These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Summer expansion SP

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Royal Executioner Shazih
Doomheim
#301 - 2013-04-24 10:28:33 UTC


Quote:
starts thread crying about ship changes you were informed about nearly a year ago.


U are not very smart are u? My character is just 2 months old.

Quote:
had plenty of time to train the skills but decided not to.


see above

Quote:
demands 2mil SP for no reason other than stupidity.


Kid, u should be more polite. Your parents failed to teach u that as I see.

It also shows how limited your world perception. Learn to analyze different points of view. By the time u grow up u might learn or not

Quote:
complains bitterly when people point out your error.


How do u detect my bitterness? Telepathy? More likely just a bold phrase (all your phrases are bold actually)

Quote:
say i'm the one crying.


U are

People are wondering y u are laughing probably much more intelligent than u. But your lack knowledge/experince denies u to understand that.
Multivariate
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#302 - 2013-04-24 10:28:33 UTC
Miles Harker wrote:
Daimon Kaiera wrote:
Miles Harker wrote:
Daimon Kaiera wrote:
Miles Harker wrote:
I read this post last night and found out about these changes for the first time. I immediately adjusted my skill plan, used one of my remaps, plugged in my +4s and guess what?

I will complete all the training to include; BC 5, Destoyer 5 and all racial frigate and cruiser skills before the launch of Odyssey. Bear in mind I'm 3 days old.

So, perhaps if your first reaction was not to come to the forums and complain. And it was instead to investigate the feasibility of achieving the skills within the time frame, like I have, then I may have had a little more sympathy for you.



How did you train the Cybernetics skills to plug in +4's in less than three days?


Or afford them, for that matter.


No offence, but are you really that naive?

Cybernetics 4 is achievable in 3 days and 100M for a set of +4s isn't even a quarter the value of a PLEX.


No, I just see Cybernetics 4 avalible in 2 days 5 hours with my +3's in and didn't think you bought a Plex.

Yes, I'm too lazy to train it to 5 for the +5 implants. There are more important things to do.

Like getting those +5's.


My intention was to beeline the +5S but this change for odyssey changed that.

Of course I'm going to buy a PLEX when im going to get 6m million additional skill points which is what 3-4 months of subscription charges?

You'd be daft not too...


Using +3 implants you'd only gain 350k fewer skillpoints, which is about 1 weeks worth of sub time.

I liken this change to learning skills, you think you're gaining skp by focusing on one thing. However, the best way to gain skillpoints is to enjoy the game so that you don't quit. I've learned this the hard way.

The character bazaar can be used to effectively buy skillpoints if you get good at making ISK.

Velicitia
XS Tech
#303 - 2013-04-24 10:29:45 UTC
I "can fly" all the dessies and battlecruisers as it stands, more because I had to train cruiser 5 for the logi boats. Fact of the matter though is that I don't touch anything except said logi boats, or maybe a Caldari boat that can sport hybrids.

Thing is though, I have no plans (or desire) right now to train projectiles or lasers or missiles, so I'll probably never actually fly any of the pure combat vessels the races sport (although ... the revelation looks badass, so capital lasers may make their way onto a skill plan).

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Arduemont
Rotten Legion
#304 - 2013-04-24 10:33:22 UTC
Just no. Please give up, and stop polluting the forums.

"In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." www.stateofwar.co.nf
Virginia Virdana
RSM Inc
#305 - 2013-04-24 10:38:23 UTC
Royal Executioner Shazih wrote:



Quote:
had plenty of time to train the skills but decided not to.


see above


As has been pointed out many time throughout this thread, if you started now, you would be a long way towards getting there by the time the change comes through and would get some (though not all) of the "free" skill points you seem to want.

If you choose not to, that is your perogative. But stop complaining.
They say never come to a gunfight armed with a knife.   You appear to have come armed with a spoon.
Deaconn Frostt
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#306 - 2013-04-24 10:39:46 UTC
Quote:
Im two months old. How was I supposed to plan it on time?


I like you have an account that is only 2 months old but I will have the training done in time for the expansion.

Not only that but I am a gallente pilot that had to cross train into caldari ships (naga etc) for doctrines and ratting and I will still have time to finish the required training.

Maybe look into remapping to get the skills done on time 27 in perception 21 in willpower plus 2 implants puts me up to 30 and 24.

Instead of trying to give reasons why you haven't trained them start looking into possibilities that will get them trained. By getting these trained you will save yourself about 90 days worth of training on all the iv and v racial cruiser training by my calculations, correct me if I'm wrong.
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#307 - 2013-04-24 10:42:58 UTC
Royal Executioner Shazih wrote:
Hi everyone.
Probably my post will bring a lot of criticism but I want to make a point.
Due to ship skills revamp people who train Destroyers V and Battlecriusers V are going to get around 6mil SP. That is fine.
But players who dont do that will get nothing.

I propose that players who decided not to train the mentioned skill get partial recompensation (say 30% of the max possible skills). For example, if someone gets zero additional SP from summer expansion he qualifies for 6x0.3 = 2m free SP to allocate.
If the player gets 2m SP from summer expansion he qualifies for (6-2)x0.3 = 1,3m free SP to allocate etc.

Some of u will object because we all knew that in advance and could train Destroyers V and Battlecriusers V. BUT while for older players 20-30 days of training is nothing newer players cant afford to spend so much time on 1-2 skills. It gives unfair advantage to older players and players who already have Destroyers V and Battlecriusers V over newer player.

That's why I propose recompensation.

You fail tpo realize that we are not gettign ANY SP? We are just receivign the new skilsl to allow us fly the SAME SHIPS WE USED TO FLY?


WE ARE NOT GETTING FREE SP!!!!

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#308 - 2013-04-24 10:49:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Royal Executioner Shazih wrote:

My character is just 2 months old.
More than enough time to train the skills you're complaining about.
Quote:
Kid, u should be more polite. Your parents failed to teach u that as I see.

It also shows how limited your world perception. Learn to analyze different points of view. By the time u grow up u might learn or not
You should be less confrontational and self entitled, something your parents obviously failed to teach you. As for Dave being a child, I doubt it.
Quote:

U are
People are wondering y u are laughing probably much more intelligent than u. But your lack knowledge/experince denies u to understand that.
Please continue to murder the English language while lecturing people on their intelligence, knowledge and experience. Even if English is not your native tongue your use of it is excruciatingly bad by any standard.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Ana Fox
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#309 - 2013-04-24 10:51:51 UTC
Royal Executioner Shazih wrote:
I see how bad EVE society because I played many games and read many forums. Let's take League of legends. Players ask for sale there all the time and no1 writes like' hey I paid for that char full price, so u have too'.
Even when I bought a char for full price and it was put on sale 2 weeks later I never flamed about it, because I've already been enjoying it for 2 weeks.

But EVE players played EVE too much and so here all I get is: 'EVE is harsh. Deal with it. etc.'
U guys forgot that EVE just a game.


Not true tbh.Let me ask you something since you are claiming you played many other games.

For example you play biggest MMO WoW.You started as let say warrior and you want to be tank.One day Blizzard say we are nerfing warrior tanks Paladins or god know what are best tanks now.You have gear that is maxed on your warrior and you guild says we need more of new best tanks.Will Blizzard give you new favored tanks for free ,or then will say you are free to lvl your new favored tank ?Do you think War Gaming will compensate you if they nerf your favorite tank ,or will give you something free if they change tech tree?You are delusional about those things.

When you are new last thing you need to worry about is how much SP you can accumulate as fast you can .Your priority is to learn mechanics as best you can.Since EVE Is so complex that will take time.No amount of SP and new ships that you can fly will help you do that faster.So by not getting all "great " stuff that you think older player do will not make you any weaker.You even now can make all your BCs up to lvl 4 easy.Do you really think that all players in EVE have all their ships on lvl 5?

New player will always be in position to catch up with older guys,but that is not by default you are so weak.By your standards older players now can start making posts ,how kitchen sink t1 frigate is able to tackle me and hold my few billion isk ship while his friends come.New players can hurt older ones and they do on daily basses ,that is cool?Give me any other game where new player can do that .

Point is when you finish one race line and start thinking about cross training,you will already have enough skill points that will trouble you considering your clone.As much that 6 mil SP looks great it will cost more all players that did that.

Dont be so grim and try to be realistic.
Miles Harker
State War Academy
Caldari State
#310 - 2013-04-24 11:05:31 UTC
Quote:
[quote]

Using +3 implants you'd only gain 350k fewer skillpoints, which is about 1 weeks worth of sub time.

I liken this change to learning skills, you think you're gaining skp by focusing on one thing. However, the best way to gain skillpoints is to enjoy the game so that you don't quit. I've learned this the hard way.

The character bazaar can be used to effectively buy skillpoints if you get good at making ISK.



I don't think I'm gaining skill points; I am gaining skill points and therefore time. Fact.

I agree with you that you should do what you enjoy, not try min/max for the sake of it. It is a game. However, my personal circumstances, work etc. and my "long term" view on EVE accommodates the approach I'm currently taking with my skill plan. But that might not necessarily be the right choice for others.
J1LT
Interstella Misfits
#311 - 2013-04-24 11:05:50 UTC
How hard is it to comprehend that,

If you can fly it before the patch, you can fly it after the patch.

Therefore have gained nothing other than a more expensive clone.


The mind boggles!
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#312 - 2013-04-24 11:13:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Benny Ohu
Miles Harker wrote:
Quote:

Using +3 implants you'd only gain 350k fewer skillpoints, which is about 1 weeks worth of sub time.

I liken this change to learning skills, you think you're gaining skp by focusing on one thing. However, the best way to gain skillpoints is to enjoy the game so that you don't quit. I've learned this the hard way.

The character bazaar can be used to effectively buy skillpoints if you get good at making ISK.



I don't think I'm gaining skill points; I am gaining skill points and therefore time. Fact.

I agree with you that you should do what you enjoy, not try min/max for the sake of it. It is a game. However, my personal circumstances, work etc. and my "long term" view on EVE accommodates the approach I'm currently taking with my skill plan. But that might not necessarily be the right choice for others.

it'll be a boring slog, since it'll limit your play options for that month, but i'd be lying if i said i wouldn't do the same thing
Selene Nask
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#313 - 2013-04-24 11:18:42 UTC
Royal Executioner Shazih wrote:
Virginia Virdana wrote:
Royal Executioner Shazih wrote:
But y I am punished for that? Y I have to spend 4x times more than they? Because I am younger? Newer players already heavily disadvantaged


The only thing you are being "punished" for is your lack of forward planning


Im two months old. How was I supposed to plan it on time?



I'm two month old. I just paid for my third month.

I read about the changes and made a plan. More then enough time to do it.

Naes Mlahrend
Devil's Horsemen
#314 - 2013-04-24 11:18:58 UTC
Royal Executioner Shazih wrote:
Everything posted.


I'm not one to go off and just be a complete d**k but you are absolutely ******** in all you have posted in this thread and I only made it page 6.

Everyone has tried to explain to you, logically, why your idea is complete BS but are so thick headed and can't understand. I feel sorry for you.

Most MMO's evolve for better of worse, I'm not a bitter vet but I've read about some of the things that angered players to no end IE Incarna and I can assure you this will not be one of them. HTFU as they say and train all you can before the xpac hits so you be closer to where you think you need to be.

or just biomass...Straight
Anne Dieu-le-veut
Natl Assn for the Advancement of Criminal People
#315 - 2013-04-24 11:42:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Anne Dieu-le-veut
Royal Executioner Shazih wrote:


U are not very smart are u? My character is just 2 months old.



I see you didn't comment on my post, so maybe you missed it, just don't have an intelligent reply, or are indeed just trolling, but I'll repost it just in case you missed it:

Anne Dieu-le-veut wrote:
OP, your character was created a week before me. I will have all necessary skills trained to take advantage of the BC/Destroyer 5 changes with about 16 days to spare, and I trained enough before embarking on that skill plan that I'm not a total gimp in the mean time. I can even fly mining barges if I wanted to. Your lack of planning does not constitute unfairness on CCP's part.

TL, DR version:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLdBrx-ijwQ


You had plenty of time to train up for these changes. Odds are, you have enough SPs in some of the skills already that you could still get your training done in time if you wanted to. I guess it's just easier to cry on the forums instead.

I'm hoping this is a case of "successful troll is successful" instead of you being a self-entitled crybaby.

Edit:

Correction: I didn't view OP's entire employment history. She is actually 18 days older than me, yet somehow couldn't or wouldn't figure out how to get the training done in time.

HTFU.
Abraham Nalelmir
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#316 - 2013-04-24 11:45:55 UTC
More simple:
I have: (I can fly Coercer)
Destroyers 5

Amarr frigate 5
Gellente frigate 0
Minmatar frigate 0
Caldari frigate 0

What will I get:
AMARR destroyer 5
GALLENTE destroyer 0
MINMATAR destroyer 0
CALDARI destroyer 0

AND

AMARR frigate 5
GALLENTE frigate 0
MINMATAR frigate 0
CALDARI frigate 0

*** I WILL STILL CAN FLY COERCER ***** ONLY ***** ***


If I have: (I can fly Harbinger)
Battlecruiser 5

AMARR cruiser 5
GALLENTE cruiser 0
MINMATAR cruiser 0
CALDARI cruiser 0

I will get:

AMARR BATTLECRUISER 5
GALLENTE BATTLECRUISER 0
MINMATAR BATTLECRUISER 0
CALDARI BATTLECRUISER 0

AND

AMARR cruiser 5
GALLENTE cruiser 0
MINMATAR cruiser 0
CALDARI cruiser 0

*** I CAN STILL FLY ***** ONLY ***** HARBINGER ***

So I'm not sure how people understand that we are getting """FREE""" extra SP!, I'm not getting FREE SP, I'm getting what I already have ONLY

In Go.. ECM I trust
Daimon Kaiera
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#317 - 2013-04-24 12:08:45 UTC
It's probably been said before but,

"Inb4 OP just wants free Sp to distribute into other crap and doesn't give two ***** about BC and destroyers in actuality."

Hell, even I wish I could exclude the gallente and minmatar BC free Sp to put in something else.


But that'd be a stupid thing for CCP to do.

And they won't.

.... . .-.. .--. / .. / .... .- ...- . / ..-. .- .-.. .-.. . -. / .- -. -.. / .. / -.-. .- -. -. --- - / --. . - / ..- .--. / ... - --- .--. - .... .. ... / ... .. --. -. .- - ..- .-. . / .. -.. . .- / .. ... / -. --- - / ... - --- .-.. . -. / ... - --- .--.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#318 - 2013-04-24 12:21:27 UTC
I started a new character today. By my maths, I will make BC V before the Summer expansion hits.
If I am off, it's not by much.
Yes, I am using a booster. Will be using implants, and will be using a remap, then my bonus remaps to get back and do the core skills.

But.... Thats from today.
You found out about this change before today, and probably already have some of it trained. So there is no reason you couldn't make it either at the point you found out about it.

Also, as has been pointed out, the characters do not 'gain' anything. They fly the same ships at the same skills they could before the summer expansion.
Anne Dieu-le-veut
Natl Assn for the Advancement of Criminal People
#319 - 2013-04-24 12:36:27 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
I started a new character today. By my maths, I will make BC V before the Summer expansion hits.
If I am off, it's not by much.
Yes, I am using a booster. Will be using implants, and will be using a remap, then my bonus remaps to get back and do the core skills.

But.... Thats from today.
You found out about this change before today, and probably already have some of it trained. So there is no reason you couldn't make it either at the point you found out about it.

Also, as has been pointed out, the characters do not 'gain' anything. They fly the same ships at the same skills they could before the summer expansion.


I had an earlier post yesterday where EVEMon showed a brand new character with no implants and no remap would take just over 60 days to train, and just over 52 days with +3s and no remap (since +3 are reasonable for even a new player), so in this case, they wouldn't make it. My EVEMon-fu is not good enough yet to compute 2 weeks of +9s in addition to whatever implants you will use, but it will be interesting to see if you make it. However, OP was created Feb 25th, so they had plenty of time, even with no implants.

Technically, I will be gaining 6,144,000 SP. Unfortunately, these skill points will not enable me to do anything I already can't do. All I will be "getting" is a much more expensive clone replacement price.
Royal Executioner Shazih
Doomheim
#320 - 2013-04-24 12:43:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Royal Executioner Shazih
Thank you for responses. Some of you called me moron/thick-headed/fail-planner etc others gave in-depth explanations which I additionally thank for.
Now let me sort it out.

1. I myself (actually training it) might get it on time (or even if not be short like 4-5 days). I hope it is clear. But people who just started or will start playing a bit later wont.

2. Do those who train DD V and BC V gain any free SP? No! Do they gain from newer player perspective? Yes! Let's consider an example:
Let's assume (hypothetically) that US collapses into separate states in 2030. And everyone who was born before 2030 gain universal residency permit (can settle and resettle anywhere anytime within old US) and let's call it 'old rights'. Those who were born after 2030 gain only 1-state residency (can settle only within 1 state). Did anything change for older citizens? Did they get any free rights? No. Nothing changed for them. Do the younger citizens feel the same? No! And guess what? One guy says: 'let's make a law so that younger people can live in bordering states too' (to equal the rights a bit). Everyone replies: 'No! We didn't get any free rights and you won't too"
Do you understand now how absurd your 'I can fly the same ships as before' claim sound?
Let's expand it to EVE.
Let's say we get new skilltree called 'special access'. All current players will be granted all 4 racial trees. But those who start playing later would have to train say Mintamar access to access Mintamar space etc. Did we gat any free SP? No. Does the new player feel the same? I doubt it, because he is restricted to 1/4 of high sec. And again 1 guys says 'let's make at least ally space accessible (Amarr and Caldari for example). And you all again say no? No free SP, right?

Hopefully that clarifies something. Of course here most of players already trained DD V and BC V and dont give a damn about others. They believe that their point of view is correct and absolute. They have right to think so. But I hope that at least some of you will listen to voice of reason