EVE General Discussion

I'm sure it happens in EVE. The people creating Sci Fi and role playing it just aren't stoopid enough to put it on the forums to have it trampled by the epeen gang.

Aside from my stunning looks I'm the megathron pretending to be a [insert ship here]. Even have my own catchphraze that people gave me. "Never not Megathron"

I can automatically tell this is a troll post by reading the first paragraph and part of the second one. I play EVE, I even Role-play often as well. And I am an EVE player and I love Sci-Fi, not just EVE but Sci-Fi in general. If you are complaining about the lack of immersion and no story telling, you are playing the very wrong part of EVE and possibly only ever do mission running in high secand nothing else.

And there is a storyline and storytelling happening all the time in EVE, you are acting like the Caldari Navy Titan going down event wasn't ever real and lots of other events.

Please learn more about EVE before saying stuff that isn't true on forums.

The PVE in EVE sucks, and the attitude of the developers seems to be that it's supposed to.

This doesn't bother me.

The problem is that you're complaining about CCP not catering to you wanting to consume "just the exciting parts" of stories. Provided that you're not playing solo, and your story is just "went to mine, got ganked again today", then the exciting parts will come in time; just as they have for all of us.

Just for an example of numbers / dates:

Stories - EVE
The Great War - Jan - Oct 2007
m0o - June 2003
Battle of Asakai - Feb 2013
EBANK - Aug 2009
Fall of BOB - Feb 2009
more stories than I care to count

Stories - books & film
Lord of the Rings - Third Age 3018 (1417 Shire Reckoning) - August - Frodo leaves The Shire; Third Age 3019 (1418 Shire Reckoning) - March - The One Ring is destroyed --- 18 months of "adventure" cut down to a few thousand pages of text, and ~9 hours of film.

Harry Potter -- seven (?) years from beginning to end of the "adventure", with lots of other side-things happening. Condensed to ~7,000 pages of text, and ~20 hours of film.

Star Wars (episodes 4-6) - approximately four years of conflict between The Empire and The Rebel Alliance, condensed to about 6 hours of film.


Now, not every day will be exciting -- I mean, some days will simply end up at "4th May, mined 1,5 million m3 of rock with the fleet". But there are other ways to make it seem more than just the "every day"

for example, if you've got a corp of newbies who're just getting their feet wet in PvP ...
someone did an awesome hero tackle -> "parade" (with fireworks) to give him a new Atron
Someone pulled off some awesome 1 on 1 he should have lost to -> present an award in front of the whole corp
"hey, we're all taking these Rifters and making a run for the Eve gate!"


If they're getting into mining:
parade for getting their first exhumer
parade for mining a million m3 of rock in their lifetime with the corp

Yeah, they're little things ... maybe even meaningless things ... but when you take enough little things, it really adds up.

Hell, there have been times where people have been hard up in RL (lost a job, ****** breakup, etc) and the corp banded together to get them something. There was one guy who we bought a GTC for right after he lost his job ... he was one of the better* PVP pilots we had the next week when we got dec'd.

*"Better" as in "let's undock in our scrub cruisers and try killing these guys!" ... and reshipping if he died. From what I remember, he logged in every day and got enough of the guys fired up about getting shot at to at least have 1:1 odds that entire week.

I hate fantasy and love scifi. So yay for EvE giving me a mmo I will actually play.

And I still love the fact that there are no aliens in EvE, that's a plus in my book.

This isn't a movie, bud. You ARE the storytelling. Try undocking once in a while and maybe you'll see that the gameplay is the narrative, not some amateur author posting his IC blog on IGS (although we love those guys as well ♥).

does it hurt when you pull numbers from your ass?

First of all, great examples in your post above. That kind of stuff is absolutely the heart and soul of EVE. Actually I think PVE iteration adds to everything you mentioned. It gives players more interesting things to do together and, more importantly, it enables PVEers to pursue a more interesting and engaging "career", which they can focus on as a fully engaged member of a community, contributing to emergent content. A rich player environment will not be hampered by adding depth to the world through designed content. In fact it's just the opposite.

Do you guys really just want an empty sandbox filled with nothing but player ships, stations, and roids? Only war, economics, and intrigue to provide any content? All PVE activities being reduced to Pong for money? You want CCP to give us NOTHING in the way of depth to our environment? You want no interesting places or objects to be seeded in the world? You want no stories that aren't player generated? None? How does that benefit the community?

Do you think that by doing your damndest to squeeze the life out of any effort to breath life into PVE that you'll somehow amputate a gangrenous section of the player base that is holding EVE back from fulfilling its full potential? Listen. You. Are. Over. Reacting.

Please. Epeeners. Allow cool things to happen. Stop your boorish oppression of those of us who want to interact with a crafted fictional world to some extent. Open your eyes and accept diversity. You do as much by your condescension and stubborn horse vision to alienate carebears and keep the community divided and fractured as they do by snuggling up in high sec running missions and mining.

There will always, always, ALWAYS be a significant portion of players--never less than half in my estimation--who prefer PVE gameplay to PVP, even if they're fully integrated into an active community in their corp and alliance in 0.0. And that's excellent! If the 0.0 alliances are going to evolve into more dynamic, fully realized communities they need diversity! We want a rich environment full of people busily doing all the things available to do, not 99% of alliance members being forced into either a front line military structure or non com logisitcs.

The "establishment" in 0.0 would be well advised to find a way to create a space for PVEers to be a part of their communities and become taxed citizens. This would give alliances enough money to free their PVP lovers to never have to grind ISK and always be looking for fights. It would also provide a substantial military reserve. Those PVEers could be fully integrated into the community, into the sandbox, all the while simply pursuing their chosen "career." Not everyone wants to PVP, mine, build, or play the market all the time. Some of us want to PVE. We also want to be deeply engaged in emergent content.

PVEers should be encouraged, warmly and invitingly, to come and fully participate in the sandbox, to be part of the story that we're all telling together as they ply their trade. Meanwhile, their trade should get some love so that it's not so ****ing boring.

Here's the "WE": http://jestertrek.blogspot.com/2013/04/fanfest-day-four-skal.html

"One of the interesting statistics to come out of the Economy Roundtable: 50% of all EVE players "play solo", whatever that means." --Jester's Trek on Fan Fest

The 40-60% claim is based on the logic that the 50% referred to above are likely to be very interested in something, anything being done to iterate the part of the game they spend most of their time on.

I think a lot of those players are probably categorized as "solo" because they focus on missions, markets, manufacturing and exploration, so their "career" is pursued in a solo fashion. However a large number of these players are interacting a lot with corpies on coms, including basic socializing, gameplay troubleshooting, and talking about what's going on in the meta. A lot of them occasionally co-op with corpies but mostly rely on themselves. There's not always someone else around (who's willing) to co-op with, especially for explorers since they're itenerate. The point is, most want to be interacting with others as much as they can within what they see as their limitations. The way to integrate these guys into the sandbox is to allow them to do what they do in the context of a dynamic community (division/corp/alliance) in which they are a valued member and one of the moving parts of the whole. That starts with providing enrichment and iteration for their EVE career: PVE.



That's your opinion. Again, probably about half of subscribers disagree with you. You treat PVE as an afterthought, a piece of s*** you can't figure out how to flush. That fact is that PVE is a vital part of everything that goes on in EVE. It's a pillar of the economy, it provides PVPers with targets, and it provides a focus for a large portion of players--a "career"--which not only gives them their livelihood but also gives them a sense of identity and role within a community of players constantly interacting. These people should not be treated as untouchables whose choice of role in the game brands them as "obstacles". On the contrary that role should be embraced--especially since PVE is so vital to the ecology--and we should be discussing how PVEers can be drawn out of their shells to participate more in the sandbox.

If more opportunities for PVE, especially low level, are seeded throughout 0.0, that kind of player will be able to live out there and contribute to those communities. That could very well be the tipping point for 0.0 entities becoming self sufficient "nations" unto themselves. If the shift that CCP Seagull alluded to in the Fanfest keynote is to take place there needs to be a transition of carebears from high sec to 0.0. Most of those folks will probably be happy to take on more responsibilities and risks as the price of more immersion and community, but many of them will still be carebears. Forever. You will not change them. They will fight if they need to but that won't be their first choice. If you want this game to move forward you need make a bridge with these people. That means PVE iteration to that end. And if ANY such attention is being payed to it, it follows that it's quality and variety should be improved.



I agree. As I stated above PVE need not compete with emergent content. It's an activity that players do some of the time within the context of emergent gameplay and dynamic community. It can easily function as a career pursued by players who are fully engaged with others. Some of it can be dynamic, some static. Variety is the spice of life.

PVE is part of the EVE economy. If you take it out, then we'll all be mining and manufacturing to stay in ships. If you leave it in, improve it!! It's as simple as that!