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[Odyssey] Capital Rigs

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Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#141 - 2013-04-23 20:46:19 UTC
Zakarumit CZ wrote:
It was about time, yay Big smile I also hope CCP will in future do some rebalancing around rigs-there are few ones used very often and the rest is just useless, it should be fixed. Also I would like to see some new system with salvage-like using ton of t1 salvage to make t2, maybe even different ones. Something like salvage reactions Lol

I agree.

Salvage are junk "salvaged" from destroyed ships. There is no reason you can not use parts from 20 different damaged components to make one good functional component. I have done it many times working in industrial maintenance. When you need to fix something, but the new replacement parts are not available, or on back order. I often salvage parts from other old broken units to assemble one working unit. When components break they rarely break in exactly the same way.

For example I recently fixed a gear box, gear 1 and 3 were broken in one box and gear 2 and 6 were broken in another old gearbox of the same model. I pulled gears 1 and 3 from the one to fix the other and ended up with one good gear box and one with 4 bad gears.

Or say you have two similar computers. the hard drive frys in one and the ram frys in the other. You pull the ram out of the one with the fryed hard drive and put it in the other. you now have 1 working computer rather than two broken ones.

Using 10 or 20 t1 salvage to make a single T2 salvage sounds very reasonable to me.
Echo Mande
#142 - 2013-04-23 20:52:53 UTC
Meduza13 wrote:
So who is going to buy t2 rigs for anything smaller than mothership? whats the point of creating such thing like t2 capital rigs which nearly noone going to buy?

Offhand I'd say wormholers. I can't think of anyone else though.

Wallet remarks everywhere
gascanu
Bearing Srl.
#143 - 2013-04-23 20:58:53 UTC
i don't really understand why are ppl complaining: it's a logic move, and it was a long time coming one.
t1 trimarks where @15milion/u for a long time, now they are like what 7 mil;

regarding t2 ones, if the t2 capital ones are too expensive then you maibe should not be in one...or you can fit t1 Oops
fukier
Gallente Federation
#144 - 2013-04-23 20:59:31 UTC
Echo Mande wrote:
Meduza13 wrote:
So who is going to buy t2 rigs for anything smaller than mothership? whats the point of creating such thing like t2 capital rigs which nearly noone going to buy?

Offhand I'd say wormholers. I can't think of anyone else though.


tech II trimarks on a vindi with a full slave implant is pretty awesome1
At the end of the game both the pawn and the Queen go in the same box.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#145 - 2013-04-23 21:01:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
Meduza13 wrote:
So who is going to buy t2 rigs for anything smaller than mothership? whats the point of creating such thing like t2 capital rigs which nearly noone going to buy?


As mentioned above they are quite extensively used in wormholes where mass constraints mean your often limited to a handful of capitals in a fight and have to make the most of what you have - also as I touched on earlier the difference between 3x T1 CCC rigs and 2x T2 + 1x T1 can make quite a difference in WH PVP where the amount of neuting you can expect to run into will often be at a level where that difference can make quite a change to a fight.

There are some lowsec entities that T2 fit their capitals to.

T2 rigs on capitals suddenly going into the billions is going to put a bit of a wet blanket on some areas of PVP outside of null - even T1 rigs going upto the 100s of million is going to make a lot of people a lot less likely to use their caps.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#146 - 2013-04-23 21:02:30 UTC
The goal is clearly to entrench the groups with superiority anyway vOv

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Alx Warlord
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#147 - 2013-04-23 21:06:20 UTC
Unforgiven Storm wrote:
CCP Tallest wrote:
Hey

We're putting capital rigs into EVE. Not much else to say, really. They will work pretty much as you would expect them to.

Some things to note:
* Rigs that previously did not affect capital modules will affect capital modules
** (Core Defense Capacitor Safeguard, Auxiliary Nano Pump and Nanobot Accelerator rigs)
* Tech I BPOs will cost 50 Million ISK
* Manufacturing Capital rigs will use 5 times the materials of Large rigs

Questions? Comments?


will salvage drops increase to balance the demand that this will bring or CCP and keep prices steady or will just let the prices go up and mess with the economy?


As we all should know by this point Economy balances itself.

Please read these!

New POS system New SOV system
Haru Kion
The Yeeters.
#148 - 2013-04-23 21:10:38 UTC
The thread is full of silly supercap pilots. Come on, it's called reading.
I can't believe the silliness of people that fly end-game ships.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#149 - 2013-04-23 21:11:17 UTC
penifSMASH wrote:
Haven't seen this many tears about supercaps since before the titan tracking nerf. Keep it up, poors, you are making my afternoon entertaining.



the tears from the titan tracking nerf were worth it though ))

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
CorryBasler
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#150 - 2013-04-23 21:13:49 UTC  |  Edited by: CorryBasler
Moondog Hansen wrote:
My supercap is now worth an extra 4-5bil! :D


not sure on your logic, If what im understanding is true, your super will still have large trimark II's after patch. It will be like when they added small medium and large in and people have large rigged frigates.

Also, i just bought 250 intact armor plates, This patch better make me billions rather then lose billions :P
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#151 - 2013-04-23 21:14:31 UTC
Andski wrote:
The goal is clearly to entrench the groups with superiority anyway vOv

There's literally nothing positive I can think of that will come from this change. Nothing.
Sure Odyssey is an expansion about exploration, of which we have so far absolutely no details. Maybe they're trying to increase salvage profit, but surely there's a better and less damaging way of doing so.
There's no reason to drive the costs up on rigs for capital ships except to make the barrier to entry higher, and there's no game balance reason to do that.

Supercapitals I'd be fine with, but not regular capital ships.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Moondog Hansen
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#152 - 2013-04-23 21:30:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Moondog Hansen
CorryBasler wrote:
Moondog Hansen wrote:
My supercap is now worth an extra 4-5bil! :D


not sure on your logic, If what im understanding is true, your super will still have large trimark II's after patch. It will be like when they added small medium and large in and people have large rigged frigates.


Yea, I still have an inty and a few hacs with large rigs lying around. The thing is, the first time they only created lower value rigs and because all rigs have the same effect it didn't matter the size fitted.

Now it's the same situation but reversed, because size doesn't matter a supercap with large rigs will be worth the same as a supercap with capital rigs, for example:

Lets use round numbers and assume a Nyx costs 20b (hull only). Currently t2 trimarks are ~350m each, so a full set is ~1b. As it stands I can buy a Nyx and rig it (with large rigs ofc) for 21b, lets declare this the current market price.

Now fast-forward to odyssey, Nyx costs the same but each rig costs five times more, so a full set is ~5b. If someone buys a Nyx and rigs it, it will cost 20b (hull) + 5b (rigs) to buy, so the post odyssey market price is 25b. Pre-odyssey Nyxes have large rigs but they work exactly the same way as the capital rigs, so when buying a Nyx you will still pay 25b because it's the new going rate, no matter the rig size because they have the exact same effect. In other words, buy and rig a supercap now, selling it during the summer is a guaranteed 4b in profit (or would be if the prices were stable enough). This means that each supercap (with t2 trimarks) got a 4b increase in market value.

Also I just realised I'm posting with a noob corp char but I'm too lazy to change now.
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#153 - 2013-04-23 21:32:07 UTC
ITT Mynas makes up 15 trillion out of thin air and says we got it.


I for one want my share, praytell Mynas how can i extract my part of this 15 trillion?

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
Meduza13
Silver Octopus
Infernal Octopus
#154 - 2013-04-23 21:35:52 UTC
gascanu wrote:
i don't really understand why are ppl complaining: it's a logic move, and it was a long time coming one.
t1 trimarks where @15milion/u for a long time, now they are like what 7 mil;

regarding t2 ones, if the t2 capital ones are too expensive then you maibe should not be in one...or you can fit t1 Oops



Agreed, no problem , but if set of t2 rigs is more expensive than a ship they are fitted on, (like carrier) makes very little sence, and price/gain ratio is just crazy low.
Sodohm
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#155 - 2013-04-23 21:40:45 UTC
Meduza13 wrote:
gascanu wrote:
i don't really understand why are ppl complaining: it's a logic move, and it was a long time coming one.
t1 trimarks where @15milion/u for a long time, now they are like what 7 mil;

regarding t2 ones, if the t2 capital ones are too expensive then you maibe should not be in one...or you can fit t1 Oops



Agreed, no problem , but if set of t2 rigs is more expensive than a ship they are fitted on, (like carrier) makes very little sence, and price/gain ratio is just crazy low.


T2 rig any t1nonfaction subcap ship and rig price will be higher than ship price, I cant see any problem with this applying to caps as well ...
Quindaster
Infernal Laboratory
Infernal Octopus
#156 - 2013-04-23 21:41:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Quindaster
Welll CCP always add this - remove that. And "server works fine"

For this idiotic patch, now CCP simply nerf carriers and especially triage carriers, because of rarity of T2 salvage and because of x 5 building cost - prices on T2 CCC and other rigs like T2 trimarks will be over 1.5 bill, and noone will be able to fit T2 rigs on carriers, because carrier cost 1.3 bill and noone will use T2 rigs on them in PvP for 3 bill, cos it's stupid.
So only on super capitals will be able to use this T2 rigs but I'm not sure people will use them for 5-7 bill.
And problem is, for this x5 building cost we will have much more less T2 salvage and prices will goes up much more, because whole eve fly now after last cruser patch on ****** T1 crusers and as we know, you cannot salvage T2 salvage from T1 crusers...so for this even for T2 crusers and T3 crusers medium T2 rigs will cost over 100 mill each...

So CCP simply removed abillity to use T2 rigs on capitals because noone will use them for this crazy price.
So I ask, what for we will have T2 capital rigs in this game if they will be useless because of crazy price on them?!

Thank you CCP, like always you nerf absolutely different parts of eve and now we really all need to fly on **** ships with T1 rigs in PvP.

And all this because of idiotic CCP idea to buff noobs on crusers and frigates who still on trial accounts and for CCP absolutely same what players think who play this game over 5-8 years...only important how new players will feel itself even if they will not play after 2 month...
Destoya
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#157 - 2013-04-23 21:41:49 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
ITT Mynas makes up 15 trillion out of thin air and says we got it.


I for one want my share, praytell Mynas how can i extract my part of this 15 trillion?


You see Grath, all we need to do is rig the stockpile of titans that we have on the shared CEO accounts with large rigs now, then sell them later for a massive profit!

That's even ignoring all the money we're going to make off market speculation on large from all the devs PL has in our secret Skype channels. Better get your passport ready for the alliance-wide trip to the Bahamas that's getting funded by dat RMT isk
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade
Ghost Legion.
#158 - 2013-04-23 21:51:14 UTC
CCP Tallest wrote:
Hey

We're putting capital rigs into EVE. Not much else to say, really. They will work pretty much as you would expect them to.

Some things to note:
* Rigs that previously did not affect capital modules will affect capital modules
** (Core Defense Capacitor Safeguard, Auxiliary Nano Pump and Nanobot Accelerator rigs)
* Tech I BPOs will cost 50 Million ISK
* Manufacturing Capital rigs will use 5 times the materials of Large rigs

Questions? Comments?



Please don't have them made from the same things as small, medium and large. Even more so for T2 Rigs. No one outside of the stupid use T2 rigs on Battleships because they simply cost way too much. So please have capital rigs made from other things. So subcap rigs are more reasonably priced.

Don't ask about Italics, just tilt your head.
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#159 - 2013-04-23 21:57:17 UTC
Meduza13 wrote:
So who is going to buy t2 rigs for anything smaller than mothership? whats the point of creating such thing like t2 capital rigs which nearly noone going to buy?


You produce them for your own needs, if you see it necessary to use them for your own pleasure or that of a corp/alliance member? Maybe. You don't have to put everything on the market and make huge profits from it, you know?

R

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Mole Guy
Bob's Bait and Tackle
#160 - 2013-04-23 22:03:39 UTC
heres the prollem as i see it.

at first there were rigs. all were the same size. and for those of us inty/AF pilots who rigged out ships we were called all sorts of names, but they worked well.
when ccp extrended rigs to small/med/large, they made ALL rigs large. that way, no one lost money and anything fit would still work. we started making smaller rigs since they were available.

now, everyone with a t2 rigged super IS going to get a huge bonus because they wont have to pay the rate as the newer pilots just stepping into a super.

before, it was done at the benefit of ALL... now the only ones who will gain this 4.5 bill, are the ones with the cheeply rigged t2 (large) supers.
now, either ALL rigs should be changed to capital, and we ALL gain from this, or ALL large rigs need to come off from being installed and put into your cargo.

then, all super pilots can purchase them as we will have too, or we ALL benefit from selling capital t2 rigs until their supply dries up.

itl totally unfair to favor one group over another or make changes that affect folks in such a way as to benefit some.
just like when BOB was given a lot of the t2 bpo's back in the day...some became super rich from them and we all suffered with their high prices. it was supposed to be a lotto, but we know that wasnt what happened...

make it so everyone benefits.