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T2 cap rigs and w-space
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WInter Borne
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#21 - 2013-04-25 17:37:40 UTC
Angsty Teenager wrote:

I personally think a lot of groups in high class wormholes are somewhat deluded.

Your choice to fit T2 trimarks and semiconductors to dreads if you want, but imo right now they're absolutely not cost effective or useful in any way. Neither are useful in pve in any way, and they only offer marginal utility in pvp over just t1 rigs. (And I'd argue that a T2 gun rig + 2 t1 trimarks is the best possible rigging setup for a pvp dread anyway).


What do wormholers care about cost efficiency?

Also, like Jack mentioned, Shield Gank Moro's with memory cells are fun.
Angsty Teenager
Broski North
#22 - 2013-04-25 22:47:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Angsty Teenager
Jack Miton wrote:

you dont run wh PVE do you?
t2 memcells are beyond awesome for PVE.
they are also epic win on shield tanked PVP dreads, also, T2 trimarks are clearly better than T1 trimarks lol, youre not arguing your way around that.


What I mean when i say that T2 mem cells or T2 trimarks are not useful is that they give no significant tangible benefit, particularly with respect to their cost. With regard to T2 memcells, I don't see the point if my dreads literally never run out of cap ever in pve (they are fit with t1 mem cells currently), and with regard to trimarks, I don't think that T2 trimarks are even close to cost effective over T1 trimarks simply because dreads are active tanked, imo cap rigs afford more survivability to a dread with a cap rep (or two) than fitting T2 trimarks.

I'm not saying T2 trimarks are not better than T1, just that they're not useful. The only time I would fit trimarks to a dread over cap rigs is if I had a T2 gun rig, and thus two rigs slots and 100 calibration left. t1 trimarks are 50 calibration each, so I can fit two of them. I can't fit 2 T2 trimarks since they're 75 calibration each, so in this case, T2 trimarks are non-viable. And in the case of just fitting 3x T2 trimarks, in the majority of cases, simply fitting 3x t1 mem cells to improve the time you spend with cap (and thus repping) would be better.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#23 - 2013-04-25 23:06:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Jack Miton
Angsty Teenager wrote:
What I mean when i say that T2 mem cells or T2 trimarks are not useful is that they give no significant tangible benefit, particularly with respect to their cost. With regard to T2 memcells, I don't see the point if my dreads literally never run out of cap ever in pve (they are fit with t1 mem cells currently), and with regard to trimarks, I don't think that T2 trimarks are even close to cost effective over T1 trimarks simply because dreads are active tanked, imo cap rigs afford more survivability to a dread with a cap rep (or two) than fitting T2 trimarks.

how many cap mods and how many tank mods do you run on your PVE dreads and how often do you refit them under fire?
if the answer to these is not 0, 3 and never, then you should T2 rig your dreads.

first of all, PVP dreads are not active tanked, they are buffer tanked, bleeder tanked at BEST.
what part of this discussion has anything to do with cost effectiveness? officer heat sinks probably arent cost effective either, but I still have 2 of them on my PVP rev.
mate, I live in a wh, cost effectiveness never, ever comes into play when im fitting ships.

For the record, CCC/memcell rigged dreads are for PVE. bringing them to a PVP fight is laughable.
they die so horribly to trimarks that it's like beating up children.
(shield dreads are the exception, they should be memcell rigged.)

bottom line is that if you take T2 rigged dreads up against T1 rigged dreads, the T2 rigged ones will always win and there's your cost effectiveness right there.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Angsty Teenager
Broski North
#24 - 2013-04-25 23:14:28 UTC
I run 0 cap mods, and between 1-3 tank mods depending on if I need to refit. I don't see the point in fitting T2 rigs if I never use the cap though. It is literally a non-issue and I cba to spend the money.

Whether or not cost effectiveness is an issue for you doesn't mean it isn't there.

I'm making the assumption of active tanked dreads here, and in any sort of fight where actually using a buffer tanked dread is preferrable, your dread will die and I'd rather lose 1bil less tyvm. (or in the case of post patch, which is what this thread is about, 4.5bil)
I dont troll
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2013-04-25 23:23:13 UTC
WInter Borne wrote:

What do wormholers care about cost?


fixed that for you
Hathrul
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#26 - 2013-04-26 10:55:16 UTC
im mostly curious how efficient the repair and remote repair rigs are gonna be on capitals. might be rather interesting to play around with some new fittings :)

and confirming cost isnt much of a concern. however, with t2 trimarks now being 300+ normal, that would make capital ones 1.5b. not sure if they are still viable then. 1b for a ccc is okay.

capital rigs seem to have been balanced for supercaps and titans. in 0sec t2 rigs rarely get used anyway because regular caps are like throw away things there as far as i know.....shame that the capital rigs arent much balanced for wh space. spose thats impossible
Angsty Teenager
Broski North
#27 - 2013-04-26 17:14:18 UTC
Hathrul wrote:
im mostly curious how efficient the repair and remote repair rigs are gonna be on capitals. might be rather interesting to play around with some new fittings :)


Remote Repair Augmentor Rigs already work on capitals, just not as efficient as stacking cap recharge.
sembur
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#28 - 2013-04-27 02:31:49 UTC
FanFest Keynote clearly included T2 Capital Rigs FWIW.
Svodola Darkfury
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2013-04-29 08:15:58 UTC
sembur wrote:
FanFest Keynote clearly included T2 Capital Rigs FWIW.


Ugh.

The problem is nobody uses T2 Large Rigs for BATTLESHIPS right now, and they're going to add another tier for capitals that are going to remain largely unused except by supers and titans.

It seemed like the current system made perfect sense; T2 large rigs were more expensive and made sense on a hull that cost over a billion ISK (pimped battleships or capitals) and T1 rigs were for normal battleship users. Now it's going to be pay the same you paid before, but for less quality, OR pay the cost of your carrier hull for T2 rigs.

Yes I can afford it; just annoying. #FirstWorldProblems.

Svo.

Director of Frozen Corpse Industries.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#30 - 2013-04-29 13:02:37 UTC
Svodola Darkfury wrote:
The problem is nobody uses T2 Large Rigs for BATTLESHIPS right now,

this is exactly the problem IMO.
after these changes, T2 large size rigs will be more or less irrelevant since theyre put on BSs VERY rarely and even then only a select few.
they really need to make large rigs cheaper as part of this change and not make cpa ones as expensive as theyre planning to.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#31 - 2013-04-29 13:25:20 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:

For the record, CCC/memcell rigged dreads are for PVE. bringing them to a PVP fight is laughable.
they die so horribly to trimarks that it's like beating up children.
(shield dreads are the exception, they should be memcell rigged.)

bottom line is that if you take T2 rigged dreads up against T1 rigged dreads, the T2 rigged ones will always win and there's your cost effectiveness right there.


I'd agree there infact after recent experiences I would go as far as to say CCC rigs should never be fitted to a dread ever if you have the rest of your setup right they won't be needed for cap regen and can be better used for other things.
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