them a big cargo hangar of above 90k m3? Why not just a 40k Corporate Hangar, an 90k Ore Hangar (dep. on skill level) and a 2k cargo hangar? This would have made btw. anything much more easier for the job of being a mining director? Blink

Why did CCP made the Corporate Hangar unscannable? To protect the ore? HAHA Lol They changed this now in favour of Blockade Runners to give them a usage next to low-sec travelling. But why did they so when they designed the Orca?

Why can you tank an Orca higher than a freighter? To protect ore worth a 20 or 30M ISK? HAHA. Lol


they gave the orca a large cargohold in conjunction with the fleet refitting feature, it's meant as a mobile base/hauler/booster, so the thought was that the orca would carry all extra gear, crystals etc. for the whole fleet.



Sorry to be rude now, but this is complete bullshit. 90k m3 for fitting gears?
When you have to dock anyway every 10-30 minutes depending on size of mining fleet?
When every mining vessel has his own hangar with enough space (pre-mining-barge patch and now!) for fitting tools?

you are going silly now sir! Honestly. Doesn't make sense to discuss with you any further as you are going crazy and use totally absurd arguments just to try to defend your senseless position.
Ginger Barbarella
#40 - 2013-05-07 14:44:28 UTC
Orca.

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac