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Dev Blog: WantToTrade: Tags for Security Status

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CCP Masterplan
C C P
C C P Alliance
#21 - 2013-05-02 15:04:41 UTC
DJ FunkyBacon wrote:
Hah! Who needs lowsec CSM representation when we have CCP Masterplan? Love the change.

One thing though, I thought security status could only go up to +5, but the devblog mentions -10 to +10. Typo, troll, or for reals?

CONCORD standing (like any other standing) has always ranged from -10 to +10. The reason that very few people have it above +5 is because NPCs have a 'max sec status bonus' attribute that is the maximum standing value that they can raise up to. There are no rats any more that have this value above +5, hence there is no way via ratting to get above this value. This won't change in the new system - the rats will still have this limit at which they stop giving sec-status increases.

(Back in the first days of EVE, there used to be other ways to raise CONCORD standing above this level, but those are no longer possible. Hence there are still a few very old characters out there that have such high CONCORD standings - there is no way to achieve it any more, and if they lose it, they'll not be able to get it back)

So, no troll, no typo, definitely for reals. Maybe we'll use this extra headroom one day for something interesting...

"This one time, on patch day..."

@ccp_masterplan  |  Team Five-0: Rewriting the law
mkint
#22 - 2013-05-02 15:04:57 UTC
Farewell to consequences in EVE. :(

At the very least, some of this should be in highsec or something so it's not just a casual stroll in the park. This won't attract players to lowsec on it's own. At least putting the agents in highsec would mean that criminals would have to fly in front of a lot of players' guns before they can "push button receive sec." As it's designed, it's way too easy and low risk.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.
mkint
#23 - 2013-05-02 15:08:10 UTC
Zyrbalax III wrote:
So... where's going to be the best place to sell these tags? Jita or another high-sec trade hub (which might be problematic for the people most likely to want to purchase them)? Or at the lowsec stations where you can trade them in?

As someone who enjoys the odd spot of lowsec ratting, I'm looking forward to this feature!

Probably the same as data center tags. Prices and availability suck at trade hubs, but are okay in the data center systems themselves.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.
Vladimir Tinakin
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#24 - 2013-05-02 15:08:40 UTC
mkint wrote:
Farewell to consequences in EVE. :(

At the very least, some of this should be in highsec or something so it's not just a casual stroll in the park. This won't attract players to lowsec on it's own. At least putting the agents in highsec would mean that criminals would have to fly in front of a lot of players' guns before they can "push button receive sec." As it's designed, it's way too easy and low risk.



Two consequences: 1) ISK cost for the tags (likely not too cheap) and the ISK "handling fee" at the concord station itself. So Cost per Gank has to be taken into consideration if you want to do the easy ISK route.

2) These new rats are lowsec belt only. Meaning you have to be in very obvious places in a PVP freefire zone to try and farm these guys, who are probably going to be infrequent at best. Its an Actual Risk, not something I'd expect a mission runner to understand.
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#25 - 2013-05-02 15:11:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Vincent Athena
Vladimir Tinakin wrote:
mkint wrote:
Farewell to consequences in EVE. :(

At the very least, some of this should be in highsec or something so it's not just a casual stroll in the park. This won't attract players to lowsec on it's own. At least putting the agents in highsec would mean that criminals would have to fly in front of a lot of players' guns before they can "push button receive sec." As it's designed, it's way too easy and low risk.



Two consequences: 1) ISK cost for the tags (likely not too cheap) and the ISK "handling fee" at the concord station itself. So Cost per Gank has to be taken into consideration if you want to do the easy ISK route.

2) These new rats are lowsec belt only. Meaning you have to be in very obvious places in a PVP freefire zone to try and farm these guys, who are probably going to be infrequent at best. Its an Actual Risk, not something I'd expect a mission runner to understand.

Or: The consequence is I open my RL wallet, purchase a PLEX, sell in game for ISK and use the ISK to buy tags and pay CONCORD. In other words an individual can circumvent in game consequences via out of game wealth.

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mkint
#26 - 2013-05-02 15:13:29 UTC
Vladimir Tinakin wrote:
mkint wrote:
Farewell to consequences in EVE. :(

At the very least, some of this should be in highsec or something so it's not just a casual stroll in the park. This won't attract players to lowsec on it's own. At least putting the agents in highsec would mean that criminals would have to fly in front of a lot of players' guns before they can "push button receive sec." As it's designed, it's way too easy and low risk.



Two consequences: 1) ISK cost for the tags (likely not too cheap) and the ISK "handling fee" at the concord station itself. So Cost per Gank has to be taken into consideration if you want to do the easy ISK route.

2) These new rats are lowsec belt only. Meaning you have to be in very obvious places in a PVP freefire zone to try and farm these guys, who are probably going to be infrequent at best. Its an Actual Risk, not something I'd expect a mission runner to understand.

lowsec isn't that risky. Not something I'd expect a nullbear anom farmer to understand. Maybe more risky than the big blue donut, but still, not very risky.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.
Vladimir Tinakin
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#27 - 2013-05-02 15:14:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Vladimir Tinakin
Vincent Athena wrote:

Or: The consequence is I open my RL wallet, purchase a PLEX, sell in game for ISK and use the ISK to buy tags and pay CONCORD. In other words an individual can circumvent in game consequences via out of game wealth.


You can do that now via buying a new character on the Bazaar.

Money makes it all better. Or a reasonable facsimile of "better".

Edit: Its generally not risky, but its also not something you can afk or let you guard down while endlessly grinding for tags. I hope they're much more common than faction spawns as promised, because I've only seen a handful in years of playing.
Sugar Kyle
Middle Ground
#28 - 2013-05-02 15:16:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Sugar Kyle
Now to see the spawn rate. I'm quite hopeful about it. I do hope the tags to get closer to zero are fairly common. It would be a good way for newer players to keep above -5 till they are more situated as well as helping those who so fear sec loss a bit more incentive to taste the sweet nectar of explosions.

Member of CSM9 and CSM10.
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#29 - 2013-05-02 15:17:17 UTC
mkint wrote:
lowsec isn't that risky. Not something I'd expect a nullbear anom farmer to understand. Maybe more risky than the big blue donut, but still, not very risky.


Ad hominem arguments never go out of style, do they. Roll

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary
Sheena Tzash
Doomheim
#30 - 2013-05-02 15:17:52 UTC
Vladimir Tinakin wrote:

You don't lose sec status for killing corpmates. So unless they were on a ganking binge and decided to switch things up with a corp infiltration, this doesn't apply.


I didn't say anything about killing corp mates, but someone could go out and cause enough trouble elsewhere to pick up some unwanted attention.

Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:

...which sounds totally awesome. WHY DO YOU HATE FUN? Twisted


I don't hate fun - I just don't want to see small new corps under threat from players infiltrating corps to cause enough trouble to get decs.

Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:

The bottom line is, killboards still tell the story, and are an even more effective audit method than simply looking at security status. If someone goes around awoxing constantly, as long as the victims are posting their losses, it'll be obvious to other recruiters. I strongly believe that as long as they criminal is willing to pay the cost to do this repeatedly, and recruiters are lazy enough not to investigate killboard histories, than corps should suffer the consequences. This is a free-form capitalist dystopian universe, paying off the cops just feels right and this feature is long overdue.


Killboards are an external tool and not always obvious for people to check; especially for new players and new corps.
The whole thing about checking for AWOXers is comical enough without adding more complication:

http://v.cdn.cad-comic.com/comics/cad-20120625-8bb4c.png

At the end of the day you wouldn't allow a repeat offender into your company or organisation without some careful consideration and if the game / system is hiding this 'rap sheet' then it makes it difficult for people to make an educated judgement of character.
Two step
Aperture Harmonics
#31 - 2013-05-02 15:19:08 UTC
How is it possible that someone so awesome as CCP Masterplan has so few likes? You people...

CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog
Sugar Kyle
Middle Ground
#32 - 2013-05-02 15:21:50 UTC
Two step wrote:
How is it possible that someone so awesome as CCP Masterplan has so few likes? You people...


He obviously needs to both post more and do more low sec touching. Mmmm?

Member of CSM9 and CSM10.
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#33 - 2013-05-02 15:22:19 UTC
CCP Eterne wrote:
Sometimes you just need to do something that's a little bit outside the law. Blow up a freighter, pod someone in low sec, or other nefarious activities .


Someone say NERFARIUSQuestionBlink
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#34 - 2013-05-02 15:25:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Vincent Athena
The "Exchange tags for security status" window shows that you need, but not what you got. It should show your current sec status and how many of each tag type you have.

Edit: "All CONCORD->character standings will be wiped" has a possibly unintended consequence. Some people mine is solar systems where the only station to refine at is a CONCORD station. Having a high CONCORD standing reduces the refine cost. Now you are taking away the one and only way to reduce refine cost at these stations: Have a high sec status. Recommendation: Only wipe CONCORD standings if they are less than zero. Let those who put in the effort to get cheap refine keep the fruits of their effort.

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#35 - 2013-05-02 15:26:25 UTC  |  Edited by: DarthNefarius
Two step wrote:
How is it possible that someone so awesome as CCP Masterplan has so few likes? You people...


Not every1 is a like 'ho... I wish there were dislikes, as matter of fact, so I could collect them & cherish them like U do likes LolP
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
CCP Masterplan
C C P
C C P Alliance
#36 - 2013-05-02 15:31:15 UTC
Sugar Kyle wrote:
Two step wrote:
How is it possible that someone so awesome as CCP Masterplan has so few likes? You people...


He obviously needs to both post more and do more low sec touching. Mmmm?

Don't tempt me to start touching those places. I'm sure HR would have concerns.

"This one time, on patch day..."

@ccp_masterplan  |  Team Five-0: Rewriting the law
Zircon Dasher
#37 - 2013-05-02 15:35:48 UTC
Two step wrote:
How is it possible that someone so awesome as CCP Masterplan has so few likes? You people...


Why would I give likes to people who appear to make raising sec status slower or more of a pita?Straight

Nerfing High-sec is never the answer. It is the question. The answer is 'YES'.
Sugar Kyle
Middle Ground
#38 - 2013-05-02 15:37:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Sugar Kyle
CCP Masterplan wrote:

Don't tempt me to start touching those places. I'm sure HR would have concerns.


Only if they file a complaint and what happens in low sec stays in low sec...

The concord standing thing is valid. I believe one of my accounts has pretty good standing from incursions? Do you get standings from that? I should maybe learn that system at some point.

Member of CSM9 and CSM10.
Rengerel en Distel
#39 - 2013-05-02 15:37:42 UTC
Zircon Dasher wrote:
Two step wrote:
How is it possible that someone so awesome as CCP Masterplan has so few likes? You people...


Why would I give likes to people who appear to make raising sec status slower or more of a pita?Straight


Um, did you even read the blog? How do you get slower out of that?

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.
Sugar Kyle
Middle Ground
#40 - 2013-05-02 15:38:57 UTC
Rengerel en Distel wrote:
Zircon Dasher wrote:
Two step wrote:
How is it possible that someone so awesome as CCP Masterplan has so few likes? You people...


Why would I give likes to people who appear to make raising sec status slower or more of a pita?Straight


Um, did you even read the blog? How do you get slower out of that?



Removing chain ratting will slow down sec gain unless the buffs to sec gains on that rats is dramatic.

Member of CSM9 and CSM10.